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00:01:56 <instantbot> email@example.com granted feedback for attachment 1970 on bug 1702. 00:01:58 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1702 enh, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, RFE: Allow localizers to ship additional Jabber networks with their localizations 00:13:34 --> chrisccoulson_ has joined #instantbird 00:46:14 <-- Mook_as has quit (Quit: Mook_as) 01:05:07 <-- skeledrew has quit (Ping timeout) 01:07:59 --> skeledrew has joined #instantbird 01:16:26 <-- Tonnes has quit (Ping timeout) 01:17:19 --> Tonnes has joined #instantbird 01:46:55 <-- DGMurdockIII has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.89 [Firefox 17.0/20121010150351]) 01:51:33 --> wesj1 has joined #instantbird 02:15:22 <-- wesj1 has quit (Quit: wesj1) 02:16:46 --> wesj1 has joined #instantbird 02:25:39 <-- wesj1 has quit (Ping timeout) 02:29:21 <-- clokep has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 02:39:48 --> Optimizer has joined #instantbird 02:39:48 --> wesj1 has joined #instantbird 02:42:06 <-- Optimizer has quit (Ping timeout) 02:44:15 --> Optimizer has joined #instantbird 02:45:02 <-- wesj1 has quit (Ping timeout) 02:57:22 <-- Optimizer has quit (Connection reset by peer) 02:58:54 --> Optimizer has joined #instantbird 03:01:03 --> Mook has joined #instantbird 03:27:00 <-- Optimizer has quit (Connection reset by peer) 03:35:02 --> zen_monkey has joined #instantbird 03:44:31 <-- wnayes has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 04:05:16 <-- zen_monkey has left #instantbird (Saliendo) 04:38:07 <-- EionRobb has quit (Ping timeout) 04:51:37 --> wesj1 has joined #instantbird 05:13:14 --> deltafalcon has joined #instantbird 05:27:01 <-- Kaishi has quit (Quit: Kaishi) 05:28:29 <-- wesj1 has quit (Quit: wesj1) 05:28:44 --> wesj1 has joined #instantbird 05:35:13 <-- wesj1 has quit (Quit: wesj1) 05:40:57 --> wesj1 has joined #instantbird 05:42:31 <-- deltafalcon has quit (Client exited) 06:05:40 <-- Mook has quit (Quit: Mook) 06:15:01 --> barlas has joined #instantbird 06:17:06 <-- barlas has quit (Quit: barlas) 06:24:49 <instant-buildbot> build #652 of macosx-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/macosx-nightly-default/builds/652 06:39:39 --> DGMurdockIII has joined #instantbird 06:49:12 --> FireFly_TB has joined #instantbird 06:55:22 --> FeuerFliege has joined #instantbird 06:57:46 <-- wesj1 has quit (Ping timeout) 07:01:08 --> wesj1 has joined #instantbird 07:10:31 <-- wesj1 has quit (Quit: wesj1) 07:25:12 --> gerard-majax has joined #instantbird 07:41:22 <-- FireFly_TB has quit (Quit: FireFly_TB) 07:48:20 <-- DGMurdockIII has quit (Client exited) 07:49:15 --> wesj1 has joined #instantbird 07:51:47 <-- wesj1 has quit (Quit: wesj1) 07:57:52 --> FireFly_TB has joined #instantbird 08:07:06 --> wesj1 has joined #instantbird 08:07:17 <-- gerard-majax has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat) 08:10:23 --> gerard-majax has joined #instantbird 08:22:39 <-- wesj1 has quit (Ping timeout) 08:27:25 --> EionRobb has joined #instantbird 08:35:04 --> Even has joined #instantbird 08:35:04 * ChanServ sets mode +o Even 08:37:31 <-- chrisccoulson_ has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat) 08:37:34 --> chrisccoulson has joined #instantbird 08:40:46 <flo> has anybody ever seen this error? 08:40:47 <flo> Error: [Exception... "'ReferenceError: Interruptions is not defined' when calling method: [nsIObserver::observe]" nsresult: "0x8057001c (NS_ERROR_XPC_JS_THREW_JS_OBJECT)" location: "JS frame :: resource:///modules/jsProtoHelper.jsm :: <TOP_LEVEL> :: line 411" data: no] 08:55:44 --> DGMurdockIII has joined #instantbird 09:00:44 --> jb has joined #instantbird 09:16:14 --> Mic has joined #instantbird 09:16:14 * ChanServ sets mode +h Mic 09:17:11 <Mic> Hi 09:17:46 <-- flo has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 09:20:54 <-- EionRobb has quit (Connection reset by peer) 09:22:07 <-- gerard-majax has quit (Ping timeout) 09:43:41 --> flo-retina has joined #instantbird 09:43:58 * flo-retina is now known as florian 10:04:50 <-- DGMurdockIII has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.89 [Firefox 17.0/20121010150351]) 10:13:55 <-- jb has quit (Quit: jb) 10:15:04 --> clokep has joined #instantbird 10:15:04 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep 10:24:03 <clokep> Good morning! 10:25:31 <Mic> Good morning 10:27:36 <florian> clokep: great blog post! :) 10:27:57 <clokep> florian: Thanks. I hope it wasn't too much of a rant! 10:28:55 <clokep> florian: "Would it be possible for an extension to send XMPP stanzas? Then the extension could follow http://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0126.html" 10:29:02 <clokep> I assume that that's actually something we'd accept in core? 10:29:45 <florian> yes and yes 10:29:59 <florian> I think varuna actually had the code for gtalk invisibility 10:30:18 <florian> I think I removed it during the review/JS-XMPP integration because it wasn't polished enough 10:30:30 <florian> and had no visible use case 10:30:41 <clokep> Apparently Samuel Sidler really disagrees with my post though. 