#instantbird log on 12 31 2013

All times are UTC.

00:09:03 <flo-retina> I'm done closing the broken bugs the scripts filed yesterday
00:14:58 <Mic2> hmm, I stopped receiving bugmail after bug 835.
00:14:59 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=835 tri, --, 1.2, benediktp, RESO FIXED, Addon manager doesn't persist size and position
00:20:09 <flo-retina> the script adding comments in BIO bugs has finished
00:21:30 <flo-retina> Mic2: maybe your email provider decided it was spam?
00:23:53 <Mic2> They're not in my spam folder and an email that I sent from a different provider to my Yahoo! adress went through, so the mailbox isn't full either.
00:24:23 <Mic2> Strange but nothing I care too much about before tomorrow morning ;)
00:24:25 <Mic2> Good night!
00:24:31 <flo-retina> good night
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00:28:00 <clokep> Mic2: I have up to bug 2294. ;)
00:28:01 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2294 maj, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Twitter support in russian locale is broken
00:28:22 <flo-retina> clokep: "We're currently commenting on each BIO bug with a link to the new BMO bug." is already finished
00:28:27 <flo-retina> I'm looking for a way to make BIO read only
00:28:36 <clokep> flo-retina: Well...I was eating dinner, sorry. :p
00:32:59 topic changed by flo-retina to "Ask about Instantbird (http://instantbird.com) here!|Current version is Instantbird 1.5! :) |News: http://blog.instantbird.org/ |Nightlies: http://nightly.instantbird.im/ (for testing only) |IRC logs: http://log.bezut.info/ |Pastebin: http://pastebin.instantbird.org/ | Bugs: http://bugzilla.mozilla.org"
00:33:08 topic changed by flo-retina to "Ask about Instantbird (http://instantbird.com) here!|Current version is Instantbird 1.5! :) |News: http://blog.instantbird.org/ |Nightlies: http://nightly.instantbird.im/ (for testing only) |IRC logs: http://log.bezut.info/ |Pastebin: http://pastebin.instantbird.org/ | Bugs: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org"
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00:42:26 <flo-retina> making BIO readonly isn't trivial
00:42:52 <aleth> Congrats on finishing the move :)
00:43:09 <aleth> flo-retina: Doesn't a redirect accomplish the same thing?
00:43:35 <flo-retina> don't we need a bit of scripting to do the redirects?
00:43:49 <aleth> Move the BIO url to archive.bio?
00:44:09 <aleth> I don't know how tricky that is
00:45:07 <clokep> flo-retina: Yes, should be pretty simple I hope!
00:45:13 * clokep wonders if it can be done in .htaccess...
00:45:41 <flo-retina> clokep: I don't think .htaccess files can parse JSON files
00:45:59 <flo-retina> or maybe I just don't understand what you mean
00:46:33 <aleth> Hmm, searches now sometimes give us chatzilla bugs as well :P
00:46:43 <clokep> I didn't mean parse the JSON, we'd have to reformat the data.
00:47:02 <clokep> aleth: I was planning to change my bio search keyword to search those particular components.
00:47:13 <aleth> Good idea.
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00:48:25 <flo-retina> well, actually I have no idea of how we can make BIO read only :-/
00:48:30 <deOmega> ahem... That's a LOT of emails :)
00:48:33 * flo-retina wonders how much spam deOmega has received
00:48:43 <deOmega> yup
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00:48:54 <flo-retina> deOmega: but that's a lot of email for good news, so maybe you'll forgive us? ;)
00:49:13 <deOmega> the move to bugzilla?
00:49:33 <deOmega> oh no, i am not bothered..  just making sure I am not mising anything :)
00:49:39 * aleth closed his first IB bug on BMO ;)
00:49:52 <deOmega> sory not bugzilla.. mozilla
00:50:53 <flo-retina> aleth: \o/
00:51:14 * clokep plans to start moving bugs on BMO to the new components soon...
00:51:28 <flo-retina> clokep: I assume you mean TB IM bugs? :)
00:51:34 <clokep> flo-retina: Yes.
00:51:34 <flo-retina> clokep: maybe also resolve some as duplicates ;)
00:51:40 <clokep> flo-retina: Both of those, yes. :)
00:51:55 <flo-retina> clokep: I'm also wondering if we should post the updated bug numbers in a new comment in all the "update chat/" bugs
00:52:38 <clokep> flo-retina: I think those are all on https://etherpad.mozilla.org/bugzilla-instantbird-merge-bzapi yes. :)
00:53:00 <clokep> (#5 and #6?)
