#instantbird log on 06 01 2012

All times are UTC.

00:00:15 <instant-buildbot> build #260 of linux-onCommit is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/linux-onCommit/builds/260
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00:56:14 <clokep> flo: I just assume MSN crashes aren't important anymore. ;)
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01:30:24 <instant-buildbot> build #250 of win32-onCommit is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/win32-onCommit/builds/250
01:31:25 <instant-buildbot> build #231 of macosx-onCommit is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/macosx-onCommit/builds/231
01:34:34 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com cancelled feedback? for attachment 1536 on bug 1472.
01:34:35 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com requested review from florian@instantbird .org for attachment 1538 on bug 1472.
01:34:36 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1472 enh, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Handle a ChanServ entry message
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01:54:17 <instantbot> New Core - General bug 1473 filed by clokep@gmail.com.
01:54:22 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1473 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Port Mozilla Bug 750911 - Review and land metro specific toolkit/xre changes
02:03:13 <instantbot> New Core - General bug 1474 filed by clokep@gmail.com.
02:03:15 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1474 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Port Mozilla Bug 494311 - Remove the locale from updater.ini
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02:11:40 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com requested review from florian@instantbird .org for attachment 1539 on bug 1359.
02:11:42 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1359 nor, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Abstract the shared methods between ircChannel and ircConversation
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03:14:00 <instant-buildbot> build #513 of linux-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/linux-nightly-default/builds/513
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04:49:33 <instant-buildbot> build #606 of win32-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/win32-nightly-default/builds/606
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06:02:33 <instant-buildbot> build #500 of macosx-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/macosx-nightly-default/builds/500
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09:08:03 <Mic|web> Hi
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09:08:28 <aleth> Hi :)
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09:10:47 <Mic|web> Hello flo
09:10:56 <flo> hello :)
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09:11:24 <flo> am I the only one thinking that the "check for updates" & download update & restart process requires too many clicks?
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09:11:57 <aleth> flo: Will it go silent when FF updates do the same?
09:12:08 <flo> when I open my laptop and Instantbird isn't connected, I would like to just press a keyboard shortcut, and have it automatically download the latest update and restart to install it (and it correctly reconnects automatically after the restart already :))
09:12:26 <flo> aleth: silent updates still need a restart,  don't they? ;)
09:12:45 <Mic|web> restartless updates? flo, I think you're asking too much ;)
09:13:09 <flo> Mic|web: but wouldn't that be nice?
09:13:30 <aleth> It would be nice... for some kinds of updates it would even be possible
09:13:30 <Mic|web> Yes, I think there's some Linux distributions that can actually do that.
09:13:45 <Mic|web> (i.e. updating the kernel without needing to restart)
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09:20:10 <flo> is aleth interesting in reviewing bug 1472 before I commit it out of a selfish desire to no longer close a "ChanServ" tab at least twice everyday? :-D
09:20:16 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1472 enh, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Handle a ChanServ entry message
09:20:22 <flo> (I'm saying that, but I actually have a nit to comment about :-/)
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09:23:53 <Mic|web> Should the "Connect this account now." checkbox on the last page of the account wizard rather be labelled with "Automatically connect this account."?
09:25:21 <flo> possibly, yes
09:26:32 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org denied review for attachment 1538 on bug 1472.
09:26:33 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org granted feedback for attachment 1538 on bug 1472.
09:26:34 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1472 enh, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Handle a ChanServ entry message
09:26:45 <aleth> Is there really a typo in the 3-line MPL2 header?
09:27:07 <aleth> (why is "you" in the third line capitalised?)
09:27:25 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1475 filed by benediktp@ymail.com.
09:27:27 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1475 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, "Connect this account now."-label for checkbox misleading
09:27:45 <Mic|web> Maybe you captitalize that like "I" in "official" texts?
09:28:05 <Mic|web> Ignore my typo there, please :D
09:28:11 <aleth> I do hope it's something legal like that
09:28:15 <flo> http://www.mozilla.org/MPL/headers/
09:29:55 <flo> and now that you mention it, clokep's license header isn't correct in that file :-D
09:30:06 <aleth> that's what I was looking at
09:30:11 <Mic|web> aleth: file a bug on BMO, I'm sure they'll tell you ;)
09:30:17 <flo> ahah
09:30:48 <aleth> But the "You" part is in the original too. Probably US legalese
09:33:36 <flo> "both conversations objects" shouldn't that be "conversation"?
09:38:03 <aleth> flo: Just looked at that patch, it looks good to me apart from the things you have already identified. But I haven't tested it.
09:38:14 <flo> I tested the previous iteration
09:38:21 <flo> I'm now looking at bug 1359
09:38:24 <aleth> I wonder if there will be warnings in conversation.xml for participants that are not in this.buddies
09:38:24 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1359 nor, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Abstract the shared methods between ircChannel and ircConversation
09:38:40 <flo> I'm writing comments, but they are trivial nits
09:40:07 <aleth> Ah no, it should work.
09:42:10 <flo> aleth: want to look at that one too?
09:45:54 <aleth> Wouldn't it be possible to unify the unInit methods completely?
09:46:22 <flo> they need to call the method from jsProtoHelper, which differs for private conversations and chatrooms
09:46:28 <aleth> (by using __proto__ to get GenericConvIMPrototype vs GenericConvChatPrototype)
09:46:51 <aleth> I may be confused about this, haven't followed it up
09:47:16 <flo> hmm
09:47:21 <flo> that seems possible, but fragile
09:47:50 <aleth> At any rate, I think unInitIRC has a misleading name
09:48:01 <flo> so you agree with my comment ;)
09:48:02 <aleth> Why fragile?
09:48:09 <aleth> I haven't seen your comment
09:48:14 <aleth> Let me check...
