All times are UTC.
00:48:32 --> clokep has joined #instantbird 00:48:32 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep 01:28:28 <clokep> Anyone where? 01:28:30 <clokep> *here 01:31:31 <Mook> where? 01:34:26 <clokep> Want to proofread https://etherpad.mozilla.org/ib1-2-releasenotes ? :P 01:39:26 <-- myk has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 01:42:26 <Mook> looks good. was there some importing stuff too? 01:42:44 <clokep> No, wnayes hasn't finished that quite yet. :) 01:43:26 <clokep> Thanks though. :) 01:45:30 <Mook> ah. yeah, I wasn't sure, that's why I asked instead of just adding to the docs :) 01:48:16 <wnayes> Hopefully next release :) 01:48:58 <clokep> :) I hope so too! 01:55:48 <-- wnayes has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 01:59:46 --> ivan has joined #instantbird 02:09:11 <clokep> flo: So I think the release notes are good, but I'd really like someone else (you, aleth and/or Mic) to reread them before I put all the effort into converting it to HTML. :-/ 02:09:23 <clokep> And I'm unsure what to do now, but I'm tempted to levae it until tomorrow. 02:09:27 <clokep> Redoing that work will be painful. 02:10:01 <instant-buildbot> build #583 of linux-nightly-default is complete: Failure [failed shell] Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/linux-nightly-default/builds/583 02:10:06 <instant-buildbot> build #575 of macosx-nightly-default is complete: Failure [failed shell] Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/macosx-nightly-default/builds/575 02:41:05 --> Optimizer has joined #instantbird 02:42:51 <-- Optimizer has quit (Ping timeout) 02:47:21 <-- Gizmokid2005 has quit (Ping timeout) 02:48:11 --> Gizmokid2005 has joined #instantbird 02:58:58 <-- meh has quit (Quit: I don't want to live on this planet anymore.) 04:17:52 <instant-buildbot> build #669 of win32-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/win32-nightly-default/builds/669 05:24:11 <-- EionRobb has quit (Quit: Leaving.) 05:50:12 <-- Mook has quit (Quit: Mook) 06:29:09 --> micahg_ has joined #instantbird 06:29:15 <-- micahg has quit (Connection reset by peer) 06:30:42 <-- micahg_ has quit (Client exited) 06:30:53 --> micahg has joined #instantbird 07:21:58 --> jb has joined #instantbird 07:30:41 <-- jb has quit (Quit: jb) 07:43:13 --> jb has joined #instantbird 07:43:29 --> gerard-majax_ has joined #instantbird 08:30:31 <-- clokep has quit (Connection reset by peer) 08:30:33 --> sonny has joined #instantbird 08:34:11 --> Even1 has joined #instantbird 08:34:17 <-- Even1 has quit (Quit: Even1) 08:34:21 --> Even1 has joined #instantbird 08:35:32 --> clokep has joined #instantbird 08:35:32 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep 08:45:10 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout) 08:52:01 --> jb has joined #instantbird 09:03:28 <-- jb has quit (Input/output error) 09:03:31 --> jb has joined #instantbird 09:11:40 <-- clokep has quit (Ping timeout) 09:12:18 --> clokep has joined #instantbird 09:12:18 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep 09:13:09 <instant-buildbot> build #584 of linux-nightly-default is complete: Failure [failed shell] Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/linux-nightly-default/builds/584 09:13:24 <-- instant-buildbot has quit (Quit: buildmaster reconfigured: bot disconnecting) 09:13:31 --> instant-buildbot has joined #instantbird 09:13:32 * ChanServ sets mode +v instant-buildbot 09:27:09 --> flo has joined #instantbird 09:27:10 * ChanServ sets mode +qo flo flo 09:28:53 <flo> hello :) 09:44:21 --> mmkmou has joined #instantbird 09:47:28 <instant-buildbot> build #585 of linux-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/linux-nightly-default/builds/585 09:48:01 <flo> clokep: most of the content in the release notes pad seems good. I think we still need to change a bit the order to put more important things at the top 09:51:21 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout) 10:00:56 <flo> clokep: I moved a few things around. It's probably not perfect yet, but I think it's good enough. 10:25:25 <clokep> flo: I think it looks good. 10:25:37 <flo> great :) 10:31:53 * clokep hates users who assume how things work. 10:40:43 * flo wonders if that user is an instantbird user or an user of something related to your paid-work 10:43:55 <clokep> Instantbird user. 10:44:00 <clokep> Was in reply to one of my replies on the mailing list... 10:44:02 <clokep> Just in reply to me though. 10:44:14 <clokep> "why would I log into the website when all I was doing was starting up IB. The problem is fixed anyway, because it was an issue on your end, not mine. 10:44:15 <clokep> thanks for the e-mail...." 10:44:38 <flo> "it was an issue on your end, not mine" ? :-D 10:44:57 <clokep> Yeah...apparently assuming we have something to do w/ them connecting. 10:46:54 <flo> I'm a bit sad that you hate them; that kind of behavior doesn't deserve that much attention ;). 10:47:34 <flo> but yeah, it's impossible to correctly support users reacting that way... :( 10:50:40 <clokep> Well "hate" is a strong word. 10:50:47 <flo> I guessed that :) 10:50:50 <clokep> It really frustrates me when people react that way to people trying to help them. 10:51:06 <clokep> Anyway, I'll send a nice reply that is half confusion and half elation about them fixing the issue. 10:51:25 <flo> O_o 10:52:04 * clokep needs to go to work. 10:53:46 <-- clokep has quit (Ping timeout) 11:35:20 --> meh has joined #instantbird 11:40:12 --> clokep_work has joined #instantbird 11:40:12 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep_work 12:00:21 <clokep_work> I really don't like the random modes being confusing letters of +o, ntr, etc. 12:00:23 <clokep_work> :-/ 12:01:58 <flo> when reading "mode (clokep_work +o) set by ChanServ" ? 12:02:57 <clokep_work> And "mode (#instantbird +ntr)" 12:03:06 <flo> I don't even know what that means :) 12:03:06 <clokep_work> I think aleth has it right that we should make those "human readable" somehow... 12:03:26 <clokep_work> +o is op, +n is...something. +t is only hops/ops can change the topic and...+r is something. :) 12:03:48 <clokep_work> Ah, +r is registered (in Bahamut). 12:03:53 * flo is converting andreasn to instantbird 12:04:07 <clokep_work> Ah, you got him to try it? 12:04:18 <clokep_work> Ah, +n is "no external messages". 12:04:35 <flo> isn't that irrelevant if you are already inside the room? :) 12:05:19 <clokep_work> Yes. But remember that the RFC lets you send messages to channels w/o being in them. 12:05:28 <clokep_work> Which sounds to me like super useful for spammers. :P 12:06:09 <clokep_work> (Seems like a crazy thing to allow IMO.) 12:06:27 <flo> clokep_work: but if that mode is the default settings for all rooms, whatever the RFC says isn't interesting for users ;) 12:07:16 <clokep_work> It isn't the default setting according to the RFC. :P 12:07:36 <clokep_work> It seems that on moznet at least it's default. 12:07:57 <clokep_work> I more of meant there needs to be a better way to display that information than as a message in the conversation. 12:08:06 <clokep_work> Maybe in the tooltip of the conversation (a la WHOIS info)? 