00:53:28 <deOmega> so my I have tor e-register my userid and pword or just wait for sys update?
00:53:39 <flo-retina> clokep: ok
00:53:44 * flo-retina doesn't remember / is too tired
00:53:51 * aleth looks at the Instantbird product dashboard
00:53:55 <clokep> deOmega: If you don't have an account on BMO you'll need a new one.
00:53:57 <clokep> aleth: Link?
00:54:21 <deOmega> clokep: thanks
00:54:33 <aleth> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/page.cgi?id=productdashboard.html&tab=&product=Instantbird&bug_status=open
00:54:36 <clokep> deOmega: It's a bit inconvenient for you, but this will save us a ton of time. :)
00:54:59 * clokep thinks aleth will enjoy https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/buglist.cgi?product=Instantbird&bug_status=UNCONFIRMED
00:55:30 <clokep> flo-retina: Do you know how many of the bugs are consecutive? :)
00:55:32 <aleth> Hey, that's shorter than I expected ;)
00:55:50 <flo-retina> clokep: I don't
00:56:00 <flo-retina> clokep: but I pushed the map.json file in the bio-merge hg repo
00:56:05 <clokep> flo-retina: Yes, I saw.
00:56:56 <flo-retina> bugzilla@instantbird.org is the assignee for 5 bugs, that sucks
00:57:12 * clokep didn't want to duplicate data.
00:57:19 <flo-retina> maybe we should look into bugs assigned to instantbot, and find if the right assignee has a BMO account?
00:57:23 <aleth> nobody@mozilla.org is assignee for 462 bugs, what does that mean?
00:57:55 <flo-retina> aleth: nothing
00:57:59 <flo-retina> aleth: that's the default assignee
00:58:12 <aleth> OK
00:58:30 <clokep> flo-retina: Yes, I think that's a good idea.
00:58:35 <clokep> We could use the map to go backward?
00:58:36 <flo-retina> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=ALL%20%40bugzilla%40instantbird.org&list_id=9052808 someone (or several people) should spend some time reviewing this list
00:58:51 <deOmega> Cool, done.. have a great evening.  Looks like you guys have some excitement here :).  Congratulations
00:59:01 <flo-retina> clokep: go backward = ?
00:59:09 <flo-retina> deOmega: thanks :)
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01:02:34 <flo-retina> I think I made filing new BIO bugs impossible: https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/enter_bug.cgi
01:02:39 <clokep> flo-retina: = use the map to map from bMO bug to BIO bug?
01:02:39 <flo-retina> and that seems to be the best I can get
01:02:54 <flo-retina> sure, but why do you need that?
01:03:57 <clokep> To find the assignee in the real bug? :-S
01:04:04 <clokep> I'm confused at how this isn't obvious. :-/
01:04:18 <clokep> flo-retina: Looks like only 80 bugs were filed in the time it took you to file all of them!
01:05:31 <flo-retina> clokep: I thought we could just go through them by hand
01:05:41 <flo-retina> the bio number is mentioned in the first comment
01:05:45 <clokep> flo-retina: That's exactly what I'm suggesting we do...
01:05:46 <clokep> OK.
01:05:55 <clokep> flo-retina: Should https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=953446 be closed?
01:06:00 <clokep> (There's also https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=953452)
01:07:12 <flo-retina> uh, 446 was INCOMPLETE
01:07:19 <flo-retina> not sure how I missed it :-/
01:07:35 <clokep> NBD. :)
01:07:40 <clokep> Do we know if idechix has a BMO address?
01:09:26 <clokep> Or  Goulagman 
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01:10:10 <flo-retina> clokep: I don't know
01:10:29 <flo-retina> I guess you can email them and see if they reply/care
01:10:33 <flo-retina> or just don't bother
01:10:47 <flo-retina> I'm pretty sure goofy has one.