09:48:42 <flo> because if someone ever creates another object inheriting from the existing conversation object, the proto chain will be one level deeper
09:48:53 <aleth> Ah, right.
09:49:11 <aleth> Seems there should be a way to refer to the parent though
09:51:06 <aleth> Am I right in thinking Object.GetPrototypeOf would be just as fragile?
09:51:31 <flo> it's the same, just without the mozilla-specific JS engine extension
09:53:17 <flo> the only way to make it less fragile would be to have the copySharedBaseToPrototype generate the unInit method by giving aPrototype's prototype to it in an argument, with bind maybe
09:53:32 <flo> but I think that would be adding complexity to the code, not simplifying it
09:53:48 <flo> and we may want to add something specific to either of the unInit functions in the future
09:54:13 <aleth> Yes, it just seems a shame.
09:55:09 <aleth> Or should copySharedBaseToPrototype set a variable to GenericConvIMPrototype vs GenericConvChatPrototype as appropriate, which unInit could refer to?
09:55:31 <flo> it's more or less what I just said
09:56:14 <aleth> Yeah...
09:56:27 <flo> or just have each object put _inheritedUninit: GenericConvIMPrototype.uninit, in their prototype
09:57:01 <flo> but I don't think we would be winning anything. It's increasing the abstraction of the code to save what, 2 lines?
09:57:18 <aleth> Doesn't seem any clearer either.
09:57:20 <aleth> Oh well...
09:57:27 <flo> yeah
09:57:37 <flo> I think we should just fix the name of the shared uninit method :)
09:57:44 <aleth> At least most of the duplication will be gone :)
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10:20:02 <clokep> aleth: I believe the "You" is capitalized because it's defined as a term in the actual license.
10:20:19 <flo> clokep: good morning :)
10:20:19 <clokep> Is my header wrong? I have a macro set up to insert them that I made a long time ago...it's possible they updated it since. :(
10:21:49 <clokep> Good morning flo.
10:22:13 <aleth> clokep: Ah, that makes sense.
10:22:22 <flo> apparently the only other file in chat/ with the same issue on the header is chat/protocols/irc/ircWatchMonitor.jsm
10:22:52 <flo> instantbird/content/accountWizard.{css,xml} also have it
10:23:09 <clokep> Well I wouldn't be surprised about ircWatchMonitor...
10:23:11 <clokep> What's the issue btw?
10:23:23 <flo> isn't that explained clearly in my comment in the bug?
10:23:47 <clokep> Ah, I didn't get to that email yet!
10:24:04 <clokep> Do you want me to fix it on ircWatchMonitor and just throw it into that patch?
10:24:30 <flo> not sure, as fixing it in the 2 instantbird/ UI files in the same patch would be really strange
10:24:43 <flo> do as you like :)
10:25:49 <clokep> It still annoys me that the XML comment on http://www.mozilla.org/MPL/headers/ has two spaces after the period.
10:26:23 <flo> has anybody reported that?
10:26:26 <aleth> Yes, it just looks wrong.
10:28:54 <clokep> flo: It used to three spaces I think and they changed it to two?
10:29:02 <clokep> But no, I haven't.
10:29:48 <flo> clokep: http://dxr.lanedo.com/search.cgi?tree=mozilla-central&request_time=1338546570816&ext=xml&string=%22You%20can%20obtain%20one%22
10:29:57 <flo> but there's only one space in the headers gerv has actually put in the source code ;)
10:31:22 <clokep> :)
10:32:43 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com requested review from florian@instantbird .org for attachment 1540 on bug 1472.
10:32:45 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1472 enh, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Handle a ChanServ entry message
10:33:01 <flo> clokep: do your 2 patches bitrot each other?
10:33:34 <clokep> flo: No, there is an offset if you apply 1359 first though.
10:33:44 <flo> ok :)
10:35:25 <clokep> Yes I disliked the unInitIRC name too...
10:35:57 <clokep> aleth: I purposefully haven't moved _setMode into it (I thought about it) because I expect to use it on the account object as well.
10:39:19 <flo> clokep: !channel[0] == "[" uh...
10:39:30 <clokep> flo: Yeah that's not right. :(
10:39:39 <clokep> I think there's another issue too.
10:39:51 <flo> !channel is probably enough, without the .length
10:41:07 <flo> ok, fix that test and then it will be ready to check-in :)
10:41:31 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com cancelled review?(florian@instantbird .org) for attachment 1539 on bug 1359.
10:41:32 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com requested review from florian@instantbird .org for attachment 1541 on bug 1359.
10:41:38 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1359 nor, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Abstract the shared methods between ircChannel and ircConversation
10:43:52 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org granted review for attachment 1541 on bug 1359.
10:43:55 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1359 nor, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Abstract the shared methods between ircChannel and ircConversation
10:45:19 <clokep> flo: I'm no longer getting my "is not a registered nick" with the patch in bug 1472. :-S
10:45:23 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1472 enh, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Handle a ChanServ entry message
10:45:23 <clokep> That's why I'm hesitant.
10:45:36 <flo> ah
10:45:51 <flo> so you killed nickserv too? Awesome :)
10:45:54 <flo> (kidding, of course)
10:46:02 <clokep> But I shouldn't be...
10:46:07 <clokep> I can IM it and it responds fine.
10:46:22 <flo> maybe you registered your nick? :)
10:46:42 <clokep> Wait actually I'm not sending a password. (o-O)
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10:48:59 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com cancelled review?(florian@instantbird .org) for attachment 1540 on bug 1472.
10:49:00 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com requested review from florian@instantbird .org for attachment 1542 on bug 1472.