12:09:17 <flo> a tooltip of the conv-top-info toolbar? 12:09:23 <flo> where we currently also show the topic 12:09:37 <flo> do we have a way to know what's the default server settings when we connect the account? 12:09:51 <flo> if we do, it would be nice to not tell the user about the modes of rooms that are the defualt for the server anyway 12:10:09 <clokep_work> I don't think so. 12:10:21 <clokep_work> We could also just "black list" some of them and choose not to show those. 12:10:36 <clokep_work> A big issue is that some letters are reused on different servers. 12:10:41 <clokep_work> I see like 4 different uses of +r. 12:11:21 <clokep_work> "REOP", "REGISTERED" and "REGONLY" (I also see at least 2 other letters being used for REGONLY). 12:11:52 * flo would suggest dropping that mode line completely unless the user has changed an about:config pref for us to be more verbose 12:13:30 <clokep_work> Yeah, we can discuss it after 1.2 is released. :) 12:18:54 <-- clokep_work has quit (Input/output error) 12:23:52 --> clokep_work has joined #instantbird 12:23:52 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep_work 12:25:02 <flo> I'm trying to generate a changelog. 12:25:32 <flo> hg log -r "ancestor(1.1,1.2)::1.2" gives an interesting result, but the first revision it lists is the last one that was already in 1.1, so I would need to remove the 5 first lines of the generated output by hand :-S 12:27:10 <clokep_work> Hmm...I don't know for sure. 12:28:05 <flo> what I did before (explained on the wiki) was tedious and more error prone, and I wnated to try something based on http://benjamin.smedbergs.us/blog/2012-07-09/using-mercurial-revsets-to-search-for-changes-between-firefox-releases/ instead 12:33:26 <flo> hg log -r "ancestor(1.1,1.2)::1.2" |tail +6 works 12:33:41 <flo> the tail part is ugly of course, but it doesn't really matter :) 12:35:28 <flo> here's the changelog I obtain: http://queze.net/goinfre/ChangeLog-1.2 12:36:14 <flo> that's 403 changesets 12:36:47 <clokep_work> Nice. :) 12:36:50 <clokep_work> 90% of which are aleth. :P 12:36:58 <flo> really? :) 12:37:54 <flo> clokep_work: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/59506 12:38:09 <flo> apparently I'm still a frequent contributor :) 12:41:07 <clokep_work> :) 12:43:06 <clokep_work> The msot frequent. 12:43:10 <clokep_work> In fact! 12:43:31 <flo> but less than 50%! :) 12:43:56 <flo> well, of the changesets. I don't know how much that is in line changed 12:45:28 --> igorko has joined #instantbird 12:46:07 <clokep_work> A lot of those changesets were the reorg for TB I think. 12:46:10 <clokep_work> So moving code around. 12:49:32 <flo> ah, more than 50% if I count the additional 6 changesets from me but imported from Tb 12:54:23 --> Optimizer has joined #instantbird 12:54:32 --> Optimizer1 has joined #instantbird 12:54:46 <-- Optimizer1 has quit (Input/output error) 12:55:12 --> Optimize1 has joined #instantbird 12:55:29 * Optimize1 is now known as Optimizer1 12:56:03 <-- Optimizer has quit (Ping timeout) 12:56:18 * Optimizer1 is now known as Optimizer 13:01:41 * flo started the script to create a source tarball 13:02:57 <flo> abort: HTTP Error 414: Request-URI Too Large 13:02:57 <flo> uh 13:03:02 <-- clokep_work has quit (Ping timeout) 13:10:24 <-- sonny has quit (Ping timeout) 13:14:02 <flo> bah, from the other server it works 13:40:34 --> barlas has joined #instantbird 13:52:13 --> sonny has joined #instantbird 14:07:36 --> ea4eoz has joined #instantbird 14:07:45 <-- meh has quit (Ping timeout) 14:11:25 <ea4eoz> Hello! Any ideas about to make libpurple to find the right external ip and make uPnP to work? 14:12:55 <flo> Hello 14:12:59 <flo> what's the use case? 14:13:24 <ea4eoz> file transfers 14:13:47 <flo> did you mean to ask this question in #pidgin? :) 14:13:57 <flo> we don't have any UI for file transfers yet 14:14:18 <ea4eoz> what would explain a lot :D 14:14:54 <flo> we don't want to expose libpurple's file transfers in the UI because they work too rarely; it's a frustrating experience to try to use them ;). 14:15:34 <ea4eoz> That's exactly the reason I gave up Pidgin... 14:17:28 <ea4eoz> and so I guess I must avoid any libpurple based program :( 14:17:40 <flo> or use dropbox for file transfers 14:17:47 <flo> that's more reliable 14:17:54 <flo> even with proxies in the middle 14:19:48 <ea4eoz> No, I need realible direct file transfers, but don't want to use messenger client 14:19:56 <flo> why do you need that? 14:20:19 <flo> which kind of files do you transfer? Are they big? Small? Images? Office documents? How often? 14:20:33 <ea4eoz> It's a long history but I need that... 14:21:31 * flo is willing to read a summary of that long story :) 14:21:48 <flo> I have a source tarball of 1.2 ready. 14:21:59 <flo> I wonder why it weights 98MB now :-S 14:22:08 --> meh has joined #instantbird 14:23:21 <ea4eoz> It's a pity because I really like Instantbird out of the box appearance :( 14:24:04 <flo> connect another sucky client just when you need file transfer. 14:24:29 <ea4eoz> That's eaxctly what I'm trying to avoid! 14:24:36 <flo> I'm going to assume you need them rarely, because you didn't want to answer that question, and haven't noticed right away that Instantbird doesn't support file transfer ;) 14:25:52 <ea4eoz> No, I just downloaded it this morning and in the configuration I see all the libpurple stuff about external ip and upnp options, so I assumed it has file transfers... 14:26:14 <flo> ah, yes, we need to hide confusing options :) 14:27:23 <ea4eoz> So, any multiprotocol IM program with direct file transfers not based in libpurple? :D 14:28:31 <flo> It's not an interesting question from my point of view, and you don't want to answer the question that I think is more interesting :-P. 14:29:01 <flo> btw, we are interested in adding a dropbox-based solution in the future 14:29:16 <flo> because msn p2p transfers don't help at all for twitter or facebook chat anyway 14:31:08 <dew> what about spideroak? 14:31:10 <flo> and my question was to know how such a feature could be helpful to you, and if not, why not. 14:31:20 <flo> dew: yeah, spideroak too 14:31:27 <dew> cool :) 14:31:29 <flo> dew: we would be using Tb's File Link code 14:32:13 <dew> hooray 14:32:24 <dew> I heard they were working with spideroak that's why I asked 14:32:47 <flo> yeah, they are 14:32:59 <flo> and yousendit, ubuntu one 14:33:13 <flo> but I'm not sure in which state the code for all these providers is 14:53:49 <dew> I wish trillian would go open source :/ 14:54:05 <dew> I like a lot of the stuff they do but they have a sloooow dev cycle 14:54:10 <flo> dew: and Windows too? ;) 14:54:19 <dew> hey I like windows 8 14:54:27 <flo> it's not open source yet though ;) 14:55:02 --> wnayes has joined #instantbird 14:55:04 <dew> yeah well it's much more likely a smaller project will 14:55:20 <dew> they used to collaborate with the pidgin developers way back when 14:56:00 <dew> so flo, you work for Mozilla right? 14:56:08 <-- igorko has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 14:59:33 <flo> dew: I'm part of the tb staff these days, yes. 15:00:25 <dew> yeah I've seen you on a lot of bugs that's why I asked. 