#instantbird log on 08 31 2012

All times are UTC.

00:30:59 <-- myk has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
00:48:39 <-- wesj has quit (Input/output error)
00:55:56 --> clokep has joined #instantbird
00:55:56 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep 
00:59:47 <-- chrisccoulson has quit (Ping timeout)
01:08:57 <-- Mook_as has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88-rdmsoft [XULRunner])
01:16:36 * clokep hhas a patch in his queue that and has no idea why,,,,
01:17:26 <clokep> Bah I mean that I have no idea why I made that change. :-D
01:39:18 <-- aleth has quit (Input/output error)
02:30:49 <clokep> I don't have the actual energy to rant about IRC right now, so just fill in the gap here over the next five minutes with ranting of IRC, SASL and CAP.
02:55:09 <-- clokep has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
03:00:33 <instant-buildbot> build #616 of linux-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/linux-nightly-default/builds/616
03:48:20 <-- mconley has quit (Input/output error)
04:39:03 --> Mook has joined #instantbird
05:12:40 <instant-buildbot> build #694 of win32-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/win32-nightly-default/builds/694
06:10:25 <-- EionRobb has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
06:12:55 <instant-buildbot> build #600 of macosx-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/macosx-nightly-default/builds/600
06:18:46 --> chrisccoulson has joined #instantbird
06:20:43 <-- chrisccoulson has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
06:21:11 --> jb has joined #instantbird
06:22:30 --> chrisccoulson has joined #instantbird
06:23:07 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout)
06:45:25 --> jb has joined #instantbird
06:46:11 <-- jb has quit (Input/output error)
06:47:18 --> skeledrew has joined #instantbird
06:58:30 --> jb has joined #instantbird
07:01:42 <-- jb has quit (Quit: jb)
07:02:02 --> jb has joined #instantbird
07:02:34 <-- Mook has quit (Quit: Mook)
07:03:43 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout)
07:06:52 --> jb has joined #instantbird
07:08:06 --> Tonnes has joined #instantbird
07:08:39 <-- jb has quit (Quit: jb)
07:08:56 --> jb has joined #instantbird
07:18:31 <-- jb has quit (Quit: jb)
07:18:53 --> jb has joined #instantbird
07:20:01 <-- jb has quit (Quit: jb)
07:20:18 --> jb has joined #instantbird
07:21:47 <-- chrisccoulson has quit (Ping timeout)
07:23:51 --> chrisccoulson has joined #instantbird
07:24:06 --> barlas has joined #instantbird
07:28:46 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout)
07:32:16 --> jb has joined #instantbird
07:33:56 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout)
07:35:02 --> jb has joined #instantbird
07:35:54 <-- jb has quit (Quit: jb)
07:37:37 --> jb has joined #instantbird
07:56:34 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout)
08:02:30 --> gerard-majax_ has joined #instantbird
08:13:41 --> sonny has joined #instantbird
08:13:48 --> jb has joined #instantbird
08:48:29 <-- barlas has quit (Ping timeout)
08:48:42 --> barlas has joined #instantbird
09:09:58 --> FeuerFliege has joined #instantbird
09:10:19 <FeuerFliege> hi :)
09:13:49 <barlas> Hey
09:31:56 <-- sonny has quit (Ping timeout)
09:33:46 --> aleth has joined #instantbird
09:33:46 * ChanServ sets mode +h aleth 
09:40:21 --> mikk_s has joined #instantbird
09:40:25 <-- mikk_s has quit (Quit: mikk_s)
09:53:23 <-- Even has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
09:53:27 --> Even has joined #instantbird
09:53:28 * ChanServ sets mode +o Even 
09:53:34 <-- jb has quit (Quit: jb)
09:54:54 <aleth> Bug 1669 is strange...
09:54:59 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1669 maj, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Certain IRC channels cause freeze in conversation window.
09:58:09 <-- Even has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
10:00:43 --> jb has joined #instantbird
10:03:23 --> clokep has joined #instantbird
10:03:23 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep 
10:05:29 --> Even has joined #instantbird
10:05:29 * ChanServ sets mode +o Even 
10:06:46 --> mmkmou has joined #instantbird
10:07:06 --> sonny has joined #instantbird
10:16:23 <-- barlas has quit (Ping timeout)
10:22:31 --> flo has joined #instantbird
10:22:31 * ChanServ sets mode +qo flo flo 
10:28:08 <flo> clokep: a side effect of the recent change in the handling of noNewlines is that the outgoing messages containing new lines appear as one in the conversation
10:28:14 <flo> is this something we should fix?
10:28:51 <clokep> flo: Yes, I'm an idiot.
10:29:04 * clokep fixes it now.
10:29:46 <flo> clokep: the people I talked to this morning at my ISP's hotline are certainly more idiots than you even in your worst days ;).
10:30:09 <flo> clokep: + I think I reviewed that patch ;).
10:30:23 <flo> now I know why aleth felt the need to share the blame with someone :)
10:30:50 <clokep> flo: So I only have
10:30:51 <clokep> half the blame? :)
10:31:01 <clokep> Hmm...that showed up on two lines for me...?