10:49:01 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1472 enh, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Handle a ChanServ entry message
10:49:21 <flo> so you are now confident that it doesn't break nickserv? :)
10:49:33 <clokep> It seemed to work fine. :) Yes.
10:50:20 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org granted review for attachment 1542 on bug 1472.
10:51:19 <flo> the only sad thing about such a patch, is that nobody will notice
10:51:33 <flo> because we notice annoyances only when they are there, not when they are no longer there
10:51:49 <clokep> flo: It's like the watch monitor patch too. ;)
10:51:53 <clokep> It's nicer, but no one will really care.
10:52:15 <flo> the patch that tells me that j b is "currently away from the computer"? :)
10:52:19 <flo> it's a lot more visible :)
10:52:25 <clokep> Yes. :)
10:52:39 <flo> I think people who like grouping buddies into contacts will notice
10:52:49 <flo> as IRC buddies suddenly become usable
10:53:10 <flo> now if only the MSN prpl could handle idleness correctly... :)
10:53:13 <aleth> It's like any really good UI improvement - you will definitely notice when you have to use a different client again ;)
10:53:27 <flo> aleth: you think I'll have to?
10:54:03 <aleth> heh... maybe mibbit on someone else's computer? ;)
10:54:32 <flo> I don't touch other people's computers :-P
10:55:02 <clokep> flo: And Facebook could handle away...
10:55:17 <flo> yeah...
10:55:36 <aleth> Maybe somebody will write us a MSN XMPP plugin at some point...
10:55:49 <flo> I should :-|
10:56:00 <flo> would be easy to pretend it's "Thunderbird work"
10:56:12 <flo> the biggest benefit would be for Tb anyway
10:56:18 <flo> as we already support MSN ;)
10:58:27 <clokep> Hah, windows just informed me I have "53 min (10%) battery life" remaining...
10:58:36 <clokep> Idc if it's 10% if it's 53 minutes. :P
10:58:46 <flo> great battery
10:58:57 <clokep> I got about 15 hours or so when it was new...
10:59:07 <flo> really? :)
10:59:35 <clokep> Yes, although not when compiling. ;)
10:59:42 <clokep> That's like browsing the internet and doing random crap.
11:00:13 <flo> so only internet websites that don't use flash? ;)
11:00:26 <clokep> I use 64-bit Firefox, no flash for me.
11:00:31 * clokep needs to go.
11:00:31 <flo> cool :)
11:00:33 <clokep> I might be back in a bit.
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11:30:45 <clokep_> flo: Thanks for the reviews btw. :)
11:33:19 <flo> thanks for making the libpurple irc prpl comparatively unusable ;)
11:34:51 <instantbot> aletheia2@fastmail.fm cancelled review?(florian@instantbird .org) for attachment 1420 on bug 1236.
11:34:52 <instantbot> aletheia2@fastmail.fm requested review from florian@instantbird .org for attachment 1543 on bug 1236.
11:34:54 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1236 nor, --, 1.2, nobody, NEW, JSON log viewer conversation bubbles all have the same colour for libpurple IM conversations
11:35:55 <clokep_> aleth: Btw about that bug ^ ^, I think we should not care about logs made w/ 1.2a1pre. It sucks they won't be colored...but that's what we got for using nightlies.
11:36:23 <clokep_> It'd be nice to have a sed/awk/grep/python/perl/javascript/ruby/lisp/what-have-you script to fix them, but I don't think we need to fix them in Instantbird.
11:36:49 <aleth> Yes, I'm not really fussed about it either. I tried to find a way to make it work for both, but it's not really important.
11:39:29 * clokep_ grumbles about ctrl + fn being switched on this laptop than his normal one....
11:39:38 <clokep_> flo: I just aim to make Pidgin obsolete. ;)
11:41:08 <flo> clokep_: don't forget chatzilla! ;)
11:41:28 <clokep_> Yes, well that too. :)
11:41:44 <aleth> That's already done, right? ;)
11:42:10 <aleth> OK, they have an IRC network selector...
11:42:34 <flo> I wonder if porting the IM-in-Tb feature to SeaMonkey would stop SeaMonkey people from helping to keep ChatZilla alive, and put a nail on its coffin ;)
11:43:16 <flo> fixing https://wiki.mozilla.org/IRC could also help
11:43:48 <FeuerFliege> flo: SM people aren’t to fond of changes …
11:44:09 <flo> FeuerFliege: they aren't fond of unmaintained crap either ;)
11:44:28 <flo> FeuerFliege: it may also depends if you are talking about the SeaMonkey users or developers :)
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11:46:44 <FeuerFliege> If you can make IM-in-TB look like chatzilla you might have a chance ;)
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11:55:19 <FeuerFliege> who should I name for feedback/review of bugs?
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11:57:04 <FeuerFliege> did you divide the responsibility somehow?
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12:04:29 <instantbot> bugi@media.fjmail.de requested review from florian@instantbird .org for attachment 1544 on bug 1475.
12:04:32 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1475 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, "Connect this account now."-label for checkbox misleading
12:04:55 <flo> FeuerFliege: I think Mook said that it looks like his chatzilla
12:05:44 <flo> FeuerFliege: for the feedback/review, you can request it from anybody who seems to have relevant experience in that code area
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12:07:50 <flo> and I'm probably the slowest reviewer these days
12:08:06 <flo> but it may be almost on purpose, to encourage others to review code :)
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12:11:18 * flo will assume this time that nothing is broken :)
12:11:22 <flo> deomega1: Good morning :)
12:11:39 * aleth pings flo re the unread ruler patches
12:11:52 <flo> aleth: no :).
12:12:00 <flo> I'm working on the Thunderbird address book
12:12:00 <deomega1> good morning.   lol.   is the update for  the clokep addon come from teh system core or should I expect  to see an updated version of the addon itself?