01:11:50 <clokep> Looks like idechix had a bunch of stuff assigned to him. :-/
01:14:27 <flo-retina> looks like neither idechix nor goulagman have BMO accounts
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01:20:56 <clokep> There are similar emails for goofy but none that directly match. :-/
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01:31:24 <clokep> I think the rest of https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=ALL%20%40bugzilla%40instantbird.org&list_id=9052830 don't have BMO accounts. :-/
01:31:30 <clokep> I'm sure we can convince deOmega to make one. ;)
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04:16:04 <instant-buildbot> build #1066 of linux-nightly-default is complete: Success [3build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/linux-nightly-default/builds/1066
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05:06:21 <instant-buildbot> build #1521 of macosx-nightly-default is complete: Success [3build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/macosx-nightly-default/builds/1521
08:20:28 <instant-buildbot> build #1216 of win32-nightly-default is complete: Success [3build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/win32-nightly-default/builds/1216
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09:00:38 <flo-retina> I wonder why clokep had to set the assignee to nobody by hand on https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_activity.cgi?id=954182
09:00:51 <flo-retina> I hope there aren't other bugs that had the same problem, it seems like a bug of the import script
09:03:30 <flo-retina> clokep: looks like there are at least 2 BMO accounts for Goofy
09:03:42 <flo-retina> maybe we should search which one he used the most recently?
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10:12:34 <Mic> Hello!
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11:53:37 <Mic2> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=955845
11:55:56 <Mic2> clokep, Even: any ideas? Last thing that happened related to the list was removing the "Hide Auto-Joins"-addon as far as I know.
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11:57:43 <flo-retina> Mic2: that's a usual proble
11:57:59 <flo-retina> Mic2: that list is made by "recommending" an add-on for a fixed amount of time
11:58:09 <flo-retina> so frequently that time expires, and we need to fill the list again
12:03:59 <Mic2> OK
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13:20:12 <clokep> flo-retina: I set it to nobody because that's what bug 748 is. :)
13:20:13 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=748 min, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Separator on smiley dropdown too short
13:21:10 <clokep> flo-retina: Can we add Mic2 to the list of admins in AIO?
13:21:25 <clokep> He can deal w/ the awful UI of adding things to the featured list. :)
13:26:24 <clokep> I fixed it though.
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14:22:29 <Mic2> clokep: I've seen something already that looks like featured lists for the different add-ons categories. I've not the slightest idea how to use that UI though.
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15:01:50 <flo-retina> clokep: my question wasn't why you set it to nobody, but why the import script didn't do it automatically.
15:02:00 <flo-retina> clokep: I've no idea of how AIO works
15:02:06 <flo-retina> (for the admin stuff)
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16:16:58 <deOmega> I have to tell you guys.. My opinion is that if  IB gets a more complete interface for Twitter, it will pick up a lot of users.  By more complete I mean more common functions.   I think that is a pretty good window of opportunity.
16:22:50 <Mic2> deOmega: you mean like direct messages, viewing the timeline of other users, ..?
16:23:21 <deOmega> yes, direct messages and mentions
16:23:57 <deOmega> the timeline of others I would think is not necessary as one could just click on the person's name and they are taken to twitter.com for the timeline.
16:25:16 <Mic2> What exactly do you mean with "mentions"?
16:25:49 <Mic2> I don't use Twitter a lot, so maybe I'm just not familiar with the common vocabulary ;)
16:25:50 <deOmega> there is a feature where you can see under where someone mentions you
16:25:57 <deOmega> that makes sense
16:26:14 <deOmega> under a tab
16:27:08 <deOmega> so if someone  re-tweets something  you said or mentions your name, it will show up under @mentions
16:27:33 <deOmega> of course, it shows up under the feed as well
16:28:20 <deOmega> But if u want to view all mentions,  it is ice to see them under a tab in one place
16:28:30 <deOmega> same thing for direct messages
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16:29:23 <deOmega> I honestly feel it is a huge window of opp.    All the other twitter apps are really inconvenient from my experience
16:30:16 <Mic2> I've never used any Twitter app to be honest ;)
16:30:47 <deOmega> You know.  I was never really a twitter fan.   Just did not get it
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16:31:32 <deOmega> but as time went on and i got more exposure to it, i realized that a lot of the information I wodu be scouring the web or watching teh news for is fed through it
16:31:51 <deOmega> with  brief commentaries that cut out a lot of teh noise
16:32:37 <deOmega> and i have been seeing a transition where folks are leaving traditional forums to exchange ideas on twitter
16:32:43 <Mic2> Are you using this "track keywords" feature?
16:33:13 <deOmega> I have not used that as yet but remember seeing it.