10:31:32 <clokep> (Although it looks like it shouldn't, from the code.)
10:31:53 <flo> hmm (line1)
10:31:54 <flo> (line2)
10:32:18 <flo> clokep: http://i.imgur.com/BQj9M.png
10:32:40 <clokep> 6:31:57 AM - flo: hmm (line1)
10:32:41 <clokep> 6:31:58 AM - flo: (line2)
10:32:58 <-- chrisccoulson has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
10:33:16 <flo> clokep: I know it's sent correctly (I checked in the error console)
10:33:29 <flo> clokep: the issue is that what's displayed in the conversation locally doesn't match what we send.
10:34:20 --> chrisccoulson has joined #instantbird
10:35:54 <clokep> Yes, I understand the issue.
10:36:00 <clokep> I'm seeing the little HR in between though.
10:36:02 <clokep> So it looks the same.
10:36:32 <flo> clokep: I suspect it just means you haven't updated your nighty :-P
10:36:42 <clokep> flo: Did that just land?
10:36:50 <flo> 2 days ago maybe?
10:37:07 <flo> hg says "41 hours ago"
10:37:10 <clokep> Ah, I'm on the 29th. Weird. I'm usually only a day behind.
10:37:20 <-- clokep has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
10:37:26 --> clokep has joined #instantbird
10:37:26 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep 
10:38:49 <-- FeuerFliege has quit (Connection reset by peer)
10:39:14 <clokep> flo: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/69608
10:40:04 <clokep> Maybe it should be attached to the old bug or what I don' tknow.
10:40:15 <-- aleth has quit (Quit: Au revoir)
10:40:35 --> aleth has joined #instantbird
10:40:35 * ChanServ sets mode +h aleth 
10:40:45 <aleth> sorry I missed that :-/
10:41:30 <flo> do we have a bug on file for displaying RTs as being from their original author?
10:41:37 <clokep> yes
10:42:39 <aleth> bug 1667
10:42:42 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1667 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Display RTs by showing the original tweet
10:43:23 <clokep> bug 1253 would be nice too, and fairly easy...I think.
10:43:26 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1253 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Don't show RTs of tweets that are already in the timeline
10:45:07 * clokep is really confused by https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/attachment.cgi?id=1876
10:45:40 <clokep> I need to try to reproduce that I guess.
10:45:41 <flo> clokep: we should still show the new RTs, shouldn't we? twitter.com shows a RT count I think
10:46:44 <clokep> flo: Right they have a list of people too who have retweeted it, I think.
10:47:05 <flo> yeah, we probably need that before hiding the new RTs
10:47:44 <aleth> Displaying the tweet from the original author also has a UI problem (where to show the RT info)
10:50:14 <clokep> bug 1669 almost sounds like that Thunderbird #ubuntu bug...
10:50:19 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1669 maj, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Certain IRC channels cause freeze in conversation window.
10:50:37 <aleth> What #ubuntu bug?
10:52:21 <clokep> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=786944
10:52:25 <aleth> clokep: The blank tab title on the screenshot also confuses me.
10:52:42 <clokep> The binding is breaking somehow.
10:52:49 <clokep> I expect there are errors further up that he didn't show.
10:52:58 <aleth> Just as with the error messages, I am confused as to how interaction with a particular server can cause the UI to break like that
10:53:07 <clokep> Want to try to reproduce? ;)
10:53:20 <aleth> I tried once with no luck, but maybe not long enough
10:53:27 --> barlas has joined #instantbird
10:53:56 <-- meh has quit (Quit: I don't want to live on this planet anymore.)
10:53:58 <clokep> Maybe I'll log in at work and just sit there in it.
10:54:45 <aleth> Hmm, we've seen this.tab is undefined unreproducible bugs on IB as well.
10:54:59 <aleth> There are some bugs filed
10:56:04 <aleth> But this TB one sounds more reproducible, at least for the reporter...
10:59:06 <-- clokep has quit (Ping timeout)
10:59:49 <barlas> Is there anyway to read whole topic without moving my hand from the keyboard?
10:59:51 <barlas> in IRC, I mean
11:00:04 <flo> barlas: yeah, scroll up :)
11:00:06 <aleth> barlas: Press "Home"?
11:00:16 <aleth> (maybe a couple of times)
11:00:39 <barlas> aleth: I tried that, forgot to press 'Tab' a few times first :)
11:01:19 <barlas> At least now my 'Home' key might see some use, it usually feels very unloved. :P
11:01:23 <aleth> From the empty input box, Home or Ctrl-Home works. Otherwise Alt-PgUp...
11:01:38 --> rosonline has joined #instantbird
11:01:46 <barlas> Ah, Ctrl-Home, that is what I was asking for!
11:01:50 <barlas> Thanks
11:06:34 <instantbot> aletheia2@fastmail.fm requested feedback from clokep@gmail.com for attachment 1875 on bug 1683.