10:31:03 <florian> (the "Invisible" status we currently have conflicts in annoying ways with the automatic status changes related to auto-away when idle, and to auto-offline/reconnect related to the network status. 10:31:42 <florian> who's that guy? Have we interacted with him before or not? 10:31:47 <clokep> He's a Moz guy. 10:31:52 <clokep> I know the name, but not who he is. 10:32:04 <clokep> Right, but isn't the interaction w/ auto-away / reconnect a bug? 10:32:36 <florian> clokep: sure 10:32:49 <florian> but not one I'm motivated to fix myself to add a mis-feature ;). 10:33:01 <florian> we could review patches of course 10:33:03 <clokep> Wasn't suggesting that. :) 10:34:09 <florian> I read his comment twice. 10:34:14 <florian> I don't get his point (if there is one) 10:35:41 <florian> and I can't decide if I'm going to reply myself or let you do it :) 10:38:12 <clokep> I can't think of anything good to say, so if you have something.... 10:38:29 <clokep> The way I see his comment though is that they're "Unavailable" with a status message set. They don't need to be a separate Status 10:38:45 <clokep> I don't think I was clear that this was about /Statuses/ not including /Status Messages/. 10:39:20 <florian> yeah, there are 2 things that you didn't include in your original post 10:40:05 <clokep> (I guess that was obvious to me since we always talk of them as two different things?) 10:40:15 <florian> 1. That typically protocols that support multiple "unavailable" status types are those that originally didn't have a status message that the user could type. (on the other hand, protocols that had customizable messages from the begining never needed these: AIM, Google Talk...) 10:42:14 <florian> 2. The invisible status is bad for 3 reasons: (idealistic) it's a lie, (technical) impossible to get right, (long term) it damages the network by making the presence information (the thing that makes IM more useful than SMSes) completely unreliable. 10:43:29 <florian> clokep: also, you can see that he's a liar and doesn't see that as a problem, as he said the solution to not use the invisible status is to use a fake idle time (!). 10:44:18 <clokep> florian: Yes, but that's confrontational to point out. :) 10:44:28 <clokep> I'd like it if you could include some of that information in a comment ^. 10:44:32 <florian> that he's a liar? :-D 10:45:40 <clokep> :P 10:48:57 * clokep wonders if Mic is still waiting for a review from him... 10:49:31 * florian doesn't know if anybody is waiting for reviews from him, but that seems irrelevant while the tree is so busted :( 10:49:40 <clokep> Nope. :) 10:49:54 <clokep> florian: I am for SIPE, but yeah....tree being busted is more important. 10:49:59 * Mic goes and checks his requests list. 10:50:13 --> jb has joined #instantbird 10:51:34 <florian> clokep: what's worrying about the busted tree is: nobody seems to be working on it 10:51:35 <Mic> clokep: I'm not requesting any reviews from you at the moment. Maybe you missed when I removed a request recently (I think I temporarily had one on bug 435?) 10:51:39 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=435 min, --, ---, benediktp, NEW, Hide "Show custom smilies"-option for libpurple XMPP and MSN and make it default to false 10:52:31 <florian> bah, I thought I r+'ed that :-S 10:53:34 <florian> ah, I was in the train when I read that 10:53:37 <clokep> Mic: Yeah, I missed that. 10:54:02 <clokep> florian: I know. :-/ Are we leaving the Linux bustage until Moz 16 upgrade? 10:55:10 <florian> clokep: is anybody working on the moz16 upgrade? 10:55:26 <clokep> florian: I can, but I can't do the PPC stuff. 10:55:44 <clokep> I'll start doing whatever needs to be done for Linux / Windows tonight. 10:55:52 <florian> the likelyhood of me touching that before Saturday afternoon is very low, and I may be traveling (for work) as soon as Sunday evening (or Monday morning)... 10:56:15 <clokep> Hopefully they send you nicer places then I'e been sent... :) 10:58:43 <florian> clokep: likely California next week, and Vancouver (part of) the week after 10:59:30 <clokep> Yes, nicer. :) 11:06:20 <-- clokep has quit (Ping timeout) 11:18:36 --> meh has joined #instantbird 11:49:46 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout) 11:52:42 --> AlexanderSalas has joined #instantbird 11:56:59 --> clokep_work has joined #instantbird 11:56:59 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep_work 12:00:02 <clokep_work> florian: Were you going to reply on my post or later? 12:00:20 <florian> I was, and got distracted. 12:01:06 * florian wonders why vicnet hasn't resolved bug 1631 yet 12:01:09 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1631 tri, --, ---, goofyfr, ASSI, [fr] fixing vos besoin > vos besoins 12:04:17 <clokep_work> :( 12:10:31 <clokep_work> Was it committed? 12:10:40 <florian> no 12:18:33 --> jb has joined #instantbird 12:25:35 <clokep_work> OK. :) 12:30:13 * Mic has a fix for the "re-order" part of bug 485. The code was there all the time, it just didn't work :( 12:30:16 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=485 min, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Not possible to re-order / detach tabs using the keyboard 12:30:45 <clokep_work> Mic: I'm not sure if that is :) or :(. 