#instantbird log on 08 09 2012

All times are UTC.

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00:05:51 <instantbot> vicnett@gmail.com granted review for attachment 1795 on bug 1623.
00:05:53 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1623 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, [fr] typofixing on myspace.properties file
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00:11:26 <instantbot> vicnett@gmail.com set the Resolution field on bug 1623 to FIXED.
00:11:28 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1623 nor, --, ---, nobody, RESO FIXED, [fr] typofixing on myspace.properties file
00:11:38 <vicnet> clokep: alright, I *think* I did everything properly :)
00:12:39 <clokep> vicnet: Looks like it! Except setting the target milestone...but 1.3 isn't in there yet anyway.
00:12:50 * clokep is adding it now.
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00:13:50 <vicnet> clokep: OK, I'll keep that in mind in the future. I guess I'm off to report the couple of bugs we disccussed earlier, now… 1.2 is not in the list of versions though from what I can see
00:14:08 <clokep> vicnet: Refresh.
00:14:40 <vicnet> clokep: wow, it's almost like magic  :)
00:15:36 <clokep> Yes, we apparently missed the " Update version flag (and possibly target milestone) on bugzilla " step on the release process...
00:19:19 <deOmega> OK, i did it... I hope it is worth something to someone.  To be honest, I did it so long ago, I already forgot what I changed... but thought it looked nice enough to share.
00:19:47 <deOmega> Just do not tell me it is exactly like  the original :)
00:20:01 <deOmega> CleanLessSharpMOD
00:21:06 <deOmega> gees, no  downloads of my addon as yet rotflol.  (10 seconds after I uploaded it) .  have a great day all.
00:22:27 <deOmega> sorry, testing
00:22:44 <deOmega>  ok yeah i see some of the things i changed.. was too darn pretty
00:24:09 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1624 filed by vicnett@gmail.com.
00:24:11 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1624 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Alt+PgUp/PgDn doesn't jump to the split between read and unread messages in a conversation in Ubuntu
00:25:25 <vicnet> there's one :)
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00:35:42 <clokep> vicnet: Btw you (most likely) don't have you CC yourself to your own bugs. :)
00:39:49 <clokep> Wow, only 7 bugs assigned to myself. That's the smallest it's been in like...forever.
00:40:17 <clokep> bug 1561 can be checked in now, I think.
00:40:20 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1561 tri, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Remove libpurple's pretentious /wallops help message
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01:30:35 <clokep> Nice post wnayes. :)
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01:52:19 topic changed by gravel.mozilla.org to "Ask about Instantbird (http://instantbird.com) here!|Current version is Instantbird 1.2! :) |News: http://blog.instantbird.org/ |Nightlies: http://nightly.instantbird.im/ (for testing only) |IRC logs: http://log.bezut.info/ |Pastebin: http://pastebin.instantbird.org/ | Bugs: http://bugzilla.instantbird.org"
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02:12:03 <douglaswth> hmm, http://www.instantbird.com/update-1.2.html 404
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02:13:25 <clokep> douglaswth: Did you reach that page from a link somehow?
02:13:53 <douglaswth> yeah, from the check update thing
02:14:22 <clokep> Bah...we probably didn't include one of those...:-/
02:14:33 * clokep is going to bed momentarily...maybe flo can do that in the morning?
02:27:08 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1625 filed by vicnett@gmail.com.
02:27:10 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1625 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, In Ubuntu (with Unity), the System Tray icon does not appear. Because of this, once minimized to tra
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02:52:46 <instant-buildbot> build #588 of linux-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/linux-nightly-default/builds/588
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03:20:20 topic changed by gravel.mozilla.org to "Ask about Instantbird (http://instantbird.com) here!|Current version is Instantbird 1.2! :) |News: http://blog.instantbird.org/ |Nightlies: http://nightly.instantbird.im/ (for testing only) |IRC logs: http://log.bezut.info/ |Pastebin: http://pastebin.instantbird.org/ | Bugs: http://bugzilla.instantbird.org"
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04:00:27 <instantbot> Just appeared in Pidgin News - default :
04:00:30 <instantbot> http://www.sanketagarwal.com/blog/?p=153 - Sanket Agarwal: Collecting statistics et. al. for libpurple
04:00:31 <instantbot> http://www.sanketagarwal.com/blog/?p=162 - Sanket Agarwal: Shiny new website is up for testing! — Help appreciated :-)
04:00:32 <instantbot> http://www.sanketagarwal.com/blog/?p=158 - Sanket Agarwal: Moving on to the server components
04:00:33 <instantbot> http://blog.wasilczyk.pl/en/2012/new-feature-contact-list-synchronization/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=new-feature-contact-list-synchronization - Tomasz Wasilczyk: New feature: contact list synchronization
04:00:34 <instantbot> http://blog.wasilczyk.pl/en/2012/images-support-and-account-management-improvements/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=images-support-and-account-management-improvements - Tomasz Wasilczyk: Images support and account management improvements
04:00:35 <instantbot> http://blog.wasilczyk.pl/en/2012/new-gadu-gadu-protocol-revealed/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=new-gadu-gadu-protocol-revealed - Tomasz Wasilczyk: New Gadu-Gadu protocol revealed
04:00:36 <instantbot> http://www.sanketagarwal.com/blog/?p=148 - Sanket Agarwal: Google summer of code – Pidgin stats collection!
04:00:37 <instantbot> http://blog.wasilczyk.pl/en/2012/cleanups-and-updates/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=cleanups-and-updates - Tomasz Wasilczyk: Cleanups and updates
04:00:38 <instantbot> http://www.sanketagarwal.com/blog/?p=166 - Sanket Agarwal: Shiny new UI for stats display!
04:00:39 <instantbot> http://blog.wasilczyk.pl/en/2012/new-file-transfer-protocol-analyzed/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=new-file-transfer-protocol-analyzed - Tomasz Wasilczyk: New file transfer protocol analyzed
04:06:48 <EionRobb> neat
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04:18:28 <deOmega> Here is teh addon fwiw.
04:18:32 <deOmega> https://addons.instantbird.org/en-US/instantbird/addon/330
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04:43:49 <instant-buildbot> build #671 of win32-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/win32-nightly-default/builds/671
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06:12:00 <instant-buildbot> build #577 of macosx-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/macosx-nightly-default/builds/577
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09:31:20 <Mic> Congratulations on the release! :)
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09:43:41 <flo> Mic: congratulations! (you were part of it too :))
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09:56:27 <flo> http://www.h-online.com/open/news/item/Instantbird-updates-with-important-changes-inside-1663531.html is quite nice
09:56:33 <flo> very few inaccuracies :)
09:59:31 <Mic> Now that's nice :)
09:59:44 <aleth> :)
09:59:57 <flo> has anybody posted on freshmeat (and waiting for moderation) ?