15:00:36 <dew> I'm just curious on how these projects work 15:01:02 <flo> staying in the IRC channels and reading what people say is a good way to learn about them :) 15:02:24 <dew> oh I know I just wondered if Instabird was always mozilla backed or what 15:02:31 <dew> because I didn't hear about it until probably a year ago 15:02:41 <flo> uh? 15:02:53 <flo> never heard of an Inst*a*bird project :-P 15:03:01 <dew> oh 15:03:03 <dew> my bad 15:03:13 <flo> dew: http://www.instantbird.com/faq.html#mozilla 15:03:35 <dew> ty will read right now 15:04:36 <dew> I guess I assumed since they were merging code from the project into thunderbird 15:05:06 <flo> I think we would be happy if they assumed the same :-P. 15:12:59 <dew> yeah I just feel like they're spread too thin :/ 15:17:25 <ea4eoz> It's hard to find a IM program not based in libpurple... 15:18:11 <-- gerard-majax_ has quit (Ping timeout) 15:18:43 <dew> yes I agree ea4eoz 15:19:00 <dew> I think it's one of the only open source libraries out there 15:19:05 <dew> but I haven't done my research 15:19:11 <dew> just haven't heard of anything else 15:19:58 <ea4eoz> MirandaIM seems to be the only alternative not based in libpurple with file transfer and uPnP support... I will test it 15:20:04 <flo> ea4eoz: maybe you could help supporting MSN without libpurple in Instantbird? :) 15:20:38 <ea4eoz> Maybe :D 15:23:59 --> myk has joined #instantbird 15:59:19 <flo> so, my insurance has a button on its website to chat with them instead of calling them 15:59:27 <flo> but it doesn't work because it needs a java plugin 15:59:46 <flo> when I look at the source of the page, there's a comment "Sorry, but you need a Java 1.1.x enabled browser to use EIRC." 15:59:54 <flo> Is EIRC a standard IRC client? 16:00:32 <flo> the parameters of the applet contain a server IP, a port (6667!), a channel, and a few other values 16:03:02 * flo points his Instantbird debug build at it 16:03:34 <flo> "running version Unreal3.1.1-Darkshades+" 16:07:26 --> clokep_work has joined #instantbird 16:07:27 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep_work 16:07:40 <clokep_work> flo: That's pretty awesome. :) 16:07:48 <clokep_work> How'd you get the version type? 16:10:14 <flo> clokep_work: I don't really understand your question 16:10:39 <clokep_work> The server version. 16:10:42 <flo> I just checked the checkbox to see the server tab when I created the irc account 16:11:05 <clokep_work> Ah, OK. :) I wasn't sure if that's what you did or not. 16:11:11 <flo> apparently it creates a new server instance for each person who wants to connect, and creates a channel with only 2 people (me and someone else) 16:11:23 <clokep_work> That seems excessive haha. 16:12:16 <flo> I can send you all the content of server tab if you want to have fun ;) 16:13:30 <clokep_work> Hah, I don't think we care too much about supporting that. 16:13:38 <clokep_work> But we could add a network for your insurance company at some point, sure. :P 16:14:18 <clokep_work> ea4eoz: Also, I don't think we're fully against supporting direct file transfer btw, we just want to have a good fallback for the 90% of the time when it doesn't work. 16:16:24 <ea4eoz> Ok clokep_work, Anyway, if it is based on libpurple, I guess Instantbird will have all the problems libpurple has with file transfers 16:17:20 <clokep_work> ea4eoz: Yes, but a lot of those problems aren't really issues with libpurple, they're issues with the underlying protocol and their failure to understand parts of networking infrastructure (at least that's my understanding). 16:17:30 <-- Optimizer has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 16:17:42 --> Optimizer has joined #instantbird 16:17:58 <clokep_work> It'll usually work on "official" clients because they usually fallback to transferring through a 3rd party server (not really a direct client to client thing). 16:18:10 <clokep_work> The user experience just isn't there. :-/ 16:18:20 <clokep_work> I rarely had AIM file transfers work even when I was using AIM 5.x. 16:18:40 <ea4eoz> With pidgin I never be able to get libpurple to detect the external IP correctly, so uPnP mappings are wrong: No file transfers at all 16:21:53 <dew> ha 16:22:06 <dew> maybe they should fall back to some lite bit torrent client ;) 16:22:12 <dew> which uses that to send the file 16:22:30 <dew> since everyone seems to think that bit torrent is the best way to send and verify sent files 16:22:33 <flo> ea4eoz: even when upnp fails, it should fallback to a (very slow!) MSN proxy server 16:24:10 <ea4eoz> Yes, one of 100 times it do the fallback, but rarely. That's the reason I'm not confident in any libpurple based program (yes, including instantbird) 16:25:48 <ea4eoz> and it is a pity because I really like the instantbird interface 16:26:04 <ea4eoz> but I need file transfers 16:29:44 <flo> for some secret reason ;) 16:30:33 <dew> government secrets going over the wire 16:35:00 <ea4eoz> flo: imagine a email program without file attachments... That is a IM without file transfers. 16:37:57 <flo> ea4eoz: I rarely look at email attachments immediately, I just read the email and look at the attachment later. So if there's nothing "instant" about the file, it could as well be in an email 16:38:48 <ea4eoz> Diferent persons, diferent usages, but file transfers is a must for many people 16:39:08 <flo> and a welcome enhancement if someone wants to contribute it :) 16:39:59 <flo> I don't think arguing that file transfer is useful will help get it done (we all agree it's wanted if it works correctly) 16:41:48 * clokep_work doesn't know the last time he got an email attachment... 16:44:48 <clokep_work> flo: Did you see they're talking about adding a new pref type to libpurple? That's annoying. 16:45:34 <barlas> We want file transfer! 16:45:42 <-- wnayes has quit (Ping timeout) 16:45:50 <clokep_work> Then work on adding it (we will help you). 16:45:55 --> wnayes has joined #instantbird 16:46:06 <flo> I think you all can now form a team of people interested in working on it :) 16:46:14 <barlas> What if I work on motivating you guys? :D 16:46:33 <barlas> Well, I know I can form a team of people who want someone else to work on it :) 16:47:05 <flo> barlas: that sounds extremely difficult as I've always been annoyed whne receiving a file (when it did work on one of the clients I used before Instantbird) 16:47:29 <barlas> flo, why? 16:48:26 <flo> the client I used (Gaim) had a sucky UI for it that put a popup window and forced me to select a folder to store the file. How would I know where the file should go before seeing it? Why should I even care? 16:48:48 <flo> and usually I had to choose a folder to store the file, and then it didn't work! 16:49:08 <flo> barlas: would be easier to find a way to motivate me to add webcam support ;) 16:49:16 <clokep_work> barlas: I don't think either flo or I are really interested in working on it, so that might be hard to motivate. And I really don't mean that ("do it yourself") in a bad way. 16:49:37 <clokep_work> But I don't get paid to work on Instantbird, I do it for fun...therefore the impetus is to add features that interest me. 16:49:39 <barlas> flo: So, when can we expect webcam support? :P 16:50:05 * clokep_work would guess when we update to a Mozilla with WebRTC... 