12:31:07 <clokep_work> Mic: Set r=me, I think. (Unless it's complicated, then give it to fl orian! :-D) 12:31:10 <-- SM0TVI has quit (Ping timeout) 12:35:09 --> SM0TVI has joined #instantbird 12:50:07 <instantbot> firstname.lastname@example.org requested review from email@example.com for attachment 1972 on bug 485. 12:50:10 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=485 nor, --, ---, benediktp, ASSI, Re-ordering conversation tabs with the keyboard is broken 12:52:28 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1731 filed by firstname.lastname@example.org. 12:52:31 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1731 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Detach tabs using only the keyboard 12:59:04 <clokep_work> Mic: I'll look at that tonight. 13:10:51 <instantbot> email@example.com granted review for attachment 1972 on bug 485. 13:10:53 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=485 nor, --, ---, benediktp, ASSI, Re-ordering conversation tabs with the keyboard is broken 13:29:39 --> mconley has joined #instantbird 13:32:51 <clokep_work> Anyone want to read this as a response to my blog post? http://pastebin.instantbird.com/85793 13:36:14 <-- Even has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 13:41:17 <florian> clokep_work: "this <i>does not</i> not" 13:42:31 <clokep_work> florian: Thanks. I was more concerned at being too much of a dick than grammar errors. :) 13:43:59 <florian> "Unavailable + Idle seems awfully similar to setting yourself as "Invisible"." not sure if your point here, but you probably meant fake idle 13:44:22 <florian> there's no lie in using the unavailable status, and being idle ; if you are really not touching the computer 13:44:46 <clokep_work> "Setting yourself as Unavailable + Idle seems awfully similar to setting yourself as "Invisible"." is what I meant. 13:45:10 <instantbot> firstname.lastname@example.org requested review from email@example.com for attachment 1973 on bug 1674. 13:45:14 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1674 nor, --, ---, benediktp, ASSI, Accesskey for Add-ons manager not localizable 13:46:13 <florian> if it's what you really meant, ok then. (I'm not sure I agree, but it's your comment :)) 13:48:21 --> Even has joined #instantbird 13:48:21 * ChanServ sets mode +o Even 13:48:31 <Even> hi ! 13:48:46 <florian> Even: good afternoon :) 13:48:54 --> lali has joined #instantbird 13:49:07 <lali> hello. 13:49:36 <lali> is the hungarian translator here? 13:50:01 <florian> I don't think so, why? 13:50:31 <lali> guten Tag alle! 13:50:55 <-- lali has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.89 [Firefox 16.0/20121005155445]) 13:54:18 <FeuerFliege> clokep_work: are you talking about http://clokep.blogspot.de/2012/10/on-status.html? 13:54:24 <clokep_work> FeuerFliege: Yes. 13:54:43 <clokep_work> Hello Even! :) 13:55:13 <instantbot> firstname.lastname@example.org granted review for attachment 1973 on bug 1674. 13:55:16 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1674 nor, --, ---, benediktp, ASSI, Accesskey for Add-ons manager not localizable 13:55:27 <clokep_work> florian: I might just leave that sentence out, it doesn't add much and is overly confrontational, thanks. 13:57:02 <FeuerFliege> well i do not agree with you that invisible is a lie, but I do think that Samuel and your main problem is a different terminology. 13:58:44 <florian> "i do not agree with you that invisible is a lie" I would be curious to know what you mean. 13:59:54 <florian> It's possible the word "lie" is a bit too aggressive; a longer version could be "it doesn't reflect the reality of the user's status" 14:01:31 <clokep_work> FeuerFliege: Yes, that's pretty much the main point in my reply. 14:03:04 <Mic> Maybe we should start by defining what "truth" is? ;) 14:03:58 * clokep_work opened a can of worms... 14:07:50 <-- Even has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 14:09:45 <FeuerFliege> "A lie is just a great story ruined by the truth" 14:39:17 <instantbot> email@example.com set the Resolution field on bug 1494 to FIXED. 14:39:19 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1494 nor, --, ---, nobody, RESO FIXED, Port Bug 739644 - provide an indication that an item is expanded or collapsed to group.xml 14:55:16 <-- avidal has quit (Input/output error) 14:55:48 --> avidal has joined #instantbird 15:08:20 * clokep_work thinks Mic is on a tear today... 15:11:22 <-- florian has quit (Input/output error) 15:11:24 --> florian has joined #instantbird 15:17:46 <instantbot> firstname.lastname@example.org granted feedback for attachment 1974 on bug 1608. 15:17:48 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1608 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Replace "buddy" with "contact" in user-facing strings 15:28:47 <instantbot> email@example.com requested review from florian@instantbird .org for attachment 1975 on bug 1658. 