09:59:58 <aleth> though you don't get the sense the author has really tried IB much...
10:00:20 <aleth> People still use freshmeat?
10:00:34 <flo> aleth: he probably hasn't, but he has read most of the release notes, read the announcement blog post, and spent some time on the wiki to find the roadmap
10:00:54 <flo> aleth: lots of website uses its rss feed, so a post on freshmeat's front page gives some visibility
10:01:11 <aleth> flo: Yes, like you say, it is nicely researched :)
10:01:26 <flo> the only point he missed is the change to MPL2
10:01:38 <flo> but it's our bad: http://instantbird.com/faq.html#license
10:03:00 <Mic> gtg, have a nice day
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10:06:26 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1626 filed by florian@instantbird.org.
10:06:29 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1626 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Screen ready say the word "frame" a lot when moving the selection in the contacts list
10:07:28 <aleth> Screen ready?
10:08:15 <flo> aleth: fix,thanks
10:09:02 <flo> *fixed
10:09:03 <flo> typing is hard!
10:14:06 <flo> I motivated Even to add the 2 new versions on socorro, and documented the process on the wiki so that I can do it myself next time
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10:20:16 <flo> uh, comm-central is busted again :-/
10:24:38 <clokep> I didn't post to freshmeat btw. I was packing and some other stuff last night.
10:24:58 <flo> oh, your week-end starts this evening? :m)
10:25:02 <flo> s/m//
10:29:23 <clokep> Yes. :) Leaving after work.
10:29:32 <flo> :)
10:29:52 * flo volunteers aleth for a freshmeat post :-P
10:30:50 <flo> Warning: Unhandled IRC message: :hitchcock.freenode.net 330 testib Enjolras Enjolras :is logged in as
10:31:35 <flo> do we know what that means?
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10:31:50 <clokep> You think I have all the numerics memorized? :P
10:32:01 <flo> no :)
10:32:10 <clokep> It's non-standard first off...
10:32:13 <flo> I'm wondering what ":is logged in as" means
10:32:19 <flo> I saw that on #test in freenode
10:32:30 <clokep> "RPL_WHOWAS_TIME"
10:32:46 <clokep> Ah no...it's "RPL_WHOISACCOUNT"
10:32:55 <clokep> So the info is...<nick> <authname> :<info> 
10:33:23 <flo> could that authname be the main nick if nick is a grouped nick?
10:33:28 <flo> or is this just completely pointless?
10:33:29 <clokep> I think so, yes.
10:33:46 <flo> when both are the same it seems pointless
10:34:51 <clokep> Yeah, here we go: Unhandled IRC message: :card.freenode.net 330 clokep Erendur|OFF Erendur :is logged in as
10:35:19 <flo> would it make sense to make /join work without argument if executed from a parted room?
10:35:31 <flo> (to do the exact opposite of /part)
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10:36:20 <flo> clokep: do you think it's worth filing a bug to support that 330 response some day?
10:36:31 <clokep> Yes, I can do it if you don't.
10:36:43 <flo> heh, if you do it for me it's even better :)
10:37:10 <clokep> Finally got the mozilla.support.instantbird password!
10:39:40 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1627 filed by goofyfr@gmail.com.
10:39:43 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1627 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, [fr] proofreading purple directory files
10:40:02 <flo> :)
10:40:31 <instantbot> goofyfr@gmail.com requested review from vicnett@gmail.com for attachment 1796 on bug 1627.
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10:44:15 <instantbot> New Core - IRC bug 1628 filed by clokep@gmail.com.
10:44:17 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1628 min, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Unhandled IRC message: 330 RPL_WHOISACCOUNT
10:44:54 <flo> I wonder if anybody has any idea of how we could look at that accessibility bug
10:50:10 <clokep> Nope...
10:50:22 <aleth> flo: I am not http://freecode.com/users/fqueze ;)
10:50:36 <flo> aleth: and?
10:50:48 <aleth> It won't let me post anything.
10:50:54 <flo> really?
10:51:10 <aleth> Maybe because I didn't have an account before.
10:51:56 <flo> worst case, pastebin what you wanted to send :)
10:54:06 <instantbot> New Core - XMPP bug 1629 filed by jonrandy@gmail.com.
10:54:09 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1629 cri, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Facebook disconnecting silently whilst still appearing connected
10:54:12 <aleth> It's gone :-/
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11:33:57 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1630 filed by goofyfr@gmail.com.
11:34:00 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1630 enh, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, [fr] Fixing 2 typos in faq
11:34:17 <instantbot> goofyfr@gmail.com requested review from vicnett@gmail.com for attachment 1797 on bug 1630.
11:45:56 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1631 filed by goofyfr@gmail.com.
11:45:58 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1631 tri, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, [fr] fixing vos besoin > vos besoins
11:46:07 <instantbot> goofyfr@gmail.com requested review from vicnett@gmail.com for attachment 1798 on bug 1631.
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11:48:10 <clokep_work> aleth: Do we have a bug on file about having participants go inactive again after a certain period of time?
11:49:21 <aleth> clokep_work: I don't think so
11:52:01 * clokep_work frowns at bug 1629.
11:52:04 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1629 cri, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Facebook disconnecting silently whilst still appearing connected
11:53:58 <aleth> Didn't someone report this for gtalk too once? I'm not sure...
12:00:40 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1632 filed by clokep@gmail.com.
12:00:43 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1632 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Mark participants as inactive after XXX time
12:01:01 <flo> aleth: "It's gone :-/" usually after submitting a form, if you press "back" the content of the form is still there ;)
12:01:56 <flo> shouldn't the messages also become "context" if we mark the participants as inactive,
12:01:57 <flo> ?
12:02:23 <flo> about bug 1629; couldn't this be because the user is using a connection that drops sockets that haven't received anything for a while?
12:02:26 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1629 cri, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Facebook disconnecting silently whilst still appearing connected
12:02:35 <flo> (ie we would need to send ping stanzas to the server to keep the socket alive)
12:03:14 <flo> the 3G of my phone does that, it's super annoying. My ssh connections are cut after a few minutes if I don't do anything with them, and ssh notices only when trying to send something in the connection.
12:03:57 <clokep_work> That's plausible, ye.s
12:04:26 <flo> re bug 1632, 5 minutes? really?
12:04:29 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1632 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Mark participants as inactive after XXX time
12:04:41 <clokep_work> I have no idea if you think that's too long or too short. :)
12:05:07 <flo> I would have expected an hour or two ;)
12:05:36 <clokep_work> 42 minutes? :P
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12:05:45 <flo> clokep_work: perfect!