11:06:39 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1683 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Restore participants' active status if still appropriate after a reconnect
11:14:24 * aleth discovers the FF command line
11:16:13 <aleth> Can't figure out how the debugger works though.
11:31:39 <-- flo has quit (Input/output error)
11:31:42 --> flo has joined #instantbird
11:31:42 * ChanServ sets mode +qo flo flo 
11:49:19 --> clokep_work has joined #instantbird
11:49:19 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep_work 
11:52:31 <-- barlas has quit (Ping timeout)
12:00:04 --> barlas has joined #instantbird
12:08:53 <flo> for bug 1669 the only steps to reproduce we have is "connect to irc.rizon.net#writescribbles", right?
12:08:56 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1669 maj, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Certain IRC channels cause freeze in conversation window.
12:11:37 <aleth> yes
12:12:00 <aleth> quite possibly there is some kind of race condition involved somewhere
12:15:01 --> mali has joined #instantbird
12:43:40 --> Mic has joined #instantbird
12:43:41 * ChanServ sets mode +h Mic 
12:47:28 <Mic> Hi
12:53:14 <barlas> Hi Mic
12:57:17 --> mikk_s has joined #instantbird
12:57:32 <-- mikk_s has quit (Quit: mikk_s)
13:09:34 <-- barlas has quit (Connection reset by peer)
13:19:07 --> mconley has joined #instantbird
13:28:37 <-- Kaishi has quit (Quit: Kaishi)
13:28:42 --> Kaishi has joined #instantbird
13:37:20 <Mic> aleth: http://log.bezut.info/instantbird/yesterday/#m304 -> no, not really.
13:37:23 <-- Kaishi has quit (Ping timeout)
13:40:12 <-- jb has quit (Quit: jb)
13:40:30 --> jb has joined #instantbird
13:40:56 <-- jb has quit (Quit: jb)
13:41:13 <aleth> Mic: Well, that should make mconley happy ;)
13:41:25 --> jb has joined #instantbird
13:41:57 <mconley> Mic: oh, hey
13:42:21 <Mic> Hi mconley, I'm currently catching up with the logs...
13:43:54 <-- jb has quit (Quit: jb)
13:44:05 --> jb has joined #instantbird
13:46:02 <mconley> Mic: I'd love your input, once you do. :)
13:46:15 <Mic> aleth, mconley: we don't have to open the log files to get the date by the way. It's read from the filename.
13:46:46 <aleth> Mic: not the end date ;)
13:46:49 <Mic> That lets us discard all the log files that can't possibly hold the period of time that we're looking for.
13:46:50 <mconley> Mic: that gets us the starting day, not the ending
13:47:07 <mconley> Mic: the conversation can go over a day boundary
13:47:16 <mconley> *unless*, we only care about when logs begin
13:47:23 <mconley> that's something I'm still figuring out
13:47:24 <Mic> Sure and when you've got a sorted list with a next log item (and a new date)
13:48:14 <Mic> then you can tell what dates can possibly lie in the earlier one.
13:48:43 <mconley> but we can't be certain if they lie in there
13:48:50 <mconley> hm
13:48:58 * mconley thinks
13:49:02 <Mic> Yes, that's the file that you need to open to have a look.
13:50:25 <aleth> Apparently TB already stores the end dates anyway, so it's not so much of an issue.
13:50:33 <mconley> well, kinda
13:50:40 <mconley> the gloda indexer caches that information
13:50:53 <mconley> tapping into that would be a little bit of a hack
13:53:18 <Mic> Does TB have a way to tell in which log file we have to look for a message at a given date and time then?
13:53:49 <aleth> It would be nicer to do it in a way that works for IB too, without gloda
13:56:50 <mconley> Mic: we index the messages with Gloda, and if we're searching and we get a hit, we're given the names of the log files to display.
13:57:09 <-- sonny has quit (Ping timeout)
13:59:30 <Mic> In which folder in comm-central do I have to look for the code of the chat tab?
13:59:55 <mconley> Mic: mail/components/im/
14:00:01 <Mic> Thanks!
14:00:08 <mconley> np
14:19:00 --> wnayes has joined #instantbird
14:23:02 <Mic> mconley, aleth: I'm sure what's the best thing to do here.
14:23:27 <mconley> Mic: you're sure? Or not sure?
14:23:31 <Mic> *not
14:23:58 <Mic> Log files and sessions are just not made for this :S
14:24:00 <mconley> Mic: cool. So, I've filed bug 787149 on b.m.o to track this effort
14:24:18 <mconley> Mic: if you feel like following along, and keeping me out of trouble. :)
14:24:24 <Mic> I'm already CC'ed to it
14:24:30 <mconley> Mic: ah, excellent
14:26:17 <Mic> I was thinking about having a method that returns messages from a given period of time, which is fine for some things (like getting messages from beginning of today (or 24h as clokep perfers), yesterday, ...