12:12:13 <aleth> flo: well, not right this minute :P
12:12:20 <instantbot> bugi@media.fjmail.de requested review from benediktp@ymail.com  for attachment 1544 on bug 1475.
12:12:22 <FeuerFliege> flo: well it is Mic reported the bug, if I managed to write a patch it must be so trivial everyone should be able to review it :) 
12:12:22 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1475 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, "Connect this account now."-label for checkbox misleading
12:12:23 <flo> deomega1: I think clokep has more than one add-on ;)
12:12:25 <deomega1> sort by status addon
12:12:41 * deomega1 was trying to remember  the name :)
12:12:50 <flo> FeuerFliege: I think the code review isn't the difficult part, what could take time is agreeing on the UI change ;)
12:13:07 <flo> hmm, I don't think anybody took time to investigate the real cause of that issue :(
12:13:37 <deomega1> ok :(
12:13:39 <flo> iirc clokep thought the add-on wasn't really broken, but more or less exposing a bug of the core application, that we had already noticed but was less annoying when hte add-on isn't installed
12:14:07 <aleth> deomega1: did you file a bug so the issue doesn't get lost?
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12:14:32 <deomega1> aleth: no :)
12:14:36 <flo> aleth: there's bug 1377 for what I had in mind
12:14:42 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1377 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, aContactA/B errors when buddies sign in or out
12:15:06 <flo> unfortunately we don't have steps to reproduce
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12:16:14 <deomega1> i told clokep that I never reallynoticed this until I started using the two step log in for my google account and it only happens with the google account (as far as I know anyway)
12:17:08 <deomega1> So maybe that is one way to try to reproduce it.  I hope.
12:17:30 <flo> I think that's unrelated
12:17:44 <deomega1> that is what he said as well, but that is all i have 
12:18:48 <deomega1> doctor, I can only give you my symptoms and when they started occurring :)
12:21:23 <deomega1> does the mac os use Glass?
12:21:35 <deomega1> transparency?
12:21:46 <flo> no
12:22:40 <deomega1> I notice that Msft is moving away from it in windows 8... so I assumed that mac never went that way. :)   Msft is calling glass cheep and cheesy looking.  Interesting turn.
12:24:33 <aleth> I was never a fan. Transparency is not good for legibility in most cases I think.
12:24:56 <aleth> Looks good on screenshots I guess...
12:25:33 <flo> apparently reviewing 2 patches adds 2 new patches to my review queue immediately ;)
12:25:54 <aleth> It's the conservation law of patch queues
12:26:19 <deomega1> I agree regarding the legibility... certainly creates  wasted space (though I 'was' in love with the appearance)
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12:28:59 <flo> editing http://mxr.mozilla.org/comm-central/source/mail/components/addrbook/content/abCardViewOverlay.js without wanting to rewrite half of it is difficult :-/
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12:30:29 <aleth> ouch
12:31:20 <flo> so the address book is forked between Tb and SM
12:31:36 <flo> but some CPP file uses the localized strings from it
12:32:29 <flo> the code used to generate HTML to print when printing a card :(
12:32:35 <clokep_> FeuerFliege: In general if you have no idea who to put for a reviewer, put me and I'll redirect it.
12:33:05 <clokep_> deomega1: Yes, I haven't investigated that (hard without steps to reproduce :(), but yeah I think it's an issue w/ the core that the add-on just makes occur way more frequently.
12:33:12 <flo> clokep_: but you'll also feel free to take the request over if the review was requested from me anyway ;)
12:33:25 <clokep_> flo: Yes, I do that too. :)
12:33:37 <flo> (and it's great!) 
12:33:39 <deomega1> clokep_:   Thank you very much.
12:34:04 <clokep_> I think most of the contact issues in the buddy list make me just want to rewrite that code though. :-S
12:34:40 <flo> you are brave :)
12:34:48 <flo> they make me want to look somewhere elese :-D
12:34:51 <deomega1> it was a very nice addon.. very practical.
12:35:02 <flo> especially all the issues about our usage of sqlite
12:35:10 <flo> make me just want to put everything in a json file
12:35:15 <clokep_> flo: I didn't say I was going to do it, just that it made me /want/ to do it.
12:35:49 <clokep_> flo: Did we ever find out who to talk to about wiki.mozilla.org/IRC? Or should I just modify that page? :P
12:36:51 <flo> if you want to talk to someone, that would be Lsblakk (the original author I think)
12:37:12 <flo> but I think you can feel free to just edit
12:37:26 <flo> and discuss if anyone complains or reverts your edits
12:37:35 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com granted review for attachment 1544 on bug 1475.
12:37:37 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1475 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, "Connect this account now."-label for checkbox misleading
12:38:30 <clokep_> How the hell do you log into WMO? :-S
12:38:44 <flo> clokep_: shouldn't connectNow be renamed to connectAutomatically?
12:39:04 <flo> clokep_: "Log in / create account" in the left column
12:39:16 <clokep_> flo: Yes. :(
12:39:22 <clokep_> flo: Ah-ha. I was looking top right...
12:40:38 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com denied review for attachment 1544 on bug 1475.
12:40:41 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1475 enh, --, ---, bugi, ASSI, "Connect this account now."-label for checkbox misleading
12:40:43 <clokep_> Ah, and now I'm logged in I get the old (nice) WMO look!
12:41:19 <flo> that code is so wrong :(
12:41:26 <flo> (still ranting about the address book, sorry)
12:42:47 <clokep_> "Instantbird is a cross-platform multi-protocol instant messaging client based on Mozilla technologies (and libpurple from Pidgin)."?
12:43:04 <flo> who cares about the obsolete part? ;)
12:43:15 <flo> it's extensible!