12:05:48 <flo> that's the answer!
12:05:51 <aleth> ok :)
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12:09:06 <barlas> When using IRC, is there any way to make any channel (that I have already joined) connect on startup?
12:10:03 <flo> barlas: in the account manager, open the properties of the account, and add the name of the channel in the "auto-joined channels" list (it's a coma separated list)
12:10:41 <barlas> flo: Thanks, I know I would sound too lazy when saying this, but I was looking for some context menu option for already joined channels.
12:11:35 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1633 filed by aletheia2@fastmail.fm.
12:11:35 <aleth> There you go
12:11:38 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1633 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Add "join this channel automatically on startup" checkbox to MUC conv-top context menu
12:11:40 <flo> barlas: I'm lazy too. I think we have a bug on file for that
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12:11:59 <flo> I'm sure I asked that feature several times
12:12:02 <barlas> flo: Atleast we have it now :)
12:12:20 <flo> barlas: bug 802
12:12:31 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=802 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Auto-join context menu item
12:12:58 <aleth> Ah, extra hyphen ;)
12:13:02 <flo> I think we haven't implemented it because we want to drop the auto-join feature instead
12:13:15 <flo> but implementing a good replacement will take time....
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12:13:57 <clokep_work> I think it's quite reasonable to add until session restore stuff works...
12:14:07 <barlas> Ah, session management, nice
12:14:19 <instantbot> aletheia2@fastmail.fm set the Resolution field on bug 1633 to DUPLICATE of bug 802.
12:14:21 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1633 nor, --, ---, nobody, RESO DUPLICATE, Add "join this channel automatically on startup" checkbox to MUC conv-top context menu
12:14:41 <barlas> I am not sure how it would work for IRC though.
12:15:12 * aleth hopes Mic will get around to finishing bug 958 soon
12:15:18 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=958 enh, --, ---, benediktp, ASSI, Show last messages (history) in new chat windows
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12:19:23 <flo> deOmega: good morning :)
12:20:11 <aleth> deOmega: you might want to submit your add-on for review so it can go public ;)
12:20:41 <clokep_work> barlas: How is IRC any different?
12:21:02 <deOmega> good morning all.
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12:23:20 <deOmega> aleth: Thank you.   WIll check on how to do that in a sec
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12:25:16 <barlas> clokep_work: I don't know how everyone uses it, so I said I am not sure :) But as for me, I often join channels for support or to find out more about some projects, which are supposed to be one time only, that is join channel, stay there as long as I am online, and most probably never go there again if I have a need.
12:25:38 <barlas> So, if session managemen works like in Firefox, it would automatically join all those channels for me, which I would have to logout :)
12:26:49 <clokep_work> Yes...?
12:27:00 <clokep_work> If you use it for a one time thing, wouldn't you part the channel?
12:28:18 <flo> clokep_work: he just said he doesn't
12:28:27 <flo> clokep_work: because he relies on the bug of his existing client
12:28:42 <barlas> flo: I consider that a feature :P
12:28:46 <flo> clokep_work: I do that too. I almost never close a tab. Neither on Firefox nor in Instantbird
12:29:10 * clokep_work shrugs
12:29:34 <flo> clokep_work: so I expect that restore feature to cause some frustration. I just believe the gain (in the general case) is more significant than the minor frustration (in corner case)
12:29:56 <barlas> BTW I am not saying session management wouldn't be a good idea.
12:30:34 <barlas> Yep, minor annoyance, and a need for change in normal work flow.
12:31:07 <barlas> Ofcourse, you can always come across some brilliant idea that gives us best of both worlds, but I can't think of anything like that now :)
12:32:03 <flo> barlas: I don't have any great idea yet for that
12:32:32 <flo> It will probably need to be discussed when someone actually starts the implement
12:32:34 <flo> *implementation
12:32:46 <flo> maybe it will need to be a pref that users can turn off
12:32:50 <clokep_work> I know people get a bit frustrated when using Instantbird to join random rooms in general (you need to create an account, set up the room you want to join, etc.)
12:33:01 <clokep_work> But I personally join the same stuff everyday, so that doesn't bother me. :-D
12:33:03 <flo> Session restore definitely make sense in some cases thought (for example, after an update, an add-on install, ...)
12:33:25 <deOmega> aleth:Ok, addon nominated :).  SO i am guessing you tested it without any issues?  :)
12:33:44 <flo> deOmega: nominating it requests that someone tests it ;).
12:34:39 <barlas> clokep_work: Other than X-Chat, most of the clients I've used don't have a server list, so I always have to add info for the server when joining new server, that isn't much more work than creating new account (though for clients that already have servers lists, creating account would definitely feel like a lot of work)
12:35:09 <barlas> Maybe you can add /server command, that would join the server on new tab (without disconnecting current one)
12:35:47 <clokep_work> No.
12:35:51 <deOmega> Ok,  cool.  You know what I would like.. is when someone does not have an avatar or when in a forum such as this... instead of showing  the adium icons... maybe it shows one of the IB icons.  I will look into it.
12:36:12 <clokep_work> (By the way if I do ever say "No." it usually means "I don't think so, but convince me.")
12:36:19 <deOmega> barlas: I think that MIRC has that also
12:36:54 <barlas> deOmega: mIRC still exists?
12:36:54 <flo> deOmega: the default icons are included in the message theme
12:36:59 <clokep_work> Also "join the server on new tab" doesn't really mean anything unless you tick off the little "Show server tab" option.
12:37:20 <flo> barlas: yeah, it's still causing significant pain to all developers trying to support IRC ;)
12:37:30 <barlas> heh
12:38:04 <flo> clokep_work: so, did my suggestion of /join without argument made sense or not?
12:38:22 <barlas> clokep_work: Most channels I visit are on freenode, which I join anyway, so I don't care about it much, but something like would make it easier for other users.
12:38:26 <deOmega> flo: Is there a place i can find various icons for IB that i can use?  I think I saw you post a variety of them at some point
12:38:44 <clokep_work> flo: I don't see this suggestion...
12:38:45 <flo> or is it just that it's pointless for users who don't spend half a day testing what happens in a list of participants when someone leaves and joins again?
12:39:06 <flo> clokep_work: http://log.bezut.info/instantbird/today#m171
12:39:29 <clokep_work> flo: Yes that makes sense.
12:39:45 <clokep_work> Want to write the patch? :P
12:39:51 <flo> clokep_work: I guess my question is: does it make enough sense to be worth implementing?