16:33:25 <Mic2> That's what it is called in IB, no idea what Twitter people call it. It will include tweets that mention a keyword in your timeline.
16:33:42 <deOmega> right, similar to IRC, right?
16:34:09 <deOmega> as a matter of fact, for comparison... I was a big IRC user.  
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16:36:11 <deOmega> But the  value there has been diminished by twitter to the point where since I have  upgraded my computer, one of the programs i have not reinstalled as yet is MIRC.  I have not been to an IRC room since (Besides this one), but had to do twitter setup.
16:37:20 <Mic2> If you track e.g. #somethingInteresting, you'll see tweets that include #somethingInteresting, even if you're not following the sender of that tweet.
16:38:52 <Mic2> It's like following a keyword instead of a person. I do that for the word Instantbird for example ;)
16:40:09 <deOmega> ohhhhhhhhhhh!  That is  great MIC.  I should use that.
16:40:57 <deOmega> especially since I would not have to be following the source.
16:41:50 <Mic2> You can add these words in the properties dialog of the Twitter account.
16:43:19 <deOmega> i am doing that now to see if it goes live without me restarting.
16:44:14 <Mic2> It used to need a restart after changing the keywords but it was fixed.
16:44:34 <deOmega> WOW!
16:44:37 <deOmega> THAT is powerful
16:44:39 <Mic2> :)
16:44:45 <deOmega> just tried it out and THAT is very powerful
16:45:02 <deOmega> u know
16:45:06 <deOmega> if that is already in place
16:45:22 <deOmega> then maybe it is possible to then do  that kind of search under another tab
16:45:37 <deOmega> this is really  powerful
16:48:50 <Mic2> I need to go. Enjoy the keyword-feature, I hope it helps! :)
16:49:15 <deOmega> Mic2: yes it does.  thanks and have a great day.
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16:50:57 <flo-retina> deOmega: to be honest, I don't see Twitter as an opportunity at all.
16:51:44 <deOmega> flo-retina: Ok, I suppose I am seeing it through a small window in  my world and so I can respect that
16:51:54 <flo-retina> deOmega: it's a closed network, where they imposed arbitrary restrictions on third party clients (the most annoying/recent one is that twitter apps now can't have more than 100,000 activations). So getting plenty of twitter users means getting plenty of disappointed people, because they just wouldn't be able to connect at all.
16:52:41 <flo-retina> and it's scary that they can just impose such restrictions without anything developers can do about them.
16:53:02 <deOmega> flo-retina: I realized that a number of programs stopped development because they cannot keep up or something like that.
16:53:07 <deOmega> Understood
16:54:12 <flo-retina> it's very unfortunate that twitter is imposing such restrictions. It killed some of the best twitter clients that existed. And relying on having plenty of twitter users is just no longer possible as a startup business model :-/.
16:54:17 <deOmega> realizing that you feel that way is disappointing, but...  :)
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16:54:32 <flo-retina> I suspect their goal is to have most of twitter usage happen on the official twitter website, where they can control how much ads people see.
16:55:09 <deOmega> Their app is really poorly designed so I  do not use it.
16:55:31 <deOmega> but as is, since  I use IB, I do visit their site often.
16:56:00 <flo-retina> deOmega: I'm also disappointed. Supporting twitter required us spending a significant amount of developer time, and I don't see supporting twitter as something viable in the far future. (For the short term future we will obviously keep it working as long as it's reasonably possible)
16:56:44 <flo-retina> deOmega: by the way, you mentioned not reinstalling mIRC... any reason why you wouldn't just use Instantbird for the other IRC channels you care(d) about?
16:57:30 <deOmega> flo-retina: ah, this is good feedback... I needed to know this so I could make different plans or have diferent expectations.
16:58:38 <deOmega> One of my issues with using the other client ... and actually it is probably the main issue but for me.. a messaging client is secondary
16:59:18 <flo-retina> well, you don't need to change any plans because twitter is not a reliable platform. If it becomes broken one day, people will have to adapt...
17:00:31 <deOmega> when i start up my programs in the morning... i have  actually over 30 windows that launch.   Most of those windows remember their positions and I can quickly go to work
17:01:02 <deOmega> with ib, i have to resize and  reorganize each window each time i start it up
17:01:16 <deOmega> it can be done but it is a distraction I really do not liek dealing with
17:01:23 <flo-retina> that's something we should fix
17:01:47 <flo-retina> out of curiosity, have you tried keeping some of the conversations on hold?