12:43:21 <flo> (you are writing for a mozilla website)
12:43:26 <clokep_> True.
12:43:34 * clokep_ wonders if he should include Thunderbird.
12:43:41 <flo> no? :)
12:43:47 <aleth> no :)
12:43:58 <flo> let their marketing team handle it
12:46:56 <clokep_> OK, I updated it.
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12:50:26 <flo> why isn't it listed before chatzilla?
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12:51:03 <clokep_> flo: Because I wasn't really sure where to list it, so the "safest" seems to be the end.
12:51:17 <clokep_> I don't really know what order that list is in.
12:55:22 <flo> should we include a screenshot to encourage to use SSL and the 6697 port?
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13:27:47 <flo> pff, http://mxr.mozilla.org/comm-central/source/mail/components/addrbook/content/abCardViewOverlay.js#441 doesn't even always return a boolean
13:31:12 <Mic> Maybe that's intentional? ;)
13:32:36 <flo> Mic: I couldn't help rewriting it: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/43915
13:33:15 <Mic> I doubt that matches the coding style in this file ;)
13:33:39 <flo> that file has random indentation...
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13:40:58 <clokep_work> That looks like a fun file. :)
13:56:24 * FireFly_TC knows that FireFly_TB belongs to him, but cannot find the right computer …
13:58:23 <clokep_work> Haha.
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14:01:01 <Mic> FireFly_TC: recover/release the nick to get it back?
14:01:06 <FireFly_TC> My best guess is that I forgot to shutdown the PC at my girl’s flat.
14:01:51 <FireFly_TC> Mic: nah, it’s not important.
14:08:30 <flo> both FireFly_TC and FireFly_TB are connected from the same IP
14:08:47 <flo> so except if you use a proxy, it's unlikely that it's a computer in a different place ;)
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14:11:43 <FeuerFliege> flo: same Wifi
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14:26:46 <clokep_work> For those not on the pidgin mailing list: http://pidgin-stats.alwaysdata.net/collectstats/display/
14:27:59 * flo sugggests that we send them all our non-developer linux users, and take in exchange all their windows (and Mac?) users :-P
14:28:07 <flo> *suggests
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15:35:37 <instantbot> New Core - General bug 1476 filed by benediktp@ymail.com.
15:35:39 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1476 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Logger component should be able to deal with broken log files
15:39:40 <instantbot> aletheia2@fastmail.fm set the Resolution field on bug 1476 to DUPLICATE of bug 1448.
15:39:45 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1476 enh, --, ---, nobody, RESO DUPLICATE, Logger component should be able to deal with broken log files
15:39:46 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1448 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Handle bad log files properly
15:42:16 <Mic> The .. summary is similar, yes :P
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17:44:07 <wnayes> flo: What would you think about avoiding "Properties" buttons in the wizard altogether? I'm having a tough time juggling all these considerations in the UI (user hitting back button after viewing summary page and changing checked accounts, settings, etc.) and being that Properties changes are available immediately after in the Account Manager, it seems like it would save a lot of time.
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18:01:22 <clokep_work> Just for fun. ;) http://pastebin.instantbird.com/43943
18:01:45 <clokep_work> wnayes: The issue is how to get back to the full listing after going to the properties tab?
18:01:58 <clokep_work> You could pop up the properties dialog from the account manager instead of using the one that's part of the wizard.
18:02:02 <clokep_work> Probably non-ideal though. :)
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18:04:01 <aleth> What is the "Properties" button for in the Import wizard?
18:04:33 <aleth> Is it to help identify an account?
18:04:47 <clokep_work> aleth: It's to modify advanced properties.
18:05:08 <aleth> Then I agree with wnayes that that can be done after import.
18:05:27 <aleth> It seems a separate step to me.
18:06:00 <clokep_work> Why is it not a separate step for the regular account wizard then? :)
18:06:24 <wnayes> clokep_work: There's just a lot of considerations to make. These properties need to be kept with their corresponding accounts, but when properties can be changed in both the summary and "accounts found" pages and the user can freely navigate back/forward and checking/unchecking the accounts they want, how would these end up being handled? It's very confusing.
18:06:46 <aleth> Because in the regular account wizard you are setting up a *new* account from scratch
18:08:03 <aleth> So the regular account wizard is to help you set those properties
18:08:20 <aleth> The importer doesn't need that - it already has them
18:08:52 <aleth> If it needs to ask questions, that's a separate interface I think.
18:09:23 <clokep_work> aleth: OK, I can buy that.
18:09:27 <clokep_work> wnayes: I agree it's confusing.
18:11:24 <aleth> clokep_work: That's quite the command line ;)
18:16:24 <clokep_work> aleth: It still counts as one line, right? ;)
18:16:29 <clokep_work> (Is it obvious what it's doing? :-S)
18:17:47 <aleth> Apportioning blame ;)
18:18:01 <clokep_work> Yes, but for the current code base. hg churn takes into account history.
18:18:13 * clokep_work doesn't know what to alias that command to.
18:18:22 <clokep_work> wnayes: I think it's probably OK to leave it out for now.
18:18:30 <aleth> Ah, right. I don't know hg well enough for that.
18:18:42 <clokep_work> We can always decide it's necessary afterward, but I think aleth's reasoning is sound.
18:19:06 <clokep_work> (If the importer isn't importing all those options...it's either a) not a great importer, or b) something the user probably doesn't care about anyway.)
18:21:06 <wnayes> clokep_work: That's what I was planning to do, my goal is to have the summary page showing entries and the basic flow of the wizard working by the end of today.