14:27:36 <Mic> The thing is that you'd need to look at all log files and that would give indeed a terrible performance most likely (I now understand what aleth wanted to say)
14:34:33 <Mic> brb
14:34:37 <-- Mic has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
14:38:32 --> Mic has joined #instantbird
14:38:32 * ChanServ sets mode +h Mic 
14:38:42 <-- rosonline has quit (Ping timeout)
14:39:17 --> rosonline has joined #instantbird
14:42:41 <-- rosonline has quit (Ping timeout)
14:44:26 <mconley> flo: can you remind me again why it's hard / a bad idea to write conversations to daily logs as opposed to individual log files? Assume that we don't need to migrate - that we can handle the current, fragmented approach.
14:46:51 --> rosonline has joined #instantbird
14:49:14 <aleth> mconley: Just to note that with the current situation, a log could easily stretch over more than two days
14:49:55 <mconley> aleth: correct
14:50:25 <mconley> suppose we also know the date/time of the last message in some log
14:52:14 <-- aleth has quit (Quit: Au revoir)
14:52:19 --> aleth has joined #instantbird
14:52:19 * ChanServ sets mode +h aleth 
14:53:05 * aleth tests something
14:53:06 <-- rosonline has quit (Client exited)
14:54:14 <aleth> mconley: I think it's more tricky even than that: Unless I'm mistaken (flo?) currently it's quite possible to open a conversation, get disconnected, stay disconnected for a day or two, then reconnect, and have the whole thing be in a single log file.
14:55:01 <mconley> hm
14:55:59 <aleth> Not sure how important such cases would be though...
15:00:30 <flo> mconley: the *real* reason why I'm reluctant to have one log per day is that tools like scandisk on Windows tend to do bad thing (ie destroy) files that were open for writing at the time of a system unclean shutdown.
15:01:17 <flo> mconley: if you had a chat session during the morning, then turned off the computer, then in the afternoon started chatting again and had a power outage, it's sad that it could affect the saved log of a conversation that happened before and was finished from the user's point of view
15:02:35 <mconley> flo: how do other chat clients with logging get around this?
15:02:59 <mconley> flo: LimeChat, for example, does daily logs per channel. I wonder what their approach is...
15:03:06 <flo> mconley: I'm not exactly sure of if you want one log per day because you don't want to have to open several files together to display a day, or if it's just to be able to easily figure out which file(s) are interesting for a given day
15:03:22 <Mic> mconley: you're real problem is to know which days had logs, isn't it?
15:03:25 <Mic> *your
15:03:46 <flo> mconley: most chat clients handle logging poorly or very poorly. I've never found any client whose logging system didn't seriously suck
15:04:13 <flo> mconley: maybe their approach is "don't run on Windows"? :)
15:04:20 <mconley> ha, maybe. ;)
15:04:37 <mconley> Mic: I think there are a few layers of problems here. It's tangly. I'm still trying to wrap my head around it. :/
15:04:40 <flo> mconley: I would like if we closed the log file each time the date change, btw.
15:04:49 <Mic> flo++
15:04:53 <Mic> That's bug 476 iirc
15:04:55 <flo> mconley: so you could easily find all the logs for a given date, just by looking at the file names
15:04:56 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=476 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Split logs on day changes (=> logs shouldn't contain messages of more than one day)
15:05:37 <Mic> d'oh. /me just understood why clokep called him "Micbot" not long ago :D
15:05:50 <flo> Mic: <3
15:06:00 <aleth> :)
15:06:03 <flo> Mic: botsnack!
15:06:17 <mconley> flo: hm...if we did that, I wonder what we'd need to do in order to satisfy bwinton's request - bug 787149 comment 3
15:06:43 <aleth> There's also the issue of being able to open logs without having to open a conversation to the same person/channel again
15:08:02 <aleth> Not related other than that it might also be helpful to have a tree of existing logs for that
15:08:10 * aleth whispers something about lets not mention timezones
15:08:15 <flo> mconley: make the log of conversations that happened at the time of the date change appear in both days?
15:08:28 <flo> mconley: Wouldn't it be confusing?
15:08:55 <flo> aleth: unrelated ;)
15:09:10 <flo> aleth: the tree is of similar logs (log files in the same folder)
15:09:15 <Mic> imo there should be a single log conversation and clicking an item in the list would only scroll to the correct position in the conversation.
15:09:39 <flo> Mic: sure
15:09:59 <flo> Mic: I would volunteer Mook to implement that
15:10:02 <mconley> flo: apparently, it's the desired behaviour.
15:10:06 <flo> Mic: or maybe aleth :).
15:10:16 <flo> Both are great to find solution to crazily-complicated-looking projects
15:10:33 <flo> mconley: bwinton can easily be convinced though ;)
15:10:58 <Mic> With aleth you'd only have to review every second attachment? :P
15:11:21 <flo> mconley: but yeah, what aleth said: the really desired behavior is to display things as only one "infinite" conversation, and add messages at the top and bottom when the user scrolls. Clicking in the tree would then just change the position of the scrollbar in the conversation
15:11:47 <flo> Mic: sure!