15:28:51 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1658 nor, --, ---, aletheia2, ASSI, Improve keyboard accessibility of the contact list 15:31:04 --> Even has joined #instantbird 15:31:04 * ChanServ sets mode +o Even 15:54:30 <-- wesj has quit (Connection reset by peer) 16:07:26 --> wesj has joined #instantbird 16:11:19 <-- jb has quit (Input/output error) 16:11:22 --> jb has joined #instantbird 16:32:36 <-- AlexanderSalas has quit (Connection reset by peer) 16:42:22 --> AlexanderSalas has joined #instantbird 16:43:26 <-- FeuerFliege has quit (Ping timeout) 16:43:26 <-- FireFly_TB has quit (Ping timeout) 16:45:49 --> Mook_as has joined #instantbird 16:50:24 --> FeuerFliege has joined #instantbird 16:50:24 --> FireFly_TB has joined #instantbird 17:17:59 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout) 17:25:23 --> deOmega has joined #instantbird 17:25:57 <deOmega> Hi, I have a problem . 17:26:03 <deOmega> jk :) 17:26:39 <clokep_work> Hello deOmega. 17:26:55 <deOmega> clokep_work: How have you been? 17:27:06 <clokep_work> deOmega: Busy, how're you? 17:27:43 <deOmega> doing alright. Been somewhat distracted moving (Still in the process), but doing kay. 17:28:09 <deOmega> and her sister. sorry i meant doing Okay 17:29:42 <clokep_work> Right. 17:29:50 <clokep_work> Really no problems? :P 17:33:02 <deOmega> haha, nope 17:33:12 <deOmega> I have not been using teh beta actually 17:33:21 <clokep_work> Good. :) So you're on 1.2 then? 17:33:26 <clokep_work> I hope you found some of the changes useful! 17:33:47 <deOmega> yes I am on 1.2 official 17:34:22 <deOmega> yes, it is working fine for me 17:34:29 <clokep_work> Excellent! :) 17:34:58 <Mic> Hi deOmega :) 17:35:28 <deOmega> Mic: Hi mic.. Long time 17:35:55 <Mic> Indeed 17:39:40 <florian> hi :) 17:41:10 * clokep_work wonders how we did anything w/o the read marker... 17:45:03 * Mook_as looks for somebody to prod about bug 760762 17:47:18 <florian> Mook_as: say at least the title of the bug? ;) 17:49:54 <Mook_as> oh, it's the read marker bug :) 17:50:07 <Mook_as> (where it does not appear to exist in thunderbird) 17:50:47 <Mic> Wrong channel then? :P 17:51:39 * florian wonders if Mook needs a Get Instantbird link :-P 18:06:42 --> aleth has joined #instantbird 18:06:42 * ChanServ sets mode +h aleth 18:07:17 <deOmega> florian: Hi flo 18:08:05 <deOmega> I will catch you guys later. good luck as usual 18:08:27 <-- deOmega has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2 -- http://www.instantbird.com) 18:13:09 <-- florian has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 18:13:52 <-- aleth has quit (Quit: Au revoir) 18:13:54 --> aleth has joined #instantbird 18:13:54 * ChanServ sets mode +h aleth 18:41:50 <instantbot> firstname.lastname@example.org set the Resolution field on bug 409 to WORKSFORME. 18:41:53 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=409 nor, --, ---, nobody, RESO WORKSFORME, [Accessibility] Chat partner status changes (typing, away, etc.) are not accessible 18:42:34 <clokep_work> aleth: Do you actually know that that works? 18:43:10 <clokep_work> Or just that it seems like it's been fixed via other bugs? 18:43:56 <aleth> No, I can't test it. I get the impression that it's been fixed from the comments and other bugs, and the lack of response to a recent question. So I thought WFM would be appropriate (and lead to complaints if wrong ;) ) 18:44:19 <aleth> The bug was certainly not invalid or wontfix... 18:44:45 <clokep_work> That's what I thought. :) 18:44:59 <clokep_work> Just wanted to make sure. 18:45:02 <clokep_work> Thanks for the info (and work!) 18:45:31 <aleth> Just went through the unconfirmed list in the lunch break... ;) 18:45:41 <clokep_work> Looks like bug 9 is our last 1 digit bug! ;) 18:45:49 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9 enh, P5, ---, nobody, NEW, Support of file transfers 18:46:02 <aleth> How appropriate :D 18:47:04 * aleth is surprised it wasn't filed by EionR obb 18:47:33 <clokep_work> Hahah. 18:47:39 <clokep_work> You'd think. :) 18:47:40 <clokep_work> But nope. 18:48:22 <aleth> Do we have a convention for OR in the /help command syntax descriptions? 18:48:48 <aleth> i.e. for (this parameter) OR (that one) 18:49:02 <clokep_work> | is usually used, I think. 18:49:05 <clokep_work> Example? 18:49:47 <aleth> Fixing bug 1697 (turns out there is nothing much to do actually, unless I am forgetting something) 18:49:51 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1697 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Update /mode command syntax 18:50:01 <clokep_work> It's just a string change, yes. 18:50:11 <aleth> Yup. 18:50:14 <clokep_work> What're you trying to change it to? :) 18:50:23 <clokep_work> (From mode [<channel>] [(+|-)<new mode>] [<nick>]: Set or unset a channel or user mode.) 18:50:26 <aleth> Still considering. 18:50:38 <aleth> Annoyingly, one can't use %S twice. 18:50:56 <clokep_work> What? 18:51:21 <aleth> (twice in the same localised string) 18:51:40 <clokep_work> Doesn't it really just need to say mode [<channel>] [(+|-)<new mode>] [<parameters>]? 18:52:25 <aleth> That's the minimalist option... also rather unhelpful. 18:52:53 <clokep_work> :P 18:53:05 <clokep_work> aleth: You really just need to make it so it'll tab complete with help text... 18:53:30 <clokep_work> So if I type /mode<space> it'll show (already highlighted) the current channel name or something. 