12:40:05 <clokep_work> flo: It would probably be a fairly simple patch so...I think so.
12:40:12 <flo> clokep_work: I'm afraid I would have a hard time justifying it's required for Tb15beta
12:40:30 <clokep_work> barlas: FYI we can't "connect" to a server without an account anyway, so /server would be a shortcut to create an account...and I'm really not a fan of that.
12:40:32 <flo> deOmega: do you mean http://www.instantbird.com/press-images.html#logo ?
12:40:56 <deOmega> YES!  Thank you
12:41:24 <instantbot> New Core - IRC bug 1634 filed by florian@instantbird.org.
12:41:27 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1634 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, The /join IRC command should work without argument when typed in a parted room.
12:41:32 <barlas> clokep_work: Can't there be a hidden temporary account, created by /server and then deleted on next startup?
12:41:37 <deOmega> that will work, since i am using the nightlies
12:41:43 <flo> barlas: that sounds like something super confusing
12:42:15 <barlas> flo: Not for users, they won't even know those accounts exist :)
12:42:25 <barlas> They would just be joining servers without need for creating an account.
12:42:35 <flo> barlas: how do you disconnect it? See if there's an error?
12:42:42 <clokep_work> I'm not really a fan of supporting behavior that I view as "broken". :-/
12:42:56 <flo> I would just r- and move on ;)
12:43:16 <clokep_work> And confusing for developers is also important! :)
12:43:51 <flo> or if someone manages to really convince me that it could be worth supporting, I would require tons of unit tests for that mis-feature
12:44:11 <flo> because it's guaranteed that developers will never think about it when implementing other things later
12:44:19 <barlas> :D
12:50:43 <barlas> Gaim used to have a smileys set, that showed different emoticons for each protocol.
12:50:50 <barlas> I don't think Pidgin has it anymore
12:50:57 <flo> barlas: I think it still does
12:51:04 <barlas> Is it possible to have something like that for Instantbird?
12:51:19 <barlas> Hmm... I thought they removed it.
12:51:21 <flo> barlas: I also think it's a mis-feature. But it's largely debatable (ie different people will have different opinions on it).
12:51:36 <barlas> How is it a mis-feature? :)
12:51:37 <flo> barlas: if you want an add-on to support that, go ahead
12:51:55 <barlas> MSN uses :D, while yahoo has :)) 
12:52:19 <flo> barlas: it makes things more complicated. We try to make the protocol differences irrelevant, so showing different emoticons when the conversation with the same contact switches to a different protocol would be confusing
12:52:28 <barlas> I would want to use the correct smiley when chatting with people on those protocols, who are most probably using official client.
12:52:32 <flo> barlas: instantbird has both :D and :)
12:52:46 <barlas> :)) is actually like :D
12:52:51 <barlas> two ))
12:52:54 <flo> barlas: yeah, it makes sense only if you expect the person at the other end to use the official client.
12:53:01 <flo> barlas: none of my friends do of course ;).
12:53:05 <barlas> heh
12:53:15 <barlas> Statistically speaking, majority still uses the official client.
12:53:38 <-- deOmega has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
12:53:40 <flo> arguing based on statistics that don't exist seem that you don't have a point, sorry :-P.
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12:54:14 <barlas> flo: Come on, you should know more than half the statistics are made up anyway :)
12:54:14 <flo> so, the tb participants list seems less broken than I thought
12:54:39 <deOmega> testing (ignore please)
12:54:44 <flo> barlas: I studied sociology, so I know some people spend an insane amount of time doing real statistics ;).
12:54:55 <flo> deOmega: what if we don't want to ignore and reply to you? :-P
12:55:19 <deOmega> OK,  got it working fine.  thanks flo, will update the addon on the site with this.
12:56:01 <deOmega> If you did not want to reply ... then I would be making it easier, as i was saying  to ignore my response, as opposed to ignore your desire :)
12:56:21 <deOmega> lol,   man
12:56:31 <deOmega> i messed up,  misread your reply lol
12:56:32 <flo> uh
12:56:34 * flo is confused
12:56:51 <deOmega> I misread your message
12:57:09 <deOmega> was trying to be funny, but i started it on a misunderstanding
12:58:11 <clokep_work> flo: Participants list is messed up...? Code wise or?
12:58:19 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1635 filed by jamie@nvaccess.org.
12:58:24 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1635 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Pressing applications key/shift+f10 on tab focuses input box
12:59:03 <flo> clokep_work: just the "inactive" attribute that's messed up, I was afraid there were other issues
13:00:18 <flo> is shift+f10 a standard shortcut we were supposed to know?
13:01:25 <clokep_work> Firefox uses it apparently...
13:01:57 <flo> and I assume you can reproduce the bug?
13:02:12 <flo> the kepress event on the tab seems to focus the input box
13:02:12 <deOmega> ok,   finished with the  upload and everything.  Thanks for the help guys.  feels really good to be able to share an experience.
13:02:19 <flo> :)
13:02:36 <clokep_work> flo: On Firefox is always focuses the webpage so... :-S
13:02:49 <flo> it doesn't open the context menu either?
13:04:14 <deOmega> the instantbird icon is much more appropriate than the Adium ..  Time for work.
13:04:16 <clokep_work> It does, but it opens it on the webpage.
13:04:58 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1636 filed by jamie@nvaccess.org.
13:05:00 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1636 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, accessibility: Context menu for input box not exposed via accessibility APIs
13:08:42 <clokep_work> Well I guess it's good to have someone file accessibility bugs at least. :)
13:09:00 <clokep_work> What is "the applications key" btw?
13:09:25 <flo> the key with a small menu icon
13:09:36 <flo> the key that opens the context menu :)
13:09:48 <clokep_work> Ah...I didn't know anyone used that key.
13:09:53 <flo> I think it was added for Windows 95 at the same time as the Windows key
13:10:57 <-- sonny has quit (Ping timeout)
13:11:00 <-- deOmega has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
13:13:22 <clokep_work> flo: Do we hvae a bug on file about auto-switching users of a merged contact after a certain amount of time?
13:13:34 <flo> probably
13:13:48 <flo> I think that was wanted 0.2 or 0.3 and became just wanted
13:14:06 <clokep_work> OK.
13:15:41 <flo> bug 742 ?
13:15:45 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=742 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Change conversation target automatically when buddies' availability changes
13:16:14 <clokep_work> There it is. :)
13:18:15 <barlas> Hmm... does that make sense?
13:18:26 <barlas> I mean what would be the actual use case of this issue?
13:18:46 <barlas> As far as I have seen, people login all there account from same place.