15:11:48 <mconley> ah, yes, that'd be nice
15:12:07 <flo> Mic: although in a recent bug it was the fifth ;)
15:12:19 <flo> mconley: nice (for the UX), but super difficult to implement.
15:12:31 <aleth> flo: hey, I kept adding features ;)
15:12:37 <Mic> The bad thing about this is that I've never seen a working infinitely scrolling list that actually worked well :(
15:12:49 <flo> mconley: even just adding a message at the top rather than at the bottom of a conversation is quite difficult.
15:13:06 <Mic> It either lagged when scrolling or the scrollbar was behaving strangely or something else :(
15:13:14 <aleth> Mic: The problem is that the position of the scrollbar marker is a bit meaningless
15:13:29 <mconley> perhaps a scrollbar isn't the right affordance in that case
15:13:31 <flo> mconley: although after aleth's crazy work on displaying an unread ruler for new messages, and correctly removing it (including merging adjacent bubbles) when messages are read; anything seems possible :)
15:13:43 <-- mali has quit (Ping timeout)
15:14:06 * mconley rubs temples
15:18:59 <aleth> Adding messages correctly at the top with rejoining bubbles would be hard.
15:20:09 <flo> aleth: yes!
15:21:25 <dewmugg> :D
15:23:57 <-- aleth has quit (Quit: Au revoir)
15:36:32 --> mali has joined #instantbird
15:43:37 --> zen_monkey has joined #instantbird
15:43:53 <-- zen_monkey has quit (Quit: Saliendo)
15:44:17 * flo wonders what clokep_work thinks about https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=787433
15:47:31 <Mic> bye
15:47:35 <-- Mic has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
15:47:41 <-- gerard-majax_ has quit (Ping timeout)
15:48:48 --> Optimizer has joined #instantbird
15:55:53 <-- mmkmou has quit (Client exited)
15:57:36 <mconley> flo: ping
15:57:50 <flo> mconley: pong :)
15:58:32 <mconley> flo: hey - so I've been fiddling with aleth's idea, if having an "infinite" conversation
15:58:56 <mconley> flo: here are some sketches - ideas are still in flux, but what do you think of this: http://i.imgur.com/aQZjX.png
15:59:35 --> igorko has joined #instantbird
15:59:37 <dew> looks like you're getting trillian's activity history :P
16:00:21 <mconley> :)
16:01:21 <-- Optimizer has quit (Ping timeout)
16:05:17 <flo> what's the command to use an hg repository with git?
16:07:15 <flo> mconley: nice. Would be even nicer without having to show a spinner, but I don't know how long it will take to open the log file, etc...
16:07:56 <mconley> flo: in practice, the spinner might only be there for a split second. Yeah, it might depend.
16:10:51 <mconley> flo: anyhow, I don't want to indulge in scope creep. Just pondering about it. :)
16:11:53 <flo> mconley: yeah, that would be really nice, but I it could take you a long time
16:13:11 <mconley> flo: so you don't think that logs should exist across their date boundaries, correct? What do you think *should* happen?
16:13:20 <mconley> I'm still trying to nail down a spec here
16:18:45 --> sonny has joined #instantbird
16:18:58 <mconley> also, do we know if nsIFile.directoryEntries returns in a reliable order?
16:27:04 <flo> I don't think we can rely on it
16:27:21 <flo> it's probably the order the files have been written, not the order sorted by name
16:36:14 <-- mali has quit (Ping timeout)
16:46:32 --> Optimizer has joined #instantbird
16:47:10 --> aleth has joined #instantbird
16:47:10 * ChanServ sets mode +h aleth 
16:48:03 <aleth> I'll take a look at the infinite scroll thing once Mic lands his patch.
16:48:22 <clokep_work> flo: Are you trying to pull a git repository using git or what?
16:48:24 <aleth> Just to see what's feasible...
16:49:24 --> Mook_as has joined #instantbird
16:50:18 --> mali has joined #instantbird
16:50:25 <flo> clokep_work: I'm mentoring an intern here so that he fixes his bug in JS-XMPP
16:50:45 <aleth> his?
16:50:59 <flo> aleth: his pet bug ;)
16:51:03 <aleth> ah :)
16:51:09 <flo> being able to set one's priority for XMPP
16:51:43 <-- Optimizer has quit (Ping timeout)
16:51:50 <aleth> focus is Weird.
16:52:35 <clokep_work> flo: I was just about to r- that patch. ;)
16:52:36 --> myk has joined #instantbird
16:52:45 <flo> clokep_work: ah?
16:52:46 <flo> why?
16:52:50 <-- mali has quit (Ping timeout)
16:54:50 <flo> clokep_work: I'll probably ask you to r? after I r+ it (once I'll be satisfied), because I more or less suggested how the code could be written ;)
16:57:44 <clokep_work> flo: Is a priority of 0 "high" or "low" priority?
16:57:51 <clokep_work> (And what are the expected values?)