18:53:46 <aleth> :D 18:53:56 <clokep_work> zsh style completions. ;) 18:54:02 <aleth> That would almost work if /mode wasn't so overloaded ;) 18:54:33 <clokep_work> Some of the bits of it you can do other ways. 18:54:38 <clokep_work> op/voice/hop. 18:54:41 <clokep_work> Maybe ban. 18:56:09 <Mook_as> aleth: %1$S doesn't work? 18:56:15 <aleth> Really if I type /mode<space> and pause for more than half a second, it might as well auto-open a suitable webpage 18:56:47 <aleth> listing all the cryptic combinations 18:57:53 <aleth> Mook_as: good idea! 18:57:54 * Mook_as was going to say "popup panel" then realized that would cover the most recently said thing in the channel and is therefore bad 18:58:08 <aleth> That actually works 18:58:17 <aleth> (i.e. can be repeated) 18:58:32 <Mic> What about a transparent panel with an animated dog that asks if the user needs help? :P 18:58:42 <Mic> scnr 18:59:02 <aleth> Mic: that might actually be worth it just for the responses ;) 19:05:01 --> Mnyromyr has joined #instantbird 19:09:56 <aleth> clokep_work: How's this? https://i.minus.com/jNVijt3TJEi7u.png 19:12:00 <clokep_work> aleth: does /mode <nick> work? 19:12:43 <aleth> Nope. :/ I just thought it did. 19:13:18 <clokep_work> IIRC you can't query the mode of another nick. 19:13:31 <clokep_work> Unless you mean the mode of that nick in the current channel? 19:14:02 <aleth> That doesn't work either though. 19:14:25 <aleth> Not that it's necessary really, as we already show that info 19:14:48 <aleth> I guess I can just drop the "display" line then even though it works for the channel mode 19:15:32 <clokep_work> Right. 19:15:36 * clokep_work still hates that command. 19:15:44 * aleth agrees 19:17:15 <-- AlexanderSalas has quit (Ping timeout) 19:17:25 --> AlexanderSalas has joined #instantbird 19:18:48 <aleth> Do we actually have a bug filed for user mode (221) 19:18:57 <clokep_work> I think so. 19:23:38 <clokep_work> aleth: I'd be fine closing bug 1419 once 221 is handled. 19:23:42 <clokep_work> I think the other ones have bugs on file. 19:23:47 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1419 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Add the remaining missing MODE responses 19:25:05 <aleth> I completely missed that 221 was mentioned in the bug description :S 19:28:23 <instantbot> email@example.com requested review from firstname.lastname@example.org for attachment 1977 on bug 1697. 19:28:27 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1697 nor, --, ---, aletheia2, ASSI, Update /mode command syntax 19:30:57 <aleth> There never seems an end to papercuts :-/ 19:34:12 <-- Mic has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 19:34:37 --> Mic has joined #instantbird 19:34:37 * ChanServ sets mode +h Mic 19:35:38 <aleth> clokep_work: Would you like to see that added to the string? 19:35:59 <clokep_work> aleth: Do you think it makes it too complicated? 19:36:05 <-- Mic has quit (Input/output error) 19:36:38 <aleth> I think it's a tradeoff, but I'm OK either way I think. 19:36:48 <aleth> Just seems an obscure use case. 19:36:52 <clokep_work> Please add it. 19:37:02 <clokep_work> I don't know... 19:37:29 <aleth> Yay, I can take a peek at the mode of #developers without joining... ;) 19:37:45 --> soapyhamhocks has joined #instantbird 19:38:02 --> Mic has joined #instantbird 19:38:02 * ChanServ sets mode +h Mic 19:38:59 <aleth> But I like your suggestion as it's minimally more complicated. 19:40:49 <instantbot> email@example.com cancelled review?(firstname.lastname@example.org) for attachment 1977 on bug 1697. 19:40:50 <instantbot> email@example.com requested review from firstname.lastname@example.org for attachment 1978 on bug 1697. 19:40:51 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1697 nor, --, ---, aletheia2, ASSI, Update /mode command syntax 19:41:05 <-- Mic has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 19:41:15 --> Mic has joined #instantbird 19:41:15 * ChanServ sets mode +h Mic 19:43:06 <Mic> Is there any other popular keyword than #fail on Twitter? 19:43:47 <aleth> 'the'? 19:44:47 <-- clokep_work has quit (Ping timeout) 19:45:04 <aleth> or maybe people drop that from tweets actually... 19:45:59 <Mic> It's OK, "the" and "#fail" worked fine 19:46:17 <Mic> http://i.imgur.com/oC17d.png 19:48:05 <Mic> Wasn't difficult at all. A bit hackish at the moment (re-defining title and name getters after creating a conversation) but beside that ... 19:49:42 <aleth> That's a busy timeline ;) 19:50:59 <Mic> The interesting part is "#fail" and "the" having their own conversations 19:51:24 <aleth> Yup :) 19:51:58 <aleth> I don't use that feature, so I'm not sure if that should be optional or not 19:53:04 <FeuerFliege> Mic: how did you managed to get separate streams for your tags? 19:53:17 <aleth> FeuerFliege: he coded it up ;) 19:53:26 <FeuerFliege> ah ......... 