13:19:09 <flo> then you haven't seen enough
13:19:17 <barlas> Quite possible
13:19:17 <flo> and some protocol sometimes have server issues
13:19:40 <barlas> Oh, I was thinking of going away, didn't think of one account getting disconnected.
13:20:31 <barlas> Still, I would be interested in knowing any real-life case where it would be useful, for my general knowledge :)
13:20:50 <clokep_work> I talk to most of my friends on AIM generally.
13:20:58 <flo> someone connecting 5 accounts from Instantbird at the office, and only one account from a phone
13:21:08 <flo> would be nice to switch to the phone when the desktop client is idle
13:21:10 <clokep_work> They leave their computers and eventually go idle on it, but their phone is still set to away...I'd love for my messages to automatically switch to using GTalk.
13:23:06 <barlas> clokep_work: Where would the message go in that case? One is idle, other is away
13:23:20 <clokep_work> Away > Idle.
13:23:20 <flo> barlas: away is more available than idle
13:23:32 <barlas> Ah oka
13:23:45 <clokep_work> (Which is fairly common in IM clients. :))
13:23:49 <flo> barlas: but if that confuses you, just assume the user was available on Gtalk on the phone
13:24:37 <flo> clokep_work: it's debatable. One can argue that it's more OK to IM someone who is idle (ie won't receive the message immediately) than someone who explicitly said he didn't want to be disturbed.
13:25:04 <clokep_work> But then you get into the debate of whether DND and "Away" are different. :-D
13:25:11 <barlas> Well, most people I know who actually care about enough to login on IM account on phone, either have just one accoount, or they login on all of them :) I need a bigger sample in contacts
13:25:19 <barlas> clokep_work: They are! :)
13:25:36 <flo> clokep_work: yeah, I don't want that debate. I was just saying that it's not completely obvious that away > idle, and it's more a design decision we made.
13:25:56 <barlas> Busy == DND, Away == leave me a message, I will check it when I am back. At least that is how I perceive them.
13:25:59 <clokep_work> Yeah, I guess.
13:26:22 <clokep_work> barlas: Bigger issue is that not all protocols support those as two separate statuses.
13:26:42 <flo> of that gtalk sets the status to away when the user is idle
13:26:44 <barlas> Yeah, I don't like those protocols :)
13:27:21 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1637 filed by jamie@nvaccess.org.
13:27:23 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1637 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, accessibility: Lists in main window are unlabelled
13:35:55 <barlas> What does "unlabelled in terms of accessibility" means?
13:37:32 <clokep_work> It means they need to have an extra parameter for screen readers.
13:38:03 <-- goofy has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2 -- http://www.instantbird.com)
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13:38:31 <barlas> Ok
13:38:52 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org requested review from aletheia2@fastmail. fm for attachment 1799 on bug 1637.
13:38:54 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1637 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, accessibility: Lists in main window are unlabelled
13:39:11 <flo> I picked aleth at random, but if clokep_work or Mic want to steal the review, feel free
13:39:33 <clokep_work> Well they're not here so...
13:39:55 <flo> I don't think I'll check it in today even if it's r+ed so it doesn't matter if they are there ;)
13:40:31 <flo> it's nice to have someone doing some real accessibility testing :)
13:40:51 <clokep_work> control would just focus the element I assume?
13:41:06 <clokep_work> Ah, yes.
13:41:09 <clokep_work> That's what the description says. :)
13:41:11 <flo> yes, control is the non-accessible-specific way to link a label with something
13:41:35 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com granted review for attachment 1799 on bug 1637.
13:41:38 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1637 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, accessibility: Lists in main window are unlabelled
13:43:28 --> sonny has joined #instantbird
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13:56:42 <clokep_work> Haha so being listed on planet change my page view per post from ~30 to 200 so far...
13:56:52 <clokep_work> (Although my why rewrite IRC post has almost 1000 views)
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13:58:37 <roflo1> Just dropped by to say that auto-update worked like a charm.
13:59:37 <flo> uh, I thought roflo1 was GeekShadow :-S
14:00:01 <flo> "my why rewrite IRC post has almost 1000 views" but not in a single day ;)
14:03:32 <dew> link me please
14:04:08 <flo> I should create a blog in English and get it on planet too
14:04:20 <flo> that way we could broadcast each release announcement twice instead of once ;)
14:06:01 <clokep_work> My IRC specs rant has a good amount too. :)
14:06:04 <clokep_work> flo: You should. :)
14:06:27 <clokep_work> dew: http://clokep.blogspot.com/2010/12/why-rewrite-irc-into-javascript.html and http://clokep.blogspot.com/2011/04/why-rewrite-irc-protocol-plugin-part-2.html
14:06:34 <clokep_work> I guess the first part is really the interesting part.
14:09:20 --> ea4eoz has joined #instantbird
14:10:21 <clokep_work> The second part goes more into some plans...half of which are probably done?
14:10:26 <clokep_work> I should probably re-read it and see what isn't done. :-D
14:11:02 <flo> deprecating ChatZilla from the mind of lots of Mozilla people
14:12:09 <dew> I didn't know chatzilla was so dead
14:12:57 <clokep_work> It's used a lot still. ;)
14:13:39 <flo> clokep_work: wasn't it your plan?
14:14:21 <clokep_work> Yes. :)
14:14:45 <dew> I agree with you rewriting it
14:14:47 <clokep_work> And luckily I wasn't banned from #chatzilla. ;)
14:14:55 <dew> I know I see people use it a lot
14:15:00 <flo> why do you feel lucky for that?
14:15:07 <dew> hey if you can write a better IRC implementation go for it
14:15:25 <flo> dew: isn't it already done? ;)
14:15:26 <dew> like you said, flo there's a lack of good IRC on multiplatform clients
14:15:27 <dew> oh
14:15:31 <dew> I thought it was WIP
14:15:35 <dew> sry
14:15:43 <flo> dew: it was until we released 1.2 yesterday ;)
14:15:54 <dew> ah I need to use it more
14:15:59 <dew> it's just hard to change
14:16:43 <clokep_work> I mean...everything is a WIP, but it's released. :)
14:16:50 <clokep_work> It has a few TODO comments in it though!
14:17:06 <flo> clokep_work: at least there's no more XXX :)
14:18:07 <clokep_work> :)
14:18:21 <barlas> Songbird is alive?
14:18:36 * barlas is reading clokep_work's blog post
14:18:53 <flo> barlas: nightingale is
14:18:55 <clokep_work> barlas: You probably want to look at the date on that blog post.
14:19:04 <barlas> heh
14:19:09 <barlas> 2010, that's old!
14:19:16 <clokep_work> Songbird is the only gecko app to totally disappoint me. :(
14:19:51 <flo> are you disappointed by the app or the company behind it? ;)
14:22:05 <clokep_work> Both.