16:57:56 <clokep_work> I haven't read the spec, mind you. ;)
16:59:27 <clokep_work> flo: Also I'm pretty sure that's the bug I had asked you about a few days ago. :-D
16:59:48 <-- myk has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
17:00:47 <flo> clokep_work: 0 is the value that servers use if the priority has been omitted, it's neutral
17:01:01 <flo> negative values mean you don't want to receive a message
17:01:20 <flo> the higher the value is, the more you want to receive messages on that resource instead of other resources
17:01:44 <flo> clokep_work: "flo: Also I'm pretty sure that's the bug I had asked you about a few days ago. :-D" what did you ask about it?
17:02:32 <clokep_work> flo: I had asked if setting myself to unavailable will ensure messages go to Instantbird.
17:03:13 <flo> clokep_work: http://xmpp.org/rfcs/rfc3921.html#rfc.section. for the spec
17:04:37 <clokep_work> Thanks. It's on my list of things to read over. ;)
17:04:48 <flo> I'll ask him to check that the value is between -128 and +127 for the next version
17:05:04 <flo> clokep_work: the part of the spec I linked to is only 4 lines ;)
17:05:39 <aleth> There's actually not that many instant messaging bugs on BMO!
17:05:50 * aleth not sure whether to be surprised or not
17:05:53 <-- sonny has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
17:05:57 <clokep_work> flo: Yes, I was just thinking it'd be nice if we could make the UI abide by that too. :)
17:06:34 --> sonny has joined #instantbird
17:07:10 <clokep_work> aleth: I might want to discuss some IRC issues I'm having at some point...I only have a super hacky way to get around it right now. :(
17:08:01 <aleth> :-/ Sure... later this evening maybe?
17:09:08 --> myk has joined #instantbird
17:09:30 <aleth> d'oh... if you say "BIO bug xxx" on BMO it ends up linked to the BMO bug of course :(
17:10:48 <clokep_work> aleth: Yes, it does. ;)
17:11:37 <clokep_work> aleth: And maybe. It's pretty much I need a way to pause the connection registration until I get a CAP LS response, but I'd really rather not use a timer...
17:12:07 <aleth> ah, it's not focus that is weird, it's focus+XBL, which is wors.
17:12:30 <flo> clokep_work: are we wontfixing that IRC version request? ;)
17:12:34 <aleth> clokep_work: ouch, that sounds tricky... I think I kind of remember
17:12:52 <aleth> That SASL bug, right?
17:12:55 <clokep_work> flo: I don't know. I think his reasoning is (kind of) valid.
17:12:56 <clokep_work> aleth: Yes.
17:13:12 <clokep_work> flo: Was the thought behind it just information leak?
17:13:20 <clokep_work> We show the version anyway on quit messages. :-/
17:13:55 <flo> clokep_work: do we have an easy way to know if a pref has an user value?
17:14:29 <flo> clokep_work: the reason why we have get priority() 0, in facebook/gtalk is that it failed if there wasn't a default value set by the priority: option
17:14:57 <aleth> flo: Services.prefs.prefHasUserValue()
17:15:10 <flo> aleth: it's an account-specific pref
17:15:19 <flo> aleth: so I would need something from jsProtoHelper
17:15:22 <aleth> ah, that kind of pref.
17:15:31 <clokep_work> flo: I vaguely recall this giving us annoyance somewhere else too.
17:15:37 <clokep_work> Well it give Mook annoyance.
17:15:45 <-- myk has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
17:16:08 --> myk has joined #instantbird
17:16:40 * clokep_work is looking...
17:18:24 <flo> http://lxr.instantbird.org/instantbird/search?string=prefs.prefHasUser
17:18:28 <clokep_work> flo: That sounds like something we should fix...but I guess we purposefully made it so inheriting from a protocol allows you to specify different options.
17:18:53 <clokep_work> Ah, this.prefs.
17:19:21 <clokep_work> I think we discussed adding a function to jsPRotoHelper which just forwards to that.
17:20:50 <clokep_work> flo: Maybe your intern should come on IRC also? Or are you like physically sitting next to them. :)
17:21:09 <clokep_work> flo: Btw I kind of agree that we should send the version as part of the response, which is why I haven't WONTFIXed it yet.
17:21:10 <flo> sitting next to him
17:21:14 <flo> and it's not my intern
17:21:24 <flo> I think he's intern for http://imaginationforpeople.org/ :)
17:21:28 <aleth> Oh, you are repurposing other peoples' interns? :D
17:21:56 <clokep_work> Apparently convincing people to use Instantbird/Thunderbird chat too. ;)
17:22:40 <flo> clokep_work: do we have an easy way to set the min and max of an account pref in the UI?
17:22:46 * flo is confused about jsProtoHelper's code
17:23:12 <flo> aleth: it's Friday at 7pm so I think we aren't supposed to still be in the office, interns can work on whatever project they like ;)
17:23:35 <flo> aleth: + the intern's manager made everybody in his team switch to Instantbird already :-)
17:23:47 <aleth> great :)
17:24:02 <clokep_work> flo: No, we should add a minValue and maxValue which are only usable for Int fields.