16:50:29 <barlas> BTW I was just kidding about motivating, if it was so easy, all open-source application would've hundreds of features :) 16:50:30 <flo> barlas: find me a girlfriend who lives more than a hundred kilometers away, and you will likely have it within a month or two in nightlies :-P. 16:50:55 <barlas> heh 16:51:51 <clokep_work> flo: Yes, I had thought of that last year...but then I just used Skype. :P 16:52:08 <flo> clokep_work: you need to upgrade to an OS that doesn't support Skype! 16:52:20 <barlas> Plan 9? 16:52:30 <barlas> React OS? 16:52:34 --> igorko has joined #instantbird 16:53:12 <barlas> A non-gui *nix/*bsd distribution? 16:53:25 <ea4eoz> seriously speaking: If instantbird is based on libpurple, how it can be possible to improve / add file transfers without improving libpurple itself? 16:53:41 <flo> barlas: an OS without GUI wouldn't help much to motivate for a feature of Instantbird ;) 16:53:59 <flo> ea4eoz: Instantbird uses libpurple, it's not based on it. 16:54:05 <flo> ea4eoz: not sure if you see the nuance ;). 16:54:37 <barlas> The main issue is writing the GUI, right? I mean actual file transfer would be handled by libpurple? 16:54:50 <ea4eoz> I'm not familiar with the IM protocols but I can't figure out how to initiate a file transfer with a sesion opened with libpurple... 16:54:58 <flo> barlas: libpurple doesn't handle file transfer, that's what ea4eoz is complaining about ;) 16:55:04 <barlas> Oh 16:55:06 <-- sonny has quit (Ping timeout) 16:55:25 <flo> barlas: it pretend it does, it has APIs for it; but that doesn't work 90% of the time 16:55:41 <barlas> It works on Pidgin thouth 16:55:48 <barlas> *though 16:56:12 <ea4eoz> File transfers in pidgin? You are joking! 16:56:29 <clokep_work> We also need to wrap it in our own API so that our non-libpurple protocols could use it. 16:56:38 <barlas> Hmm.. I haven'd used Pidgin in a long time, but I think it used to work on it :) I do have a very dodgy memory though. 16:56:44 <clokep_work> I'm sure some people would want to use DCC... 16:58:03 <barlas> Wouldn't file transfer require protocol specific code for each protocol? 16:58:29 <barlas> Jabber, MSN, Yahoo etc. 16:59:34 <clokep_work> Yes, of course. 16:59:55 <barlas> Hmm... I can see why you don't want to work on it :) 17:01:33 <barlas> I am mainly interested in Jabber file transfer, we use it in our office, and sharing files over IM is the most common way. Other than that, I don't remember when I used file transfer last time. It's usually email or something like dropbox. 17:02:02 <clokep_work> Well hopefully for Instantbird 1.3 will not use libpurple for XMPP! 17:02:13 <-- mmkmou has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 17:02:19 <barlas> Ahan 17:03:02 <barlas> We can then motivate ea4eoz to work on Jabber file transfer then :) 17:03:32 <dew> hmm 17:04:00 <clokep_work> Of course having a good UI for it is good too... 17:04:17 <flo> barlas: I think he was interested only in MSN 17:04:32 <flo> barlas: but yes, XMPP is the most likely to have file transfer supported soon 17:04:43 <flo> IRC too maybe 17:04:48 <barlas> Oooh, nice 17:04:59 * clokep_work grumbles about supporting DCC> 17:05:10 <clokep_work> I actually have some code to support DCC Chat though. :) 17:05:15 <flo> barlas: because it's correctly documented (for XMPP) and clokep_work knows all the RFCs by heart (for IRC) 17:05:31 <barlas> Nice! 17:05:33 <dew> :D 17:05:47 <-- meh has quit (Ping timeout) 17:05:59 <ea4eoz> Most people is on MSN or GTalk (jabber). File transfers on those protocols will be nice :D 17:06:25 <barlas> That reminds me I should check try IRC on instantbird, I never liked IRC support on Pidgin and Kopete, so I usually use a separate dedicated client for it. 17:06:56 <barlas> Also, while we are talking about features, are there any plans for OTR support? 17:06:59 <flo> barlas: if you dislike IRC in Instantbird, please let us (and especially clokep_work) know *why* :) 17:07:16 <flo> barlas: right, do you have any plans about adding OTR support in Instantbird? :) 17:07:24 <barlas> flo: Sure, let me try it first, I guess now is as good time as any 17:07:29 <barlas> Haha 17:07:48 <barlas> How hard would it be for someone who hasn't much experinece in desktop programming? 17:07:59 <flo> barlas: OTR? 17:08:00 <ea4eoz> IRC in instantbird is a pleasure, at least for me ;-) 17:08:04 <barlas> flo: yes 17:08:05 <flo> barlas: not where you want to start. 17:08:14 <flo> barlas: filtering the buddy list is a much better idea of a start 17:08:29 <barlas> That trying thing was about IRC. 17:08:56 <barlas> OTR question was, how hard would it be, a general theoratical question for the time being :) 17:09:09 <flo> ea4eoz: great :) 17:09:54 <flo> barlas: OTR would be easy for someone who has ever written C++ Mozilla add-ons. 17:09:55 * instantbot frowns at flo 17:10:09 <flo> barlas: that probably only means Mook and me :( 17:10:15 <clokep_work> The hooks are all there for OTR... 17:10:16 <barlas> heh 17:10:39 <clokep_work> Although I find a lot of people think the want OTR, but really only want encryption... 17:10:42 <flo> clokep_work: yeah, it's not terrible difficult. For someone who knows the technologies 17:10:56 <flo> clokep_work: most people asking for OTR have no idea of what it does. 17:12:03 <ea4eoz> I remember I tested instantbird many time ago, maybe at the 0.2 o 0.3 version. But tired of problems with pidgin this morning I started to test other programs, and I downloaded instantbird again. Very impresed in general (but it has no file transfers. Did I mentioned it? :-) ) 17:12:13 <barlas> Hmm... it's not connecting me to irc.mozilla with SSL 17:12:20 <barlas> Oh, it just did. 17:12:52 --> barlas_ has joined #instantbird 17:13:11 <barlas_> So, this is how it looks like. 17:13:24 <barlas> Yep 17:13:35 <barlas_> Hmm.. how come we both are same colour? :( 17:14:01 <barlas> I don't know, maybe because it's basically the same nick. 17:14:06 <barlas_> Maybe :-/ 17:14:37 <barlas> You can wait for someone else to speak, that would probably show different background colours 17:14:45 <barlas_> Hmm.. nice idea. 17:15:01 <barlas_> Also, I think I should stop chatting with myself. 17:15:35 <flo> do you often do that? 17:15:44 <flo> ask instantbot something ;) 17:15:59 <barlas_> instantbot: How are you? 17:16:00 <instantbot> barlas_: fine thanks! I've been up 58 days so far! 17:16:00 <flo> barlas_: also, for IRC, I would suggest trying the "Show Nick" add-on 17:16:15 <barlas_> flo: and no, not as much as I would like to :) 17:16:38 <flo> barlas_: ahah :) 17:16:57 <barlas_> Okay, installed it, time to restart instantbird. 17:17:08 <-- barlas_ has quit (Input/output error) 17:18:53 --> barlas_ has joined #instantbird 17:19:00 <barlas_> Test 17:19:05 <barlas_> barlas: Test 17:19:18 <barlas> barlas_: Another test 17:19:22 <barlas_> ice 17:19:25 <barlas_> *Nice 17:19:54 <barlas_> Nice work on IRC, most multi-protocol clients lack good MUC support 17:20:57 <barlas_> Is there any way, I can put the chat on hold by pressing cross, or minimizing it? 17:21:14 <flo> barlas_: press Escape 17:21:34 <flo> barlas_: but yes, pressing the [X] of the tab would but a chat room on hold by default 17:22:10 <barlas_> Nice, I officially love the IRC support now :) 17:22:35 <clokep_work> Good to hear that. :) 17:22:41 <clokep_work> And yes we spent a lot of time making MUCs good. 17:30:03 --> meh has joined #instantbird 17:31:54 <flo> clokep_work: do you remember exactly what was the drawback of the patch in bug 1231? 