14:22:11 * clokep_work is hoping Nightingale works out.
14:25:18 <barlas> Looks nice, though the amount of music I hear, VLC works good enough for me.
14:29:20 <flo> do we have a bug to have the topic of conversations in the tooltip? (for conversation tabs, and conversations on hold)
14:29:45 <flo> when I see a cropped topic that looks interesting in a conversation on hold, I'm always surprised that I don't see the full topic when hovering
14:32:11 <clokep_work> You see the full topic if you hover the topic.
14:32:23 <clokep_work> I'm always surprised that conversations have crappy tooltips though, yes.
14:32:26 <clokep_work> And I think hwe ave a bug.
14:32:38 <spiffytech> I'm trying to connect Instantbird to my ZNC IRC bouncer but I'm getting "connection closed by server", and I don't know why because I've configured Instantbird the same as my other IRC clients. Possible complications include the server requiring a password (which I've entered), using SSL (which I've checked the box for), and using a self-signed cert (does Instantbird validate certs?)
14:32:58 <flo> clokep_work: the tooltips are crappy in general, not only for conversations
14:33:28 <flo> spiffytech: instantbird validates certs
14:33:36 <clokep_work> flo: bug 1196
14:33:39 <flo> spiffytech: you need to add the cert from the advanced tab of the preference window
14:33:39 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1196 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Chat tooltips should contain the topic
14:34:41 <flo> clokep_work: maybe when we are about to file the same bug again, it means we should get it fixed? .)
14:36:38 <clokep_work> flo: I think so. :)
14:36:52 <clokep_work> I'm always scared ot modifying tooltips as "they're going to be redesigned"...
14:37:19 <flo> is anybody actually doing it though? :)
14:37:25 <flo> + you always dislike UI bugs ;)
14:37:47 <clokep_work> Yes, I do. :-/
14:37:54 <clokep_work> I'm not very good at XUL.
14:38:06 <flo> bwinton seemed to think otherwise ;)
14:38:09 <clokep_work>  / I'm lazy with the amount of work UI stuff needs...
14:38:32 <clokep_work> Mostly because I argued XUL is awesome so I had to prove it. :-D
14:39:46 <clokep_work> But I meant more of I don't like to stand up a full UI from scratch.
14:40:46 <flo> I'm starting to really hate "Bug 779453 Styling for active participants is lost when changing chatrooms"
14:40:59 <flo> I seem to always break something in the syntax, and the XBL binding won't load anymore
14:41:04 <flo> without error of course
14:44:17 <spiffytech> flo: Yep, that was it. Tracked down the ZNC .pem file, imported it under "servers", edited the cert to be trusted (that should probably be the default when importing certs) and everything worked.
14:45:06 <flo> "that should probably be the default when importing certs" the cert UI sucks, we know it, but we don't maintain it, it's a part of the mozilla platform.
14:45:14 <flo> spiffytech: glad it works now :)
14:45:44 <clokep_work> spiffytech: Ideally it would have popped up with a cert warning...but that's currently not implemented...:-/
14:46:11 <barlas> flo: Then you need to submit the patch upstream :P
14:46:15 * barlas hides from flo
14:46:16 <flo> clokep_work: just being able to display in the account manager that the account is disconnect because of a cert issue would already be much better than "server closed the connection" ;)
14:46:29 * flo volunteers barlas to write the patch
14:46:37 <clokep_work> Yes. :)
14:46:47 <clokep_work> barlas: We contributed a significant amount of patches upstream.
14:46:54 <clokep_work> s/d//.
14:47:08 <flo> barlas: I recently fixed the idle service :)
14:47:11 <barlas> flo: That is why I hid, I knew you were going to volunteer me :)
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14:47:58 <clokep_work> Ah wnayes is up early today! :-D
14:48:15 <flo> :)
14:48:18 <wnayes> Not by much :)
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14:53:33 <flo> clokep_work: are we aiming for a 1.3 release in 3 months? ;)
14:53:41 <clokep_work> flo: I hope so.
14:53:52 <clokep_work> Probably while I'm traveling for work...:P
14:54:09 <flo> pssst, excuses for not releasing ;)
14:55:05 --> wnayes has joined #instantbird
14:56:04 * flo keeps finding bugs related to tb's right pane
14:56:39 <barlas> Can we add contacts in IRC?
14:56:48 <flo> wufds
14:56:50 <flo> oopx
14:56:54 <flo> *sure
14:56:55 <flo> *oops
14:56:56 <flo> :-D
14:57:18 <barlas> How does it work?
14:57:24 <flo> magic ;)
14:57:30 <barlas> I added one and it hasn't showed up :(
14:58:40 --> Optimizer has joined #instantbird
14:58:41 <barlas> Nevermind, it was related to that other bug, where I have to show/hide some lists before they show up.
14:58:44 <-- Optimizer has quit (Input/output error)
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14:59:17 <clokep_work> barlas: Are you using Instantbird 1.2 or 1.3a1pre?
14:59:25 <clokep_work> If so...this is an unknown bug.
14:59:26 <barlas> 1.2
14:59:42 <clokep_work> Although IRC contacts can take a minute or so to show up.
14:59:54 <clokep_work> (Depending on the server.)
14:59:55 <barlas> Or that could be the reason
15:00:36 <barlas> I had some issue with adding GTalk contacts, and I filed a bug for that. (flo commented on that too)
15:01:04 <flo> clokep_work: it's known but unfiled
15:01:16 <flo> barlas: ah, remember the bug number? :)
15:01:25 <barlas> 1572
15:01:25 <clokep_work> How am I supposed to know stuff if it's not in my database? :P
15:01:31 <clokep_work> instantbot: bug 1572
15:01:31 <flo> clokep_work: it's the "Other Contacts" group that sucks
15:01:35 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1572 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, New Gtalk contacts added doesn't show up in Contact list
15:02:51 <clokep_work> Ah, right.
15:02:56 <clokep_work> So that's not really an XMPP bug, right?
15:03:58 <flo> the bug I have in mind isn't
15:04:25 <flo> what's described in that report is quite confusing though, so we could as were resolve it as incomplete and file a clean bug for the issue of the "Other contacts" group with new contacts
15:04:49 <flo> *as well
15:07:27 <flo> I think I finally have a working patch for that issue with nicks becoming inactive when switching the displayed conversation.
15:07:28 <flo> http://pastebin.instantbird.com/60544
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15:12:40 <flo> clokep_work: do you want to review that patch, or do you prefer if it goes to bwinton's queue? :)
15:13:52 <clokep_work> flo: It can go in mine.