18:21:19 <clokep_work> :)
18:24:00 <clokep_work> Great! I keep meaning to pull your branch so I can play w/ it... :-/
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18:27:52 <clokep_work> Ah, this listing is a lot better btw: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/43946
18:27:58 <clokep_work> Since it ignores libpurple and the libraries we use.
18:29:14 <clokep_work> Doesn't take into account aliases though. ;)
18:29:26 <aleth> It might be an idea for the import wizard, when it ends, to display the account manager. At that point the user can check the properties of what has been imported, and/or add new accounts.
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18:29:58 <aleth> (maybe that was the plan already)
18:30:39 <clokep_work> Yeah, probably.
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18:31:52 <aleth> It also provides an interface to connect the new accounts, so wnayes doesn't need to duplicate that either (unless there is a reason for validation purposes?)
18:32:17 <wnayes> I think the wizard already makes sure the account manager is open (at least in some cases). Adding new accounts will also be possible while remaining in the wizard (another thing to think about :)).
18:32:39 <aleth> Of course there are 1.2-wanted bugs open for redesigning the account manager afaik ;)
18:32:49 <aleth> (or at least some part of it)
18:33:22 <aleth> "Adding new accounts will also be possible while remaining in the wizard (another thing to think about :))." <- yeah, that's the bit I was wondering whether it was neccessary 
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20:36:08 * clokep hates that Google adds random people to his buddy list.
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20:46:41 <douglaswth> you mean people you friend on google+?
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20:49:53 <clokep> douglaswth: I mean random people I send emails to.
20:50:17 <clokep> (Like if I'm on an email chain with my friend foo, and his friend bar...who I know but am not actually friends with.)
20:50:17 <douglaswth> oh, I think you can turn adding them to your address book off
20:50:29 <clokep> If you can, they make it awfully hard to find that.
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21:01:05 * clokep is now known as clokep_
21:04:19 * clokep_ is working on something flo will enjoy. ;)
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21:06:11 <flo> clokep_: I find http://logbot.glob.com.au/?c=mozilla%23maildev&s=1+Jun+2012&e=1+Jun+2012 almost completely unreadable :-S.
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21:06:23 <flo> how do people read IRC without colored bubbles? :)
21:06:49 <clokep_> flo: Not what I'm working. :p
21:06:56 <clokep_> But yes, I really hate that logger.
21:10:41 <flo> I wouldn't say I hate it
21:10:53 <flo> it provides a very good excuse for not reading the log when the work day is over :)
21:12:50 <clokep_> I'd say hate. ;)
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21:37:40 <instantbot> New Core - IRC bug 1477 filed by clokep@gmail.com.
21:37:41 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com requested review from aletheia2@fastmail. fm for attachment 1545 on bug 1477.
21:37:42 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1477 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Authenticate with NickServ
21:37:59 * clokep_ is now known as clokep
21:39:52 <clokep> flo ^ ^ Should make one of your extensions obsolete. ;)
21:41:35 <flo> clokep: it was too easy to guess what you were working on ;)
21:42:06 <clokep> flo: Shhhh. Wasn't too hard once I had the infrastructure there. :)
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21:48:54 * ChanServ sets mode +h Mic 
21:50:16 <Mic> clokep: is isEnabled in servicesChanServ correct? I wonder because it's referring to nickserv and passwords in its check there...
21:50:35 <clokep> Mic: Bah. :(
21:52:23 <clokep> Mic: Yeah, it should still be true.
21:52:32 <clokep> That's why I separated them into separate objects. :)
21:57:50 <Mic> Interesting to see how to add such functionality :)
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22:01:21 <aleth> Yay, NickServ! :)
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22:03:11 <aleth> I guess it'll apply after the other patch lands tonight...
22:03:45 <Mic> That's all very well, but ....
22:04:01 <Mic> ...Y U no support "Perfom"?
22:04:29 <Mic> scnr ;)
22:04:46 <clokep> Perform?
22:05:13 <Mic> mIRC has something called perform. It's commands that are sent when connecting to the server.
22:05:56 <Mic> That's where you put your authentication stuff iirc (it's years since I used it last time) 
22:05:57 <clokep> Ah, yeah.
22:06:00 <clokep> Most clients have that.
22:06:07 <clokep> Usually called random things.
22:06:39 <clokep> Someone filed a bug to support that. ;)
22:06:48 <-- Optimizer has quit (Ping timeout)
22:06:50 <aleth> heh... really?
22:06:50 * Mic hates the ctrl+shift+w shortcut of Fx :(
22:07:01 <clokep> But that's pretty much WONTFIX to me...you can make an extension to do it easily enough.
22:08:34 <Mic> Don't forget to add a smiley when you suggest that ;)
22:09:15 <aleth> Apart from that bug Mic found, shouldn't the user be told if the password was wrong? (I mean, outside the error console)
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22:10:06 <flo> clokep: would be nice to explain in the WONTFIX comment what the usable extensibility hook is for that
22:10:45 <flo> even better to offer a bootstap.js demo of a trivial add-on sending a trivial (not even customizable) command to the server when connecting
22:11:05 <clokep> aleth: ...we return false and the message is displayed in the conversation.
22:11:23 <clokep> flo: Yeah, probably. I'd need to find the bug again though. :P
22:11:47 <aleth> clokep: OK, sorry, I'm just looking at the diff.
22:12:02 <Mic> Good night
22:12:42 <clokep> aleth: OK?
22:12:45 <clokep> Goodnight Mic.
22:13:15 <clokep> aleth: It's possible desirable to display a localized message, however.
22:13:27 * flo wonders if Mic is now following the IM-in-Tb component
22:13:29 <aleth> clokep: I'll see tomorrow when I apply the patch to test it :)
22:13:29 <clokep> But it was certainly easier to just let the message fall through. :-D
22:13:44 <clokep> aleth: OK! Do you want a new patch w/ the fix Mic noticed?