17:31:58 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1231 nor, --, 1.2, florian, RESO FIXED, 'Display Formatting of incoming messages', not implemented in JS-XMPP 17:32:03 <flo> I'm trying to help deciding if we want to take this for Tb15 or not 17:32:09 <flo> wrong number, sorry 17:32:17 <flo> I meant bug 1497 17:32:20 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1497 nor, --, 1.2, aletheia2, RESO FIXED, When starting with necko offline, connect accounts as soon as the network is back. Also avoid connec 17:32:39 --> aleth has joined #instantbird 17:32:40 * ChanServ sets mode +h aleth 17:32:46 <flo> aleth: :) 17:32:51 <flo> aleth: exactly who I needed! :) 17:33:03 <flo> aleth: do you remember what the drawback of bug 1497 is? 17:33:08 <flo> Should we take it for Tb15 or not? :) 17:33:53 <aleth> The drawback was just the "missing UI" 17:34:07 <aleth> I don't see why one wouldn't take it for TB if we took it for IB ;) 17:34:12 <flo> aleth: weren't we breaking a corner case that had a better error handling now? 17:34:41 <flo> aleth: the diffrent is TB has a GUI for switching necko online/offline, Ib doesn't. 17:34:44 <flo> *difference 17:34:53 <aleth> afaik what will go missing is the message in the account manager when you start when necko is offline 17:35:22 <flo> but don't we miss it anyway if we are offline because necko is offline at a later time? 17:35:28 <flo> (ie that message is inconsistent anyway) 17:36:11 <aleth> Yes, it was only there on startup 17:36:30 <aleth> personally I agree it was not a good solution, so I didn't mind replacing it with "no message" in the interim 17:37:01 <aleth> It's just an extra service to the user to provide more info at some point in the future 17:37:02 --> sonny has joined #instantbird 17:37:39 <aleth> Hmm, unless I missed something about when that message appeared... it's a while ago. 17:38:03 <-- Gizmokid2005 has quit (Ping timeout) 17:38:42 --> Gizmokid2005 has joined #instantbird 17:39:00 <flo> aleth: we needed it to start the autologin process 17:39:15 <flo> now that we do it anyway even with offline account, the button isn't really neeed 17:39:17 <flo> *needed 17:40:04 <aleth> Ah, right. 17:41:42 <barlas_> Is it possible to have different themes for single chad and MUC? 17:41:45 <barlas_> *chat 17:41:47 <aleth> How can TB have an UI to switch necko online/offline? It may not be something it can fix... 17:42:31 <aleth> Isn't "work offline" the equivalent of disconnecting all accounts? 17:43:26 <flo> aleth: switching necko offline is a way to ensure no network connection will be attempted 17:43:43 <flo> barlas_: you will have to explain to clokep_work why you would want that ;). 17:44:02 <barlas_> Sure 17:45:01 <barlas_> I like 'Bubble' for single chats, but in MUC's it becomes too colourful. 17:45:33 <barlas_> Similarly, Paper sheet looks nice in MUC, but I don't like it much for single chat 17:45:47 <aleth> flo: OK... I guess pre-IM TB had no concept of status 17:46:09 <barlas_> clokep_work: Single chat and MUCs have different themeing requirements. 17:46:19 <aleth> i.e. I would expect an IB with status=offline to not attempt any network connections either ;) It's just not done via necko. 17:47:20 <clokep_work> barlas_: Why do you like one for the other? 17:47:33 <clokep_work> (And don't let flo think I'm the only one that likes it that way.) 17:47:49 <barlas_> clokep_work: one for the other? 17:49:10 <flo> aleth: ib with status=offline would still try to find updates 17:49:13 <clokep_work> barlas_: Why do you like one over the other. 17:49:23 <aleth> flo: aha! right. 17:49:40 <flo> clokep_work: I'm not saying you are the only one who likes it that way. Just that you are the only one who still has the energy to argue about it :). 17:49:51 <barlas_> heh 17:50:16 <clokep_work> I just want a real reason why people think they need to look different besides "IRC isn't supposed to look like that." 17:50:37 <flo> clokep_work: he said MUCs though ;) 17:50:37 <barlas_> clokep_work: Take Bubbles for instant, it's pretty good single chat theme, you can choose any two colours, and it makes it easy to recognize your message and your contacts. 17:51:11 <aleth> flo: For TB there will not even be the issue that users are used to a different behaviour from previous versions ;) 17:51:59 <barlas_> But when you use it in MUC, there are just way too many colours on the screen. In one chatroom I have bright yellow, orange, pink, dark green, lime green and so on. It doesn't make recognizing messages by different people any easier, but provides too much distraction 17:52:18 <clokep_work> flo: Thanks for the spam. 17:52:34 <clokep_work> barlas_: I disagree 100% with what you say. 17:52:40 <clokep_work> I think it makes it wayyy easier to see who said what. 17:52:49 <flo> clokep_work: you are welcome. More is coming. 17:53:00 * clokep_work stops reading it then. 17:53:01 <clokep_work> :) 17:53:04 <flo> I'm rushing in 2 more fixes before they start building Tb15b3 17:53:21 <aleth> barlas_: At best you can argue that it's not to your taste... in which case that's what add-ons are for ;) 17:53:44 <flo> barlas_: I wonder what "there are just way too many colours on the screen" means. 17:53:55 <aleth> barlas_: (and message styles which are less colourful) 17:53:57 <flo> are the colors preventing you from focusing for some reason? 17:54:47 <barlas_> flo: I find bright yellow background to be very distracting 17:54:57 <flo> but I have to also disagree with "It doesn't make recognizing messages by different people any easier". It helps *a lot*! 17:55:12 <flo> barlas_: bright yellow is bad luck :( 17:55:17 <barlas_> Let me upload a picture 17:55:36 <flo> sure :) 17:55:41 <aleth> flo: Some people just don't like them colours ;) that's what theming is for... 17:56:35 <barlas_> What's the good free photo uploading site these days? 17:56:43 <dew> imgur 17:56:43 <flo> imgur.com 17:56:49 <dew> ninja'd 17:59:13 <barlas_> http://imgur.com/C7y0M 17:59:20 <barlas_> Check the difference between yellows and greens 17:59:38 <dew> hey flo have you ever worked on foobar2k? 17:59:50 <aleth> barlas_: The colour depends on the nick. 17:59:58 <barlas_> I know 17:59:59 <flo> barlas_: your screenshot looks good. On my screen at least. 18:00:13 <barlas_> And if there are 50 people in the room, there are chances of 50 different colours 18:00:15 <flo> dew: no. I don't even know what it is. 18:00:36 <flo> barlas_: there are rarely 50 people talking *at the same time* 18:00:45 <aleth> barlas_: Just use e.g. minimal 2 as your message style if you want less colours. Or even the built-in simple style... 18:00:51 <clokep_work> I think your screenshot looks good and makes it easy to see the difference between people... 