15:14:04 <clokep_work> It looks fairly straightforward.
15:14:06 <flo> Blake will love you :)
15:14:10 <clokep_work> (Although I could see it being awful to write.)
15:14:31 <flo> I need to check it in tomorrow.
15:14:44 <flo> it or a fixed version of it of course :)
15:15:29 <barlas> Why do you guys use etherpad for discussing future features/issues?
15:15:49 <flo> sometimes yes
15:15:51 <barlas> Wouldn't a wiki be much better, and it will also keep the record and would be helpful for users?
15:16:02 <barlas> I mean the wiki you already have :)
15:16:02 <flo> no to all the points in that sentence
15:16:17 <barlas> :(
15:16:56 <barlas> Can I add stuff in it? :P
15:17:00 <flo> wikis are painful and slow to edit, make collaboration very difficult (hard to edit the same sentence at the same time), and are pointless for users
15:17:51 <clokep_work> flo: It's obnoxious that all the conversations share the same binding or whatever.
15:17:52 <flo> barlas: you mean the 1-3 etherpad? You can add stuff in it, but if you do, you are mostly volunteering to do that stuff.
15:18:11 <barlas> There is too much volunteering in this channel :)
15:18:23 <clokep_work> barlas: We're all volunteers on Instantbird.
15:18:25 <barlas> I wanted to recommend 'Sort by Status' for integration
15:18:44 <flo> barlas: just, telling others what they should work on is rude, and very likely to discourage work on that specific point ;).
15:18:55 <barlas> heh
15:18:58 <flo> except if you are paying these people to do what you want
15:19:04 <clokep_work> barlas: That won't be integrated.
15:19:06 <barlas> Well, I am future volunteer, does that count? :)
15:19:11 <clokep_work> It's like the ideal situation for an add-on.
15:19:19 <barlas> Ok
15:19:26 <clokep_work> (Simple, requires no options, etc.)
15:19:30 <clokep_work> At least in my mind. :-D
15:19:34 <flo> barlas: you can add filtering the contact list in that pad if you want, and think you will work on it in the next 3 months ;)
15:19:39 <clokep_work> I should probably update it so it's not 0.1*pre* though.
15:20:11 <barlas> I use Status Reminder, but I am with whoever said "I'm not sure this should be integrated"
15:20:12 <clokep_work> Some of that pad is "eventually"...which we kind of just brain dumped stuff we' had talked about previously to make sure we got bugs filed.
15:20:39 <flo> clokep_work: each conversation has its own imconversation binding, but there's only one conv-top-info binding for all of them, and only one list of participants.
15:20:51 <flo> and yes, it's not pleasant to work with that
15:20:56 <barlas> flo: I would probably start working on it in couple of week
15:21:20 <flo> and as we rebuild the whole participant list each time a conversation is selected, good luck using an #ubuntu conversation :-D
15:21:48 <barlas> I liked Google's Wave for collaborating, it would've been great if they kept developing it.
15:22:17 <flo> barlas: as clokep_work just said "we kind of just brain dumped stuff we' had talked about previously". So the pad is really not a place to add a feature with the hope that we will believe that because it's listed there it's wanted.
15:22:59 <flo> (we would just remove it from the pad the next time we read it anyway ;))
15:23:26 <clokep_work> flo what is c-c's policy on 80 char lines?
15:24:06 <flo> clokep_work: I think it's the same as ours, ie "avoid whenever possible, but it's ok if there's a few more characters, or if breaking the line would make things confusing"
15:24:07 <clokep_work> barlas: "road maps" to us are very fluid, people kind of just work on what they're interested in.
15:24:41 <barlas> Yeah, I realize that, this is how most open source development works.
15:26:03 <flo> clokep_work: maybe an isBuddyActive method?
15:26:19 <clokep_work> flo: That could work.
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15:27:13 * flo wonders if NmN will come back in a second with 1.2 :)
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15:34:11 <clokep_work> Guess not. ;)
15:35:31 <clokep_work> Soo....I can mass add email address to mozilla.support.instantbird. I think we should do that, send an email out to instantbird-contact@googlegroups.com and then make that group read only.
15:36:15 <flo> we should redirect contact @ ib.org first
15:37:13 <flo> I requested review again so that you can double check the result, but I guess I could have carried forward the r+
15:39:19 <clokep_work> flo: Looks good.
15:43:03 <flo> oooh, a Bonjour crash: http://crash-stats.instantbird.com/report/index/68fb1e86-ebe1-44b2-a82b-d7da02120809 :)
15:44:10 <barlas> Are there any plans for email notification for GTalk?
15:44:36 <flo> clokep_work: are you really sure you want to know if that guy has any other issue? ;)
15:44:42 <flo> clokep_work: thanks for the quick review! :)
15:44:51 <clokep_work> flo: I like to be polite. :)
15:45:04 <clokep_work> barlas: Maybe if someone comes up with a good UI for mail notifications.
15:45:08 <clokep_work> (And implements it. :-D)
15:45:33 <flo> wasn't there some code related to new email notifications in Varuna's Gtalk code?
15:46:06 <clokep_work> Yes.
15:46:14 <clokep_work> It spawned a conversation and gae you the subjects or something.
15:48:15 <barlas> Oooh, Long term goals: 
15:48:16 <barlas> - some video/audio chat in JS-XMPP with WebRTC 
15:48:55 <barlas> instantbot: bug 1565
15:48:58 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1565 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Pastebin integration
15:49:27 <barlas> Isn't that more of an addon thing?
15:54:29 <clokep_work> I don't think anyone ever said that list was all for core stuff. ;)
15:54:36 <clokep_work> But it is something we want in core, I think.
15:55:32 <flo> barlas: I think we want it in core, but may do an add-on first to experiment with it until it's ready for inclusion by default
15:55:43 <clokep_work> Mostly because of people coming in here and trying to paste long error reports. :-D
15:55:50 <barlas> Well, as long as it is optional :)
15:56:12 <flo> barlas: yeah, we need to figure out a good UI so that it isn't in the wa
15:56:14 <flo> y
15:56:39 <flo> and I wanted to create a pastebin site for it, to control the UI on that side too
15:58:39 <clokep_work> One that isn't ugly and sucky. :D
15:59:13 <flo> and with an instantbird logo, and some ads ( :-[ )
16:00:48 <flo> I would like it to be served over https
16:02:17 <flo> so the freshmeat post is still not done?