17:02:20 <deOmega> if i have 10 IB windows opened and tucked in different corners, they should be there when i restart 
17:03:12 <flo-retina> deOmega: do these 10 windows cover all of one of your screens?
17:04:08 <deOmega> yes i have used the conversation on hold and it does same thing.. they open where the first window  is opened after relaunch or the last remembered position of a single window.
17:04:14 <flo-retina> something I would like to code someday as an add-on is: when I plug an external screen, move automatically the Instantbird conversation window to the secondary screen, and display several conversations at once on that screen; taking the full screen to make as much info visible at once, without me having to click to switch between tabs.
17:04:25 <deOmega> No, they are in different areas for different focus
17:05:25 <deOmega> 'they' meaning the 10 windows
17:06:41 <deOmega> I think, along the lines of what you just mentioned
17:10:50 <deOmega> I am not sure  understand the addon idea.
17:11:10 <deOmega> There was atime before tabs where i woud have all sorts of windows scatterd about and  the loactions woud be remembered
17:11:54 <deOmega> then when  tab 'containers' came along,  
17:12:54 <deOmega> you could have the program remember where some tabs were outside of the tab container  as well as inside, of course
17:13:32 <deOmega> I suppose I would not be familiar with the idea of 'adding' another screen as others that use laptops may be
17:14:20 <flo-retina> are you working from a laptop?
17:14:45 <deOmega> no.  I do not work from laptops..  not enough  space
17:15:11 <deOmega> I tried doing that on vacation once and that was the last time :)
17:15:46 <flo-retina> working during vacations isn't the best idea ;)
17:16:59 <deOmega> haha..   well,  my family and i take extended vacations when they are out of school, so I used t try to use some of that time to work... but now, i just do not bother.
17:18:57 <flo-retina> :)
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17:37:33 <GeekShadow> yo
17:37:47 <GeekShadow> so mozilla agreed to handle instantbird bugs 
17:37:49 <GeekShadow> ?
17:41:42 <deOmega> flo-retina: by the way, the conversation on hold works great in that I love the concept.  .. problem is if i forget to respond to someone  or whatever the case and I restart..  I either have to remember they said something or fish through history to see who may have said what because the conversation is not saved.
17:42:26 <deOmega> so I would have situation where the conversation on on hold on restart but there is nothing in it.
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18:26:09 <Mic-Linux> about addons
18:26:53 <Mic-Linux> Sorry.
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20:37:56 <flo-retina> deOmega: wouldn't Instantbird warn you at shutdown if there are unread messages directed to you in a conversation on hold?
20:38:31 <deOmega> yes
20:38:54 <flo-retina> GeekShadow: Our bugs will be in bugzilla.mozilla.org from now on, because half our code is also used by Thunderbird, and having bugs for this component in both BMO and BIO was really painful.
20:40:06 <deOmega> But there are two things with it.   1.  you have to address it then  and the flip side is if you want to address it when you get back, it would be an empty container which requires you to search history.
20:40:36 <flo-retina> deOmega: it wouldn't reopen automatically after a restart
20:40:50 <flo-retina> (it's something we should change; but currently it wouldn't)
20:41:37 <deOmega> no, after restart it would be docked as on hold, but would be empty.
20:49:48 <clokep> So it sounds like deOmega wants conversations to be restored to the same location.
20:50:10 <deOmega> clokep: yes
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20:51:26 <deOmega> clokep: with the option of some of the conversation  from the history being in the container... especially if unread.
20:53:25 <clokep> I don't understand "being in the container"
20:54:09 <deOmega> so, if i am having a conversation with you
20:54:36 <deOmega> and you tell me have a nice day in a message window/tab...
20:55:09 <deOmega> if i do not read it and i restart,   when the window comes back up  it will show  you telling me hava a nice day
20:55:29 <deOmega> and i will go..  darn, i never responded to him.
20:56:02 <clokep> That's a totally different issue IMO.
20:58:08 <deOmega> what is the issue we are addressing?
20:59:11 <deOmega> I think one is remembering  window position and the other is  remembering part of history
20:59:23 <clokep> Yes, they're totally different.
20:59:50 <deOmega> the part of history was referenced because i was describing the behavior of the 'conversation on hold' feature
21:01:45 <deOmega> *the reference to keeping part of the history.
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