18:00:59 <flo> barlas_: if that makes you feel better, there's only 360 colors, so if you are in a room with 1000+ people, you won't have that many colors :) 18:01:08 <dew> sorry I just remember hearing of a florian person that worked as a plugin developer on that :) 18:01:36 <barlas_> :) 18:02:04 <barlas_> So, I am the only one who thinks it is a good idea to have different colours for single chats and MUCs? 18:02:22 <flo> there's already different colors 18:03:00 <barlas_> *themes :) 18:10:16 <clokep_work> You can alawys install other themes. :-D 18:13:24 <barlas_> Hmm... 18:13:39 <clokep_work> As aleth was suggesting... 18:13:50 --> Mnyromyr has joined #instantbird 18:15:06 <barlas_> Well, I don't want minimal colours, I want to use a theme, it's just that in my opinion, same theme doesn't work well in both cases. 18:15:25 <barlas_> Though, after reading my last message, I sound like a whining kid :P 18:15:46 --> Mook has joined #instantbird 18:15:52 <flo> as long as you are whining politely :) 18:16:55 <barlas_> So, if I just add it to my long list of things that I would try to do someday, when I would've time. Is it possible to achieve that using add on? 18:17:54 <flo> barlas_: yes, it should be easy. 18:18:02 <flo> barlas_: and if it's not easy, that's something we should fix 18:18:21 <flo> barlas_: at some point I wanted an add-on to have different themes for some very specific contacts 18:19:01 <flo> barlas_: I was thinking that one may want to have a different theme for work related and family contacts for example, so that the appearance is very different, reducing the risk of sending something unappropriate by accident. 18:19:27 <flo> clokep_work: so what's left to do for the release? :) 18:20:39 <flo> anyway, going home now :) 18:20:40 <flo> back later 18:20:41 <-- flo has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2 -- http://www.instantbird.com) 18:20:58 <clokep_work> flo: Release notes + blog post. 18:21:12 <barlas_> He has left 18:21:14 <barlas_> Oh, the log. 18:23:08 <-- Mook has quit (Ping timeout) 18:23:52 <clokep_work> Yup. :) 18:24:04 <clokep_work> We're in really different timezones, so we tend to leave stuff in the logs... 18:26:48 <clokep_work> I hope I haven't scared anyone away by the way, it is good to have different opinions. Themes and file transfer tend to be sensitive subjects. But seriously...if someone does want something we'll help a lot in getting it there. 18:26:53 <clokep_work> But we can't work on everything ourselves. :) 18:27:00 --> Mook has joined #instantbird 18:29:02 <-- igorko has quit (Client exited) 18:30:07 --> igorko has joined #instantbird 18:30:24 <-- igorko has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2 -- http://www.instantbird.com) 18:31:37 <dew> \o/ 18:32:28 <dew> you know what would be cool? If you could somehow hook into the Sync service from mozilla to sync accounts across machines 18:32:40 --> igorko has joined #instantbird 18:33:09 <clokep_work> Yeah, Mic had done a bit playing with that. 18:33:24 <clokep_work> There's some code aroudn for it (and a bug on file), it's something we want. :) 18:34:03 <dew> I'm going to start playing around with the program a bit 18:34:48 <dew> are there different release channels like firefox, etc? 18:35:42 <clokep_work> We have nightly builds and release builds. 18:37:14 <dew> well I could always play with nightly 18:37:24 <dew> does raptr use any of your code? 18:37:30 <clokep_work> "raptr"? 18:37:34 <clokep_work> I don't know what that is. 18:38:05 <dew> this gaming themed instant messenger 18:38:11 <dew> have you heard of xfire? 18:38:15 <clokep_work> Yes. 18:38:19 <dew> it's kind of like that 18:38:28 <dew> except I think it uses gecko somehow 18:38:34 <clokep_work> I don't think they do, but it's possible I suppose. Why do you ask? 18:38:35 <clokep_work> Ah, OK. 18:39:23 <clokep_work> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raptr says little about the client. 18:53:59 <dew> hmm I don't remember where I read that 18:55:54 <clokep_work> I'd be surprised if they used our code, but I suppose it is possible. 18:57:48 <clokep_work> dew: It uses libpurple: http://developer.pidgin.im/wiki/PossibleLicenseViolations#Raptr 19:04:38 <clokep_work> Ntohing about it using Gecko though...somewhere it said it uses Qt? 19:08:31 <-- barlas has quit (Connection reset by peer) 19:09:01 <-- clokep_work has quit (Input/output error) 19:09:17 --> barlas has joined #instantbird 19:10:23 --> barlas__ has joined #instantbird 19:10:58 <-- barlas has quit (Ping timeout) 19:11:10 <-- Mook has quit (Ping timeout) 19:11:36 <-- barlas__ has quit (Connection reset by peer) 19:11:39 --> barlas has joined #instantbird 19:13:38 <dew> I swear they said it was built on mozilla technology somewhere 19:13:54 <dew> but I have a very bad memory sometimes so :S 19:14:08 <-- barlas has quit (Connection reset by peer) 19:14:10 --> barlas has joined #instantbird 19:14:42 --> Mook has joined #instantbird 19:14:52 <-- barlas has quit (Connection reset by peer) 19:14:54 --> barlas has joined #instantbird 19:17:35 <-- barlas_ has quit (Ping timeout) 19:17:44 <-- barlas has quit (Ping timeout) 19:17:48 --> barlas_ has joined #instantbird 19:18:11 <-- Mook has quit (Ping timeout) 19:18:13 <-- barlas_ has left #instantbird () 19:20:27 --> barlas has joined #instantbird 19:22:14 --> Mook has joined #instantbird 19:24:47 <-- igorko has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2 -- http://www.instantbird.com) 19:28:56 --> jb has joined #instantbird 19:31:01 <-- Optimizer has quit (Ping timeout) 19:31:55 <-- Mook has quit (Ping timeout) 19:33:05 <-- ea4eoz has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.1) 19:35:25 --> Mook has joined #instantbird 19:35:49 <-- sonny has quit (Ping timeout) 19:42:27 <-- jb has quit (Input/output error) 19:42:31 --> jb has joined #instantbird 19:44:11 <-- Mook has quit (Ping timeout) 19:48:33 --> Mook has joined #instantbird 20:08:23 --> clokep_work has joined #instantbird 20:08:23 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep_work 20:11:00 <-- barlas has quit (Connection reset by peer) 20:11:05 --> barlas has joined #instantbird 20:12:52 <-- Mook has quit (Input/output error) 20:13:51 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1621 filed by email@example.com. 20:13:53 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1621 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Contact's names fonts don't display correctly 20:14:17 --> Mook has joined #instantbird 20:17:56 <-- chrisccoulson has quit (Ping timeout) 20:18:31 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout) 20:20:51 <-- barlas has quit (Ping timeout) 20:22:29 <clokep_work> dew: It's quite possible, just saying I couldn't find it. If you do see it again, let me know. :) 20:26:01 <-- clokep_work has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2 -- http://www.instantbird.com) 20:32:57 --> chrisccoulson has joined #instantbird 20:33:32 <-- chrisccoulson has quit (Client exited) 20:33:37 --> chrisccoulson_ has joined #instantbird 20:37:01 --> sonny has joined #instantbird 20:37:03 <-- ivan has quit (Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)) 20:41:54 <-- Even has quit (Input/output error) 21:00:20 --> flo has joined #instantbird 21:00:21 * ChanServ sets mode +qo flo flo 21:14:22 <-- Mnyromyr has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [SeaMonkey 1.1.19/2010030105]) 21:15:45 --> ea4eoz has joined #instantbird 21:20:51 --> clokep has joined #instantbird 21:20:51 * ChanServ sets mode +o clokep 21:23:09 --> EionRobb has joined #instantbird 21:24:43 <flo> the 1.2 release folder weights 2.6GB 21:25:51 <clokep> Super heavy weight class. 