22:14:14 <aleth> clokep: There might be a need for localization, but if those messages are coming from NickServ, I suppose they are coming from the server, so I'm not sure.
22:14:38 <Mic> flo: I'm following for quite a while already.
22:14:41 <aleth> I don't mind - up to you.
22:14:49 <Mic> *it
22:15:25 <flo> clokep: is the patch trivila enough that I may want to r+ it and push it tonight? :-D
22:15:28 <flo> *trivial
22:16:35 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com cancelled review?(aletheia2@fastmail. fm) for attachment 1545 on bug 1477.
22:16:36 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com requested review from florian@instantbird .org for attachment 1546 on bug 1477.
22:16:37 <clokep> flo: It's fairly trivial.
22:16:37 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1477 enh, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Authenticate with NickServ
22:18:33 <aleth> I can't see anything wrong with it, but it's untested, so up to you :)
22:18:55 <clokep> I tested it a bit, but I obviously haven't been like running w/ it.
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22:23:57 <clokep> flo: Is the topic always displayed in the Thunderbird chat UI?
22:29:25 <flo> why not?
22:30:31 <clokep> flo: Because I don't understand https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=742356
22:32:32 <flo> clokep: the report means "IRC in Thunderbird doesn't work exactly like IRC in my terminal and that annoys me as I greatly dislike GUI applications."
22:32:41 <clokep> Yes.
22:32:43 <aleth> "on all IRC clients I know"... again?
22:32:47 <clokep> I'm going to reply "The topic is always available"
22:32:52 <clokep> But I wasn't sure if it was or not. :)
22:33:20 <flo> clokep: it's arguably less visible on Tb than on Instantbird, as for Tb it's in the right pane, not at the top of the conversation
22:33:29 <flo> but I think we display it in the room when joining
22:33:53 <flo> clokep: anyway, we can just tell him to type "/quote TOPIC" instead of "/topic" to display the channel ;)
22:34:03 <flo> s/channel/topic/
22:34:13 <clokep> flo: There's another bug about that.
22:34:19 <clokep> (It being on the side, not on top.)
22:34:26 <flo> :)
22:35:26 <flo> another bug, another wontfix ;)
22:37:52 <flo> "You could always do |/quote TOPIC| to clear it though." err, to display it ;)
22:38:39 <clokep> Oops, you're right. :)
22:39:19 <clokep> Thanks.
22:40:45 <flo> np
22:41:53 <flo> "but if always fall back"
22:41:56 <flo> if -> it
22:42:30 <flo> so servicesBase is already deprecated?
22:44:06 <aleth> Does /quote TOPIC actually work?
22:44:21 <aleth> (It doesn't for me - "not enough parameters")
22:45:24 <clokep> flo: Idk, we can name them whatever we want.
22:45:39 <flo> aleth: uh, we need the channel name :(
22:45:47 <aleth> Yup.
22:45:52 <flo> "/quote TOPIC #instantbird" works
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22:48:42 <clokep> Yeah, you're right. :( My bad.
22:50:25 <flo> that makes it a little bit less usable for regular use
22:51:42 <clokep> I don't think it's useful anyway.
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22:52:13 <flo> I know I used it once when testing one of your patches, and finding an issue in it :-P
22:52:32 <flo> I don't see a reason for a real user to need that
22:53:15 <flo> clokep: I'm a bit confused by your nickserv patch.
22:54:12 <flo> what's the benefit of the nickserv option compared to the pass option? Isn't it producing the same result?
22:54:44 <flo> does the user have to select an advanced option with a strange name to get rid of the nickserv noise?
22:57:22 <clokep> flo: It keeps the messages from popping u, yes it requires changing an advanced option.
22:57:53 <flo> why can't it be handled automatically by default?
22:58:21 <clokep> flo: Because what if there isn't a NickServ and someone is posing at it? I don't want to just send your password off to a person without telling you.
22:59:01 <flo> why do you need to send it to nickserv if sending it as PASS does the same result?
23:02:22 <flo> clokep: https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/attachment.cgi?id=1541 doesn't apply. Neither before nor after https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/attachment.cgi?id=1542
23:03:01 * clokep is on the phone...
23:05:46 <clokep> flo: Give me a second.
23:06:11 <clokep> We don't necessarily need to send it to NickServ, but not every server supports forwarding PASS to NickServ.
23:06:47 <clokep> flo: What didn't apply?
23:09:43 <flo> clokep: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/43981
23:10:30 <clokep> flo: So the patch from bug 1359 isn't applying, right?
23:10:36 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1359 nor, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Abstract the shared methods between ircChannel and ircConversation
23:10:42 <flo> it's that patch, yes
23:10:53 <clokep> (Do you already have bug 1472 applied or not?)
23:10:56 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1472 enh, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Handle a ChanServ entry message
23:12:56 <flo> 01:02:21 - flo: clokep: https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/attachment.cgi?id=1541 doesn't apply. Neither before nor after https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/attachment.cgi?id=1542
23:13:07 <flo> but now I do :)
23:13:49 <clokep> flo: Attached in the bug...
23:13:52 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com requested review from florian@instantbird .org for attachment 1547 on bug 1359.
23:13:57 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1359 nor, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Abstract the shared methods between ircChannel and ircConversation
23:14:12 <flo> it's different to the point you need another review?
23:14:44 <clokep> flo: No, I just resolved the rejection.
23:15:59 <flo> Good bye ChanServ \o/
23:18:13 <clokep> :)
23:18:17 <clokep> Well only the one situation haha.
23:18:25 <clokep> I'm sure ChanServ is annoying in other ways too
23:20:34 <instantbot> Check-in: http://hg.instantbird.org/instantbird/rev/de640894b84e - Florian Quèze - Fix the wrapping in 2 MPL2 license headers.