19:53:29 <FeuerFliege> nice! 19:53:38 <Mic> And it was less than 15 lines of code as it turned out. 19:53:51 <FeuerFliege> which bug is it? 19:54:56 <Mic> bug 1872 19:55:00 <Mic> bug 1782 19:55:05 --> unghost has joined #instantbird 19:55:14 <Mic> pah 19:55:17 <Mic> bug 1728 19:55:21 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1728 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Show mentions of tracked keywords in own conversations 19:55:40 <Mic> Maybe it's even a duplicate 19:55:42 <FeuerFliege> hey instantbot is tired 19:55:58 <Mic> No, it's me using wrong bugnumbers 19:56:01 <Mic> gtg 19:56:07 <Mic> have a nice evening 19:56:22 <FeuerFliege> bye! 19:56:30 <-- soapyhamhocks has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 19:56:57 <-- Mic has quit (Connection reset by peer) 19:58:54 <instantbot> email@example.com requested review from firstname.lastname@example.org for attachment 1979 on bug 1702. 19:58:57 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1702 enh, --, ---, unghost, ASSI, Add VKontakte protocol 19:59:11 --> FeuerFliege1 has joined #instantbird 19:59:56 <-- FireFly_TB has quit (Ping timeout) 19:59:56 <-- FeuerFliege has quit (Ping timeout) 20:02:14 --> soapyhamhocks has joined #instantbird 20:02:14 * FeuerFliege1 is now known as FeuerFliege 20:05:02 --> flo-retina has joined #instantbird 20:06:18 * flo-retina is now known as florian 20:10:56 <-- FeuerFliege has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 20:20:42 --> EionRobb has joined #instantbird 20:42:22 <-- AlexanderSalas has quit (Ping timeout) 20:42:48 --> wesj1 has joined #instantbird 20:44:44 --> Kaishi has joined #instantbird 20:46:34 --> AlexanderSalas has joined #instantbird 20:48:23 --> jb has joined #instantbird 20:48:49 --> sabret00the_ has joined #instantbird 20:49:27 --> sabret00the__ has joined #instantbird 20:49:36 <-- sabret00the has quit (Ping timeout) 20:50:46 <-- sabret00the_ has quit (Ping timeout) 20:52:52 <florian> aleth: "18:50:38 <aleth> Annoyingly, one can't use %S twice." what does that mean? 20:53:12 <florian> bah, I should read the whole log before asking questions :( 20:59:01 <Mook_as> it means you need to read more of the log ;) 21:00:19 <florian> unghost: in bug 1702 comment 13 you mentioned sending a permission letter by email, who have you sent it to? clokep? (I would suggest team AT instantbird DOT org for such a thing) 21:00:21 <florian> Mook_as: :-P 21:00:22 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1702 enh, --, ---, unghost, ASSI, Add VKontakte protocol 21:12:01 <unghost> florian, done 21:16:35 <-- Mnyromyr has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [SeaMonkey 1.1.19/2010030105]) 21:17:34 <florian> unghost: thanks! :) 21:17:36 <-- AlexanderSalas has quit (Quit: Goodbye - as-salamu 3alaykum) 21:28:47 <-- wesj1 has quit (Ping timeout) 21:32:06 <-- mconley has quit (Input/output error) 21:35:33 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout) 21:36:49 <-- unghost has quit (Quit: Ð£Ñ Ð¾Ð¶Ñ Ñ Ð¾Ñ Ð²Ð°Ñ (xchat 2.4.5 Ð¸Ð»Ð¸ ÑÑÐ°ÑÑÐµ)) 22:13:01 <-- florian has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 22:16:57 <-- aleth has quit (Quit: Au revoir) 22:20:44 --> flo has joined #instantbird 22:20:45 * ChanServ sets mode +qo flo flo 22:21:32 <flo> heh, it looks like EionRobb tweeted that https://twitter.com/mohaneds/status/258562840607203328 ;) 22:21:45 <EionRobb> hahaha 22:22:36 <flo> I think we are likely to have WebRTC file transfers before MSN file transfer :-D 22:51:17 --> clokep has joined #instantbird 22:51:17 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep 22:58:13 <clokep> Mic: Yes, I think that separate conversations should be an option. 22:58:29 <clokep> And aleth: I don't think you need a separate stream, you just need to check the tracked keywords bit in the JSON response. 23:00:01 <clokep> flo: WebRTC file transfers look reasonable? 23:00:12 <clokep> (I'm taking "WebRTC" to mean XMPP btw.) 23:01:12 <flo> clokep: in this context, I think I meant more "P2P" than XMPP 23:02:05 <clokep> Ah-ha! 23:02:09 <clokep> MSN goes through a proxy? 23:02:17 <EionRobb> can do 23:02:36 <flo> clokep: so the best candidate is obviously XMPP 23:02:43 <clokep> IRC!!! 23:02:51 <flo> clokep: but if you want to do some custom ft stuff on IRC, we could make it work 23:03:05 <clokep> "custom" meaning "not compatible w/ DCC"? 23:03:10 <flo> clokep: if you support efficient ft on IRC, we could as well add webcam support there ;) 23:03:26 <clokep> flo: There's a specification for that, believe it or not... 23:03:31 <flo> clokep: I've no idea of how DCC is supposed to work 23:03:42 <clokep> Me neither. :) 23:03:45 <clokep> I mean I have /some/ idea. 23:03:48 <flo> clokep: but I suspect it's an older technology than what's used for WebRTC 23:03:49 <clokep> But it's been a while. 23:04:15 <flo> clokep: "flo: There's a specification for that, believe it or not..." do you mean there's _only_ one? 23:04:21 <EionRobb> nah, just use http file link thingee and be done with it ;) 23:04:27 <clokep> flo: Actually...I think there is /only/ one. :) 23:04:43 * clokep debates r-ing aleth's patch after he said it looked good. :-/ 23:04:59 <flo> EionRobb: that's the fallback! 