21:25:53 <dew> \o/ 21:26:02 <instantbot> firstname.lastname@example.org set the Resolution field on bug 1621 to DUPLICATE of bug 935. 21:26:04 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1621 nor, --, ---, nobody, RESO DUPLICATE, Contact's names fonts don't display correctly 21:26:05 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=935 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, em and pt usage in CSS causes size/alignment errors for certain font sizes and DPI settings 21:30:46 <flo> O_o. The rsync between the 2 servers seems CPU-bound. 21:31:22 <flo> ah, the wiki page says "(expect ~10 minutes)" 21:34:10 <aleth> Reply/Retweet for twitter was in 1.1 already: bug 682 21:34:13 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=682 enh, --, 1.1, florian, RESO FIXED, Reply to and retweet actions on twitter 21:34:15 <-- wnayes has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 21:34:21 <clokep> This sounds like a nice change: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=742795 21:35:21 <clokep> aleth: Ah, I guess we should remove that then. 21:35:31 <clokep> (From the release notes, not from Instantbird. :P) 21:35:46 <aleth> We could put it back for 1.3 ;) 21:36:53 --> wnayes has joined #instantbird 21:37:53 * wnayes really needs to stop pressing Tab-Enter in the Win7 start menu searchbar... 21:38:36 <clokep> aleth: Did you remove the whole bullet? 21:38:41 <flo> clokep: yes, it looks nice. But we will have some work to do for it, as we currently have some constants in there (that really shouldn't be there), eg. the list of statically linked prpls 21:38:43 <aleth> clokep: Yes? 21:38:54 <clokep> Good! 21:40:53 <flo> the rsync took 10m11.830s 21:40:59 <flo> the estimate of the wiki is quite correct! :) 21:41:23 <clokep> :) 21:41:34 <flo> that's strange 21:41:39 <-- sonny has quit (Ping timeout) 21:41:47 <flo> because the 1.1 release folder weighted only 1.8GB 21:42:53 <clokep> With more locales. 21:43:13 * flo is uploading to Google code 21:44:30 <flo> clokep: partial update files are really heavy for 1.2. Almost 3/4 of the weight of the full update 21:44:50 <flo> I even wondered if we shouldn't just delete these files and make everybody download the complete update 21:44:56 <aleth> The weight of code reorganisation? 21:45:06 <clokep> If it's that big...it kind of makes sense to just go for the full updates honestly. 21:45:10 <flo> on windows it could be the compiler change 21:45:33 <flo> on linux and Mac, I really don't have a good explanation to offer 21:45:36 <aleth> omni.jar -> omni.ja ? 21:45:41 <aleth> or is that too trivial... 21:45:43 <flo> oh, could be! 21:46:14 <flo> files are compared individually, so yes, I would bet we ship the whole omni.ja file 21:46:28 <aleth> Might as well do the complete update then... 21:46:32 <flo> but still, I expect the heavier file to be xul.dll/libxul.so/libxul.dylib 21:47:09 <clokep> We're also updating from Mozilla 7.0.1 to 14.0.1... 21:48:02 <flo> btw, I think we should delete old partial update files 21:48:22 <flo> I don't think anybody would be too upset if we removed the 1.0->1.1 update files 21:49:05 <clokep> I don't think so either. 21:49:13 <flo> we could maybe delete even the complete update files for 1.0 21:49:45 <flo> I don't think it was the most up to date version for any of the OSes (ie I don't think we have stopped supporting any OS in 1.1) 21:50:21 <flo> uploading to google code took only 6m15.710s 21:50:22 --> sonny has joined #instantbird 21:50:27 <clokep> :) 21:50:37 <clokep> And yes, I think you're right. 21:50:56 <flo> and I think we should really stop supporting PPC soon 21:51:04 <flo> Mozilla 17 won't support OS X 10.5 any more 21:51:10 <clokep> What needs to be done on the release notes? 21:51:21 <flo> and it's the latest version of Mac OS X that supports PPC 21:53:57 <clokep> I'm going to start converting the release notes to PHP... 21:54:01 <flo> clokep: what do you think needs to be done? 21:54:09 <flo> (I was about to ask you the same question :-P) 21:54:11 <clokep> I think they need to be converted to PHP. :P 21:55:22 <flo> sound good if you are doing it then! :) 21:57:19 <clokep> I'm working on it now... 21:57:58 <flo> anybody remembers the address of the staging website? :-S 21:58:06 <flo> www-staging.instantbird.com seems to redirect to the main ib.com page 22:00:38 <clokep> Right because sites linked to it. :( 22:02:00 <flo> because stupid supposed-to-be-german-translator "privately" sent the URL publicly on Twitter ;) 22:03:27 <flo> ok, it's http://www-staging2.instantbird.com/ 22:08:29 <clokep> Bleh....this is slow going... 22:09:44 <aleth> You know you can export etherpads as HTML? (not sure how well though) 22:10:33 <clokep> It doesn't really help. 22:10:44 <clokep> It's a localized file.. 22:10:49 <clokep> But thank you. :) 22:11:11 <aleth> right :-/ 22:11:33 <flo> I'm doing the check-ins right now of all the website changes listed in the pad that are already ready 22:11:52 <flo> I'm not sure if I should try to create a paypal account this evening or just giveu p 22:14:23 <flo> the locales we dropped are pl and ru, right? 22:14:36 <flo> yes :) 22:19:27 <clokep> aleth: Any chance you have 5 minutes? 22:19:46 <clokep> Could you test https://addons.instantbird.org/en-US/instantbird/addon/306 w/ 1.2 and let me know if it works (and if it does, I'll bump the compatibility). 22:20:18 <flo> clokep: you can't bump the compatibility of experimental (sandboxed) add-ons 22:20:29 <clokep> flo: :( Oh. I didn't realize it was experimental. 22:20:33 <flo> clokep: well, you can. But it has no effect 22:20:36 <clokep> We dropped ru? I thought I saw it in the files... 22:20:48 <flo> I would love if someone could fix that btw :) 22:21:59 <clokep> flo: There are ru builds in http://ftp.instantbird.com/instantbird/releases/1.2-candidates/2012-08-05-18-instantbird/ 22:22:06 <flo> clokep: hmmm. Is the shipped-locales file wrong? :( 22:23:27 <flo> ok, it's wrong but in a way that isn't too much of a disaster, I only forgot to drop ru 22:23:36 <flo> I was afraid I may have dropped another locale instead 22:24:57 <flo> so, should I rm all 1.2.ru files from the server? 22:26:48 <-- sonny has quit (Ping timeout) 22:27:08 <clokep> It's up to you, I have no idea of the status of it. 22:27:41 <flo> chat/ is in en-US in it 22:27:52 <flo> it's totally unshippable 22:29:56 <-- chrisccoulson_ has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat) 22:30:05 --> chrisccoulson has joined #instantbird 22:32:09 <clokep> Then yes, delete it. 22:32:48 <flo> I removed the files from http://ftp.instantbird.com/instantbird/releases/1.2/ 22:33:02 <flo> I'm not sure if I keep it in the rc folders or not 22:34:58 <clokep> Keep it. 22:40:45 <flo> deleted from the 1.2 release folder and from my mirror on the other servier, deleted from the google code mirror, and disabled in the update database. 