23:20:36 <instantbot> Check-in: http://hg.instantbird.org/instantbird/rev/7e8c665dda1b - Patrick Cloke - Bug 1472 - Handle a ChanServ entry message, r=fqueze.
23:20:37 <instantbot> Check-in: http://hg.instantbird.org/instantbird/rev/f25198c3c04a - Patrick Cloke - Bug 1359 - Abstract the shared methods between ircChannel and ircConversation, r=fqueze.
23:20:38 <instantbot> Check-in: http://hg.instantbird.org/instantbird/rev/20da6cb12aad - Florian Quèze - Fix copying the username of a message from the Bubbles message theme, r=clokep.
23:20:51 <flo> clokep: has it annoyed you in other ways?
23:22:32 <clokep> Nope. :)
23:22:37 <clokep> I'm sure there are other situations though.
23:22:46 <clokep> I'll close those bugs in a minute.
23:23:24 <clokep> Anyone have recommendations for a "remote desktop" software for a Linux server and Windows clients?
23:23:46 <Mook_astb> for the /topic thing: it seems like avoiding dataloss is a good idea?
23:23:52 <Mook_astb> clokep: NX (nomachine)?
23:24:05 <Mook_astb> NX is awesome, but I've only ever played with the free versions :p
23:24:18 <clokep> Yeah I really only use free things...
23:24:47 <clokep> Mook_astb: Maybe...the help text is wrong also. :(
23:24:49 <Mook_astb> (and it turns out I managed to select past the actual insertion marker, so I didn't notice stuff going by in this channel... I wish the last read marker thing worked)
23:25:23 <clokep> Mook_astb: File a bug in Tb?
23:25:30 <Mook_astb> and the space for the topic above the participant list is kinda narrow and won't fit useful-sized topics :p (and you need to hover over it)
23:25:49 <clokep> And links don't work.
23:25:49 <Mook_astb> clokep: will do so once I get home, via the magic of memoserv.
23:25:57 <Mook_astb> huh, I wonder why tab completion didn't work there
23:26:01 <clokep> All bugs unrelated to what /topic should do IMO.
23:26:10 <clokep> Ah, someone else who actually uses memoserv. ;)
23:29:30 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com set the Resolution field on bug 1472 to FIXED.
23:29:34 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1472 enh, --, 1.2, clokep, RESO FIXED, Handle a ChanServ entry message
23:30:01 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com set the Resolution field on bug 1359 to FIXED.
23:30:03 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1359 nor, --, 1.2, clokep, RESO FIXED, Abstract the shared methods between ircChannel and ircConversation
23:34:35 <instantbot> New Core - IRC bug 1478 filed by clokep@gmail.com.
23:34:36 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com requested review from aletheia2@fastmail. fm for attachment 1548 on bug 1478.
23:34:37 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1478 tri, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, IRC /topic help text is incorrect.
23:35:12 <clokep> wnayes: Any luck getting everything working? :)
23:37:36 <wnayes> clokep: I've got the summary page showing both types of accounts using XBL bindings, haven't gotten to the account creation yet.
23:39:17 <wnayes> Little mistakes take awhile to find, especially when errors don't show from inside XBL bindings.
23:40:20 <instantbot> aletheia2@fastmail.fm denied review for attachment 1548 on bug 1478.
23:40:23 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1478 tri, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, IRC /topic help text is incorrect.
23:40:38 <clokep> wnayes: Yes, that's really frustrating. :(
23:41:32 <clokep> If you really can't find something let us know, sometimes you just need another set of eyes.
23:42:22 <clokep> aleth: Yeah I toyed over that too, I wasn't sure if it was obvious from the new topic being optional...
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23:42:41 <aleth> It's a shame cos I can't think of short way to explain it atm
23:43:06 <aleth> I think it will be obvious to programmers...
23:43:10 <clokep> Me neither. :(
23:44:53 <clokep> aleth: Btw has the #ubuntu message list been better now thta we build it in chunks?
23:45:17 --> jb has joined #instantbird
23:49:28 <aleth> clokep: No, it doesn't fix the problem.
23:50:16 <clokep> :(
23:50:20 <aleth> It might on slow PCs
23:50:42 <aleth> Fixing the listbox issues is difficult.
23:50:58 <clokep> Yeah, I know. :(
23:55:25 <flo> "message list"?
23:55:47 <clokep> Participants list.
23:55:55 <clokep> aleth read my mind, it's cool. :)
23:56:02 <clokep> (^ ^ wrong tab-complete there btw...)
23:56:47 <flo> clokep: I guessed too, but guesses at 2am are dangerous ;)
23:57:05 <flo> we need to display that list in chunks, don't we?
23:57:12 <clokep> I think so, ye.s
23:57:17 <clokep> Similar to what we do for messages.
23:57:25 <flo> or just display the 40 first nicks, and print the others only if the user scrolls
23:57:47 <flo> if we can fake the scrollbar, then it can even be completely invisible :)
23:57:51 <clokep> Similar to what we want to do for messages? :P
23:58:31 <-- wnayes has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2a1pre -- http://www.instantbird.com)
23:58:35 <-- Optimizer has quit (Connection reset by peer)
23:58:43 <flo> yeah...
23:59:02 <aleth> flo: The difficulty is ensuring all listitems bind. And if one enforces this on a list with 1000 entries, it takes seconds to fill. 
23:59:11 <aleth> So faking the scrollbar is probably the way to go :-/
23:59:22 <flo> why do we need all of them to bind?
23:59:30 <flo> can't we just have only 40 listitems?
23:59:31 <aleth> Because otherwise items get lost on scrolling