17:24:04 <aleth> And now fixing IB bugs boosts team productivity ;)
17:24:46 <flo> clokep_work: can I decide it's out of the scope of that bug?
17:26:21 <clokep_work> flo: I think we should check it in the XMPP code, the UI changes are out of scope.
17:26:27 <clokep_work> But it'd be nice to file a bug about it. :)
17:26:31 <flo> aleth: I think we were both being very unproductive, so we started scratching an itch
17:26:33 <clokep_work> (Be useful for ports too.)
17:26:44 <flo> my itch was seeing him use a twitter client + limechat for IRC + adium
17:26:50 <flo> his was not being able to set the priority
17:32:57 <-- jb has quit (Quit: jb)
17:33:04 --> Kyriog has joined #instantbird
17:33:17 <Kyriog> Hello world
17:33:43 <clokep_work> Hello.
17:33:48 <flo> clokep_work: "flo: Maybe your intern should come on IRC also?" done ;)
17:37:13 <clokep_work> Right. :P
17:37:56 <clokep_work> Kyriog: I'm glad you're fixing that, I was just querying fl o about that the other day!
17:38:03 <clokep_work> (Without knowing exactly what I wanted. :))
17:47:09 --> jb has joined #instantbird
17:49:27 <-- flo has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
17:49:48 <-- Kyriog has quit (Quit: Kyriog)
17:50:42 --> Kaishi has joined #instantbird
17:55:22 --> DGMurdockIII has joined #instantbird
17:55:38 <-- sonny has quit (Ping timeout)
18:03:35 --> sonny has joined #instantbird
18:20:39 <-- DGMurdockIII has quit (Quit: ChatZilla [Firefox 15.0/20120824154833])
18:22:31 --> Kyriog has joined #instantbird
18:27:57 --> gerard-majax_ has joined #instantbird
18:45:17 --> myk1 has joined #instantbird
18:45:42 <-- myk has quit (Ping timeout)
18:54:18 * myk1 is now known as myk
18:56:38 <clokep_work> So what do people think about version numbers in the IRC VERSION response?
18:56:45 <clokep_work> Currently it just says Instantbird or Thunderbird.
18:57:36 <aleth> Isn't that enough?
18:57:52 <clokep_work> Someone requested on BMO that it gives the version too.
18:58:07 <aleth> I thought you said that was not wanted for security reasons
18:58:08 <clokep_work>  https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=787433
18:58:20 <clokep_work> I did not say that, flo said that. ;)
18:59:06 <clokep_work> The question is whether it really is a security concern or not AND whether the benefit of being able to tell versions apart outweighs possibly having all versions banned vs. a single version banned.
19:00:42 <Mook_as> from his comments, it seems reasonable to think it's not a security concern - the expoliters should have no issues just trying every exploit they have for the app regardless of version.
19:01:10 <clokep_work> Mook_as: I agree.
19:01:21 <clokep_work> Besides we have no known security vulnerabilities. ;)
19:01:22 <aleth> Realistically, I don't think it's much of a risk either
19:01:54 <clokep_work> I agree.
19:02:09 * clokep_work isn't sure what to think.
19:02:21 <clokep_work> FWIW I originally had it reporting the version number, I think.
19:08:57 <-- igorko has quit (Client exited)
19:10:04 --> Mnyromyr has joined #instantbird
19:19:40 <-- Kyriog has quit (Quit: Kyriog)
19:24:10 <-- ivan has quit (Ping timeout)
19:35:40 --> flo has joined #instantbird
19:35:40 * ChanServ sets mode +qo flo flo 
19:43:57 <-- flo has quit (Ping timeout)
20:06:50 --> ivan has joined #instantbird
20:28:35 --> flo has joined #instantbird
20:28:35 * ChanServ sets mode +qo flo flo 
20:33:42 * flo is using the phone to connect again :-(
20:37:08 <aleth> :(
20:37:10 <aleth> Did you change the modem?
20:37:28 <aleth> A bad line would be more trouble...
20:41:50 <flo> no, I didn't change the modem.
20:42:14 <flo> the line will only accept the one with the correct serial number
20:42:22 <dew> sorry flo
20:42:42 <dew> also I'd be for sending the version number in the ctcp version string
20:42:55 <aleth> Oh, one of those... I had that problem once as well, where the modem actually belonged to the cable company
20:43:16 <flo> aleth: in France all modems belong to the ISPs ;)
20:44:08 <dew> that's bull
20:44:21 <dew> we can buy our own here :)
20:46:38 <flo> the tech guy from the ISP I managed to have on the phone (after more than an hour of negotiations!) promised that it would be fixed within at most 13 days.
20:47:34 <dew> -_-
20:47:40 <flo> the guy I had before was just stupid
20:48:11 <flo> and the guys in the store could only call the hotline with me, they were completely powerless
20:48:13 <dew> listen buddy I write Instantbird.  Fix my connection or suffer the wrath of mozilla
20:48:22 <aleth> Yeah, that was my experience too, you have to get through to the right person...
20:48:34 <aleth> If there is a fault hotline that might help.