23:05:22 <EionRobb> who needs a fallback when that's good enough 23:05:38 <flo> oh, wait, we can use that for video too! 23:06:04 <flo> when starting the audio/video session, send an http link with a known format 23:07:01 <flo> the link would contain all the required data to start the negotiation. Either the web page can do it through webrtc (assuming the receiver has either Firefox or Chrome), or the client on the other side is Instantbird (or Thunderbird) and can catch it to "do the right thing" 23:07:29 <clokep> :) Sounds promising. 23:07:34 <clokep> Guess those docs you've been reading are helpful? 23:07:56 <Mook_as> pretty sure DCC file transfers have a "specification" in the form of mIRC.exe :p 23:08:09 <Mook_as> (ask Silver about resuming some time) 23:08:23 <clokep> Mook_as: No, he's just a jerk no matter what you ask him. 23:08:39 <clokep> Also mIRC breaks like every spec out there. :( 23:08:41 <Mook_as> ... and that can't be amusing? 23:09:12 <flo> "those docs you've been reading are helpful?" I'm not reading them nearly fast enough ;). 23:09:20 <instantbot> email@example.com granted review for attachment 1978 on bug 1697. 23:09:23 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1697 nor, --, ---, aletheia2, ASSI, Update /mode command syntax 23:09:30 * Mook_as thinks Silver's just... disillusioned from attempting interop with things like various mozilla versions and IRC clients. 23:09:55 <clokep> Mook_as: AFAIK Instantbird is compatible w/ all other IRC clients. 23:10:01 * clokep waits for Mook to file bugs... 23:10:11 <clokep> flo: I imagine you'll learn them like I know RFCs. :P 23:10:17 <flo> Mook_as: isn't that the guy who tries to keep his code compatible with Mozilla 1.4 (or even earlier) and current trunk at the same time? 23:10:37 <Mook_as> yep, though I think he gave up and is closer to 1.8 or 1.9 these days 23:10:43 <flo> clokep: not sure, I won't be doing low level stuff. 23:11:14 * clokep finds that ridiculous. 23:11:30 <flo> Mook_as: you mean he dropped Firefox 1.0?!?! 23:11:48 <flo> (for those who are too young to remember, Firefox 1.0 was on Mozilla 1.7.5) 23:11:55 <Mook_as> he's not Neil running Netscape 6 for IRC, you know ;) 23:12:23 <flo> err... what?!? 23:12:24 <Mook_as> oh, sorry, netscape 7. http://quotes.burntelectrons.org/6416 23:12:56 <clokep> Yeah Firefox 1....those were the days. 23:13:08 <clokep> Mook_as: I think he should update to Thunderbird. ;) 23:14:40 * flo is trying to remember what netscape 7 was 23:14:56 <flo> is that the version based on Mozilla 1.0? 23:15:14 <clokep> flo: Is WebRTC point-to-point only or can it do multiple people too? 23:15:36 <flo> clokep: yes to both parts :-P 23:16:10 <EionRobb> that was an "or" not an "xor" so the correct answer was "true" :P 23:16:18 <flo> you can send as many streams as you want to as many people as you want 23:16:26 <Mook_as> hmm. yeah, I think 6 was 0.9-something, and 7 was 1.0 23:16:34 <Mook_as> (and 5 was 404) 23:16:51 <clokep> flo: So you can have multiple people all chatting w/ one another as long as your app negotiates it. 23:18:51 <flo> clokep: webrtc does 3 things: 1. giving you access to webcam/microphone 2. Providing easy access to encoding/decoding of these medias (ie codecs, ...). 3. Making it super simple to establish a direct connection between 2 browsers (ie NAT traversal, etc...) 23:19:03 <clokep> Ah, nice. :) 23:19:19 <flo> clokep: everything else is up to the consumers of the API 23:19:52 <flo> clokep: also, 3. is done in a way that's directly inspired from the Jingle XMPP specification, so I have some good hopes that it's going to do just what we need for XMPP. 23:20:40 <clokep> :) flo that sounds wonderful! 23:21:06 <-- meh has quit (Quit: I don't want to live on this planet anymore.) 23:21:06 <clokep> We can have video meetings then. ;) 23:21:25 <flo> clokep: the only real difference seems to be that the data exchanged during the negociation isn't serialized to XML 23:21:56 <flo> clokep: so we will probably need to parse that and convert it to XML to send it to the XMPP server, and then back in the other way to give it back to the WebRTC API 23:23:32 <flo> clokep: ":) flo that sounds wonderful!" it does! But it's also still a bit theoretical. The spec is still under heavy discussions, and the API still keeps changing. 23:23:56 <clokep> Ah. I see. :( 23:25:11 <Mook_as> how different is it from, say, SIP, or whatever it is people use for telephony these days? (is h.263 still a thing?) 23:25:18 <flo> clokep: I think we can hope that it will be possible to play with it in Instantbird nightlies in the timeframe of Gecko 20 23:25:40 <flo> clokep: we can of course start playing before, but the code will be likely to bitrot quickly 23:26:03 <flo> Mook_as: it's available in the browser, to all websites 23:26:26 <flo> Mook_as: and we only need JS code to use it! 23:26:36 <clokep> flo: OK, I assume we need to at least update to 17 or 18? 23:26:48 <clokep> flo: Are we satisified with the license on thos vk icons? 23:26:53 <flo> clokep: I think we want to update to 16 asap 23:27:07 <clokep> flo: I'm about to work on it 50% for the rest of the night. 