16:03:02 <flo> clokep_work: "Turn on automatic updates" is the same thing as "remove "force" in the update.instantbird.org section
16:03:34 <flo> update requests fetch an update.xml file, and when the user has done the check from the UI (as opposed to a background check), the requested file is update.xml?force=1
16:04:20 <flo> in the update database we have a force column, and if force is != 0 in the database, updates will be offered only if the force parameter was present in the request
16:06:13 <clokep_work> I see. :)
16:06:29 <dew> this is what I listen to when I code, flo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6EfhAFA2yFE
16:06:42 <dew> I need some sort of background noise to focus
16:15:16 <clokep_work> flo: No one has posted on it yet and I still can't figure out how to log in so...
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16:19:17 <flo> what's so difficult about it?
16:20:18 <flo> anyway, if someone has a 600-chars text I can use for the release notes, I can trivially post it ;)
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16:39:22 <clokep_work> flo: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/60585
16:40:11 <flo> I think there's already a link to the full release notes on freshmeat
16:41:43 <clokep_work> http://pastebin.instantbird.com/60586? :P
16:43:28 <flo> perfect, thanks
16:43:30 <flo> "Your release has been submitted for verification. This process typically takes less than 24 hours."
16:44:27 <clokep_work> 600 characters is small...hah.
16:44:33 <flo> yes :)
16:44:44 <flo> it's always difficult to keep something within that limit
16:52:23 <clokep_work> :) So the notifications on the wiki..
16:52:33 <clokep_work> I'll attempt to update some of that stuff soon, but it probably won't be today.
16:53:18 <flo> it won't stop me from sleeping if that list isn't up to date :)
16:54:04 <flo> what remains to be done for bug 1503
16:54:12 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1503 enh, --, ---, florian, NEW, Update add-ons on AIO for Instantbird 1.2
16:56:00 <clokep_work> flo: Testing of Colorize (and uploading a screenshot, pushing it to public, etc.)
16:56:04 <clokep_work> And testing of Highlight.
16:57:31 <clokep_work> Highlight could probably be spun into a different bug.
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18:25:16 <clokep_work> We removing the force today?
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20:40:47 <flo> clokep: want me to remove force now?
20:42:30 <clokep> flo: Sure. :) But I won't be around to fix it if it's a mistake. ;)
20:44:45 <flo> if it's a mistake it will be too late
20:45:04 <flo> within 24 hours a very significant proportions of our 1.1 users should be updated
20:45:11 <flo> (and our win2000 users will be screwed :-S)
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20:50:21 <clokep> :-/
20:50:32 <clokep> It's almost 13 years old, I don't feel too bad. :-]
20:55:01 <aleth> Are there any win2k users? Do you get that info from update pings?
20:57:58 <flo> yes
20:58:04 <flo> I just looked
20:58:38 <flo> both today and yesterday, we receive one update ping for a Win200 cs and a Win2000 it
20:58:51 <aleth> Impressive in a way... 
20:59:38 <flo> we screwed someone today already "1.1/20111014141651/WINNT_x86-msvc/en-US/release/Windows_NT 5.0/update-force.xml"
21:00:20 <flo> and yesterday there was already a user of the pl locale who forced a check for update from win2000
21:00:32 <flo> we won't screw this one; we haven't released pl for 1.2 :)
21:00:44 <aleth> Huh, that's quite a few users then considering
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21:02:35 <flo> 2 OS X 10.5 users checked for updates yesterday from 1.1. One en-us, one es-ES
21:03:19 <flo> 4 today
21:03:29 <flo> we still do have 10.5 users apparently
21:03:41 * clokep needs to get going.
21:03:44 <clokep> Have a good weekend all!
21:03:59 <aleth> umm... its not quite Friday yet ;)
21:04:01 <flo> clokep: have a nice week-end, talk to you in a week! :)
21:04:31 * aleth likes clokep's definition of weekend
21:04:39 <aleth> have a good holiday! :)
21:05:10 <flo> I think my week-end will start with the top of https://etherpad.mozilla.org/tb-im-beta-fixup will be empty
21:05:14 <clokep> aleth: After work on a Thursday during  the summer == weekend.
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21:06:21 <flo> bah, users of XP pre SP2 are screwed anyway
21:06:38 <flo> 1.1 didn't send the full version number, only the major+minor (ie 5.1 for XP)
21:06:54 <flo> 1.2 sends the full number
21:09:48 <flo> there doesn't seem to be any PPC user
21:10:00 <aleth> well that's something ;)
21:12:53 <flo> this is the list of OS versions for which we have received update pings from an 1.2 build: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/60656
21:13:44 <flo> uh, there's an update ping from 1.2 from a Windows 2000: Windows_NT (x86)
21:13:49 <flo> very surprising
21:14:05 <flo> I thought it couldn't start :-S
21:14:25 <aleth> it actually runs?
21:14:25 <flo> I don't understand the linux version numbers
21:14:28 <aleth> wow...
21:14:43 <flo> or is 3.5.0 actually a valid kernel version?
21:15:02 <flo> last time I looked at linux kernel versions, they were numbers like 2.4 or 2.6 :-S
21:15:15 <aleth> no, I think 3.4.x is current
21:15:22 <aleth> so 3.5 is surprising...
21:15:36 <aleth> Whether you are actually using a new kernel depends on the distro though
21:15:50 <aleth> some are more conservative than others in updating...
21:15:53 <flo> I think 2n are stable versions and 2n+1 are development versions
21:16:20 <aleth> 3.6-rc1 is the latest unstable release
21:16:49 <flo> I don't even know what are our minimum system requirements on linux
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21:17:47 <aleth> Probably only in terms of libraries required...
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21:19:03 <aleth> So there are some linux IB users out there with quite cutting-edge distros...
21:23:14 <flo> people playing with arch? ;)
21:23:29 <flo> people using nightlies may have even more cutting edge distros :)
21:24:40 <aleth> huh, what is gnome OS ?! 
21:25:07 <aleth> do they want to be a distro now?
21:25:25 <aleth> ^^ sorry, wrong tab
21:25:42 <flo> same thing for nightlies: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/60657
21:26:22 <aleth> What's Darwin 9.8?
21:26:44 <flo> uh, "Windows_NT 5.0 (x64)" Did windows 2000 ever exist in 64 bit version? :-S
21:26:49 <flo> aleth: Mac OS X 10.5
21:27:26 <flo> well, 10.5.8 actually
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21:31:14 <EionRobb> apparently there are 64bit versions of win2k :)
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21:47:32 <aleth> 1241 downloads... I wonder how many are new users (probably not that many)
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21:51:55 <flo> aleth: well, all the users who clicked "check for updates" aren't counted anywhere :)
21:52:03 <flo> neither in the downloads, nor in the update pings
21:53:21 <aleth> heh, dark matter in the stats ;)
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