20:48:56 <flo> there is
20:48:59 <aleth> Fingers crossed it won't be 13 days :|
20:49:12 <flo> the problem is, the auto-detect the customer based on the number of the calling phone
20:49:23 <flo> and their hotline is somehow mis-configured
20:49:30 <clokep_work> Heads up that I'll be on travel starting the end of next week, so reviews might be limited.
20:50:23 <flo> when calling from my cell phone, after 2 minutes of blahblah press 1 blahblah press 2, just when I should finally have a real human on the line, it tells me "The number you have dialed is not assigned, the call can succeed." and hangs up.
20:50:49 <flo> so instead of calling from my cell phone, I went to the store, and called the same number from the store's phone
20:51:18 <aleth> what a time sink :(
20:51:18 <flo> where the hotline guy didn't want to do anything until I would accept to go home and call him again (aaaarg! I would have strangled him).
20:51:47 <flo> s/can succeed/cannot succeed/ (but I'm sure you guessed that :)
20:52:18 <aleth> crazy...
20:52:37 <Mook_as> so you need to call from a voip box that can fake caller id, right? :p
20:53:48 <flo> so after that, and calling each of the hotline numbers from my cell phone again in front of the guys working at the store with the loud speaker (because they believed me, but not really when I said it was hanging up on me), they called themselves and negotiated that I could talk to someone who can actually do something even though I wasn't next to my modem.
20:54:25 <flo> the whole thing (just the part at the store this morning) took an hour and a half, just to open a ticket saying my internet access doesn't work any more
20:54:36 <flo> I think it's never taken me that long to file a bug!
20:54:58 <flo> Mook_as: the modem that doesn't work is actually the voip box ;)
20:55:13 <Mook_as> .... hahahaha
20:55:43 <flo> I lost another hour just before that with more fun related to the bike stations :)
20:55:51 <flo> well, ":)" now, but I wasn't pleased
20:55:56 <aleth> what a day...
20:56:16 <flo> aleth: yeah :)
20:59:02 <flo> there's the "Braderie de Lille" (largest flea market in Europe, with 2 millions people coming each year) this week-end, and so to avoid bikes being damaged by the crowed, they removed all the bikes and locked and turned off all the stations that are located downtown.
20:59:59 <flo> but they of course didn't communicate this at all. Neither before my email/SMS, nor today on the screen of the station next to where I live, where I rented a bike this morning.
21:00:43 <aleth> they probably told the local newspaper or something ;)
21:00:52 <flo> once I arrived at the ISP store with the bike, I couldn't dock it anywhere, and had to go back home (and dock the bike almost where I took it), and then walk to do the commute...
21:01:52 <flo> yeah, maybe in tomorrow's edition of a local newspaper :)
21:03:18 <flo> but if they knew they were turning the service down, they could have turned off all stations and stopped me from taking one... (like, you know, put them all in the state of that station I had an issue with yesterday...)
21:03:20 <flo> anyway
21:03:28 * flo has finished ranting for the evening :)
21:04:05 <aleth> it's really helpful to just break the endpoints :P
21:04:33 <aleth> though I guess maybe there are people who circumnavigate paris by bike
21:05:09 * flo doesn't live in Paris
21:05:17 <aleth> ah
21:05:24 <aleth> sorry;)
21:05:50 <aleth> not sure why I thought that...
21:06:23 <-- mconley has quit (Input/output error)
21:06:34 <flo> because Paris advertised their bikes a lot? :)
21:07:01 <aleth> could be!
21:10:31 <clokep_work> Or because we don't know other cities in France? ;)
21:19:10 <aleth> every strange UI behaviour ever turns out to be due to some XBL change :-S
21:20:40 <flo> aleth: Is that a new rule for XUL developers? :)
21:20:55 <aleth> I think it must be some Law of Gecko
21:26:09 <-- Mnyromyr has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [SeaMonkey 1.1.19/2010030105])
21:26:19 <flo> aleth: what's your new bug where XBL is being annoying? :)
21:26:42 <aleth> I'm fixing the contact list keyboard accessibility bug
21:27:50 <aleth> Before ever changing the status message, the status type popup works correctly. After, opening it somehow shifts focus to the user icon.
21:48:00 <-- wnayes has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
22:08:00 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout)
22:09:29 --> jb has joined #instantbird
22:22:53 <-- myk has quit (Connection reset by peer)
22:22:54 --> myk has joined #instantbird
22:37:52 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout)
22:42:21 <aleth> :(
22:43:33 <flo> aleth: ?
22:43:36 <aleth> sometimes, it's just too fiddly...
22:47:04 <aleth> I'm just seeing the most bizarre interactions
22:47:37 <aleth> Now opening the status popup scrolls the buddylist. Why??
22:49:25 <flo> O_o
22:49:29 <flo> Good luck
22:49:33 <flo> and good night! :)
22:50:00 <-- flo has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
23:10:43 <-- aleth has quit (Quit: Au revoir)
23:10:45 --> aleth has joined #instantbird
23:10:45 * ChanServ sets mode +h aleth