23:27:12 <flo> clokep: we can't update to 17 until the PPC machine has been retired and replaced 23:28:16 <flo> clokep: I think a BSD license is OK, yes 23:28:34 <clokep> flo: I think so too. ;) 23:28:45 <Mook_as> no, I meant in terms of ib doing interop to existing clients :) 23:29:04 <flo> Mook_as: so for XMPP we plan to follow the spec 23:29:25 <Mook_as> right, that's... sane ;) 23:29:54 <flo> so that should be compatible with existing implementations 23:29:57 <Mook_as> and for skype, they hate everybody so it's running it in the background or bust, so no point thinking about it 23:30:01 <flo> but I don't see how that relates to SIP 23:31:12 <clokep> flo: I got a <temporary-auth-failure xmlns="urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:xmpp-sasl"/> failure when trying to connect to vk. 23:31:18 <clokep> Tha tjust mean I have a password wrong or osmething? 23:31:51 <flo> the "temporary" seems to indicate it's a server issue 23:32:27 <flo> out of curiosity, how did our code react? What was the message in the account manager, and was there the reconnect timer? :) 23:32:29 <clokep> Ah, apparently... 23:32:36 <clokep> flo: It said authentication failure. 23:33:08 <EionRobb> I wonder if the licences that IB would get around the SkypeKit licencing restrictions so that you could get skype in IB "without skype running" 23:33:40 <flo> EionRobb: I couldn't parse that sentence 23:33:59 <EionRobb> oops, * the licenses that IB uses 23:34:08 <flo> EionRobb: but for code shipping in add-ons (ie not part of the "Instantbird" product), even proprietary code is OK. 23:34:18 --> DGMurdockIII has joined #instantbird 23:34:22 <EionRobb> there's a clause in the skypekit licence that says that some open-source licenses are forbidden from using skypekit 23:34:23 <clokep> EionRobb: It's not GPL compatible, but it is MPL compatible AFAIK. 23:34:34 <EionRobb> ah ok, so that could work 23:35:09 <Mook_as> yep, songbird had proprietary addons just fine (they get optionally downloaded on first run of the app) 23:35:48 <flo> Mook_as: was songbird really careful about licenses though? ;) 23:36:05 <clokep> flo: " Clients who do not support DNS records should indicate this as the server: vkmessenger.com." is "DNS records" DNS SRV? 23:36:30 <flo> clokep: seems extremely likely 23:37:03 <Mook_as> flo: enough to hire people to actually finish the gstreamer port so it can get off vlc, yeah... :) 23:37:46 <flo> Mook_as: so Songbird wasn't GPL'ed any more? 23:39:18 <Mook_as> yep. (well, it's dual-licensed, getting patches into the official tree involved signing a thing saying it was okay) 23:40:01 <instantbot> firstname.lastname@example.org requested review from email@example.com for attachment 1979 on bug 1702. 23:40:03 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1702 enh, --, ---, unghost, ASSI, Add VKontakte protocol 23:41:16 <flo> clokep: so you could connect after changing the server name? 23:41:39 <clokep> flo: I could connect w/ the server name he used. I was just answering my own review comment of "why are we using vkmessenger.com instead of vk.com" 23:42:48 <flo> ah 23:43:00 <flo> so the auth error was actually just temporary? 23:43:22 <clokep> flo: I got it with an account I had made w/ the previous patch. 23:43:25 <clokep> So I madea new account. 23:43:35 <flo> ok 23:43:58 <flo> how do you feel about that string being in xmpp.properties? 23:44:13 <clokep> We have the GTalk one there it seems. 23:45:21 --> rosonline has joined #instantbird 23:46:16 <flo> clokep: I know. 23:46:55 <clokep> Then I'm OK w/ it. Seems silly to make a new file for it. 23:47:04 <flo> clokep: I think I'm confused by the code of the connect: method 23:47:21 <flo> clokep: are users expected to enter an username @vk.com, or without @ ? 23:47:55 <clokep> My understanding was it could handle either... as far as I can tell it's just http://lxr.instantbird.org/instantbird/source/chat/protocols/facebook/facebook.js#23 23:47:55 <clokep> flo ^ ^ 23:48:37 <flo> ah 23:49:05 <flo> my concern when reading that code is I suspect it fails poorly if the user includes the "/" character but not the "@" character in his username 23:49:21 <flo> (or course we can blame the user for doing something that stupid :-D) 23:49:36 <clokep> Ah, of course! Would that be an issue for Facebook too? :) 23:53:03 <flo> yes, that code (in facebook.js) seems to suck 23:53:20 <flo> but it's not the fault of the author of the new override :) 23:54:36 <flo> I think my only review comment is that the "Cu.import("resource:///modules/xmpp-xml.jsm");" line isn't needed 23:55:01 <clokep> Oh bah! I meant to check those. :( 23:55:57 <flo> another possible review comment is that " get normalizedName() "vkontakte"," isn't needed either. But I suspect the performance of the jsProtoHelper method (using a regexp each time the getter is used) isn't great, so hardcoding the result is fine with me. 23:57:24 <clokep> I assumed it was just hard coding it too. 23:57:53 <flo> clokep: http://lxr.instantbird.org/instantbird/source/chat/modules/jsProtoHelper.jsm#693 23:58:03 <flo> http://lxr.instantbird.org/instantbird/source/chat/modules/jsProtoHelper.jsm#29 23:58:30 <clokep> Yeah. 23:58:38 <clokep> I mean I'm sure that's not awful...but still... 23:59:14 <flo> I disklike it :) 23:59:19 <flo> a little bit too magical ;) 23:59:35 <clokep> We could remove it if you'd like.