22:42:55 <clokep> Excellent. 22:45:46 <clokep> flo: So I think I have some updates to the website... 22:45:51 <clokep> But I'm afraid I've missed some things. 22:46:01 <flo> uh? 22:46:09 <flo> I thought you were just working on release-notes-1.2.php 22:46:15 <flo> I just made the other updates :-S 22:46:52 <clokep> flo: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/59718 is what I had done. 22:47:43 <flo> XD 22:47:47 <flo> so no, we aren't duplicating work 22:47:56 <clokep> That's good, right? :) 22:47:57 <flo> you forgot all the parts I changed, and I forgot all the parts you changed 22:48:18 <flo> we should seriously document what needs to be done when adding a new version on the website! 22:48:18 <clokep> Sounds like we make a good pair. :P 22:48:44 <clokep> Yes. I think our thought was "check the last commit" but we clearly didn't do that. 22:49:12 <flo> see https://hg.instantbird.org/websites/www.instantbird.com/ for what I did 22:49:21 <flo> especially https://hg.instantbird.org/websites/www.instantbird.com/rev/53e4a8148fa8 22:53:06 <clokep> I see. 22:54:59 <flo> clokep: the andMore string doesn't seem to be used anywhere 22:55:45 <flo> do you have a local copy of the website, or have you just blindly made the changes without being able to test? 22:55:54 --> sonny has joined #instantbird 22:56:16 <clokep> flo: Blindly made. 22:56:32 <flo> ok, so I should expect parse errors :-D 22:57:11 <clokep> Sorry. :-/ 22:57:31 <-- sonny has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.3a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com) 22:57:31 <clokep> I hope it's faster to fix the few errors I had then to just do it yourself... 22:57:41 <flo> are you already adding the code adding the andMore, or should I apply the patch and do it? 22:58:14 <clokep> Please do it. I need to make dinner. 22:58:24 <flo> it's ok! Thank you very much for the help, and yes, it will definitely be faster, PHP tend to give decent location info for parse errors :) 23:01:07 <flo> actually, no parse error! :) 23:02:32 <clokep> I used to write PHP. :p It's what I learned to program on. 23:02:51 <clokep> (And you're welcome.) 23:07:25 * clokep thinks searching of #instantbird logs sucks.... 23:09:26 <flo> please check http://www-staging2.instantbird.com/release-notes.html 23:10:00 <flo> clokep: I just added the andMore string, moved "known issues" to an h2, and removed the question mark at the end of that line 23:11:08 <clokep> Hmm...I think "Bonjour" had been bold in the etherpad, but that's not a big deal. 23:11:46 <flo> and "(" on that line isn't closed 23:12:49 <clokep> Bah, must have been deleted when I added the links. 23:12:56 <clokep> Besides that, yes. I think it's OK. 23:13:33 <flo> what about "No noisy messages from NickServ interrupt you when successfully identifying on login." -> "No more noisy messages from NickServ interrupting you after a successful automatic identification on login." ? 23:14:33 <flo> "you can now change the status directly from the system tray context menu." -> "from the icon's context menu" ? 23:16:38 <clokep> Yes to both of those, I think. 23:18:45 <flo> ok, so I'm changing http://pastebin.instantbird.com/59749 23:19:35 <clokep> r+ 23:24:05 <clokep> So....where is the participant binding...? 23:25:34 <flo> what do you mean? 23:26:05 <clokep> Eh, well it's not important until after 1.2. Is there more that needs to get done? 23:27:31 <flo> a blog post? 23:27:46 * clokep knew you were going to say that. 23:27:55 <clokep> OK....I'll start on one in a few minutes... 23:28:18 <flo> or 2 blog posts if you don't want to post the same content to the instantbird blog and your own blog ;) 23:29:10 <clokep> I wasnt ging to. :P 23:31:06 <flo> also, we need to decide when we are actually going to release. 23:31:18 <flo> when do we flip push the website changes to production? 23:31:23 <flo> s/flip// 23:31:40 <flo> are we giving translators a few hours to catch-up? 23:31:48 <flo> or deciding it's too late for them anyway? 23:32:08 <flo> may not be too late for French (vicnet? :-P) 23:32:18 <clokep> :) 23:32:24 <clokep> Are we pushing it today or tomorrow? 23:32:40 <flo> what do you prefer? 23:33:23 <flo> (I would like to be in my bed relatively soon, but I can stay an additionnal half hour if we want to do it now) 23:34:27 <clokep> I'm writing the post nowbut I'm not really sure what to say.... 23:39:55 <flo> after months of efforts, we a glad to finally announce the release of Instantbird 1.2 23:40:09 <flo> *are 23:42:12 <flo> Even though it took way more time than we originally expected and doesn't have any major new features, we are confident that you will like lots of little details that make this new version of Instantbird even more user friendly and polished than before. 23:43:54 <clokep> flo: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/59756 23:44:08 <clokep> Bah that's a good sentence. 23:44:11 <clokep> I should put that in there. 23:44:27 <aleth> it sounds a bit negative though... 23:44:57 <aleth> http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/08/microsoft-proposes-alternate-spec-for-web-audiovideo-chat-standard/ 23:45:27 <clokep> Well...read what I wrote and let me know what you think. 23:45:49 <flo> Tb18 will have a decent auto-complete, won't it? 23:46:03 <aleth> Looks good to me :) 23:46:25 <aleth> You're right, that sentence would be OK in context 23:47:58 <clokep> Will it? 23:48:39 <aleth> You could leave out "doesn't have any major new features" if you want to be sure ;) 23:49:12 <clokep> I added that sentence (mostly) to the end of the first paragraph: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/59757 23:49:12 <aleth> It's true, but it is a point release after all... 23:52:26 <flo> aleth: it took 10 months ;) 23:52:55 <flo> aleth: during that time Pidgin went from 2.10.0 to 2.10.6, with half the changes sent to them by us :-P. 23:53:39 <aleth> no major new features over there then ;) 23:54:12 <flo> but it does have file transfer ;) 23:54:17 <flo> wait, does it work? :-P 23:54:26 <aleth> wrong question :P 23:55:04 <aleth> I don't think I've ever successfully sent a file via IM, no matter which client or OS 23:55:12 <EionRobb> did someone say file transfer? 23:55:21 * flo wonders why clokep uses pastebin instead of etherpad for that post 23:55:30 <flo> EionRobb: we've been trolling about it all day long today ;) 23:55:41 <EionRobb> :D 23:55:57 <EionRobb> I've been trolling about it all IB long! 23:56:20 <flo> EionRobb: I don't think so 23:56:30 <flo> EionRobb: I don't remember you doing that at the 0.1 time :-P 23:57:35 <EionRobb> nah, cos you could just dump in the .dll/.so from libpurple and I was happy 23:58:09 <flo> EionRobb: uh, what? 23:58:51 <EionRobb> back in the old days of instantbird I played around with it, and just dumped in the .dll's for my prpls from libpurple into the instantbird plugins folder, and it would just load them no problems 23:59:27 <flo> Only for 0.1 and 0.1.1, right? 23:59:37 <EionRobb> yeah 23:59:43 <EionRobb> those were the days 23:59:45 <EionRobb> *sigh* 23:59:48 <flo> for 0.1.2 libpurple was compiled with MSVC 23:59:56 <EionRobb> that's still ok