#instantbird log on 02 12 2012

All times are UTC.

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03:41:04 <instant-buildbot> build #393 of linux-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/linux-nightly-default/builds/393
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05:23:17 <instant-buildbot> build #479 of win32-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/win32-nightly-default/builds/479
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06:52:11 <instant-buildbot> build #385 of macosx-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/macosx-nightly-default/builds/385
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14:12:09 <clokep> Mic: I like the participant count, although I agree it could somehow be placed better.
14:17:53 <flo> bug 219 also sounds like a not very useful meta bug
14:17:57 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=219 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, [meta] Enhance the conversation window
14:18:48 <clokep> I agree.
14:19:58 <flo> I'm not sure we have an open bug for the "Send button" idea described there though
14:20:06 <aleth> Quick, close it before someone implements a "send" button
14:20:25 * clokep dislikes having a "send" button. :-/
14:21:17 <flo> the difficult part with the send button idea is showing it only when it could be valuable (= people using only the mouse, for example after a copy/paste; or people who haven't discovered the <enter> key binding yet)
14:21:26 <aleth> The Venn diagram of "users who need a send button" and "users who are able to discover IB" should be pretty empty
14:22:06 <aleth> Has anyone ever asked for one?
14:22:12 <clokep> Show it only when there is text in the input box and the mouse is over the input box?
14:23:17 <flo> I suspect it would still annoy me :-/
14:23:25 <flo> I frequently have the mouse over the input box
14:23:59 <flo> do we have a bug for the "get rid of the conversation window status bar" yet? :)
14:24:00 <aleth> Wouldn't something like showing "Press Enter to send message" e.g. in the status bar IF there is text entered AND a certain time has elapsed (user is puzzled) be better?
14:24:09 <clokep> flo: Isn't it used by Twitter?
14:24:20 <aleth> flo: Now that I like :)
14:24:48 <aleth> I wonder if the FF floating statusbar has a straightforward interface... it could replace it
14:25:47 <flo> I think we will do like Firefox for the hovered links
14:26:41 <flo> for twitter replies, the idea I want to try is to make the (default) message themes fade out all messages but the one we are replying to
14:27:02 <flo> and for the character count, it would be nice to put it in a corner of the input box
14:27:12 <clokep> So have like an "interacting with type styling.
14:27:57 <flo> the "typing" is a little bit challenging, but a bubble at the bottom of the conversation containing "... is typing" could be nice
14:28:07 <flo> it would be replaced with the real message when it arrives
14:28:29 <clokep> What if they stop typing and don't send a message
14:28:49 <flo> we just hide it (and it horribly jumps)
14:28:57 <clokep> Alright.
14:28:58 <aleth> It should be less than an actual bubble... could be just text
14:29:02 * clokep was referring to the horrible jump.
14:29:06 <aleth> Otherwise you'll constantly read it and be disappointing
14:29:15 <flo> if we are clever enough, we can animate that to shrink...
14:30:01 <flo> aleth: I thought it could be themed like a system message bubble, but with small circles instead of the queue that normal message bubbles have
14:30:13 <flo> like in comics when a character is thinking
14:30:37 <aleth> Hehe, nice idea :)
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14:32:36 <flo> all of these ideas were discussed this week with Blake in the context of Thunderbird's UI, but I think they can benefit Instantbird too if they work nicely :)
14:33:13 <aleth> What will TB use for its message styles?
14:33:31 <flo> a Tb-specific default message theme
14:34:05 <clokep> Blake doesn't like Bubbles, right? :P
14:34:53 <aleth> But will it be the same engine?
14:35:13 <flo> andreas will be in charge of creating the Tb theme
14:35:32 <flo> aleth: same engine? Thunderbird is Mozilla-based, yes :-P
14:36:03 <aleth> I meant the whole adium-style stuff ;)
14:36:37 <flo> yeah
14:36:52 <aleth> I suspect TB will have great search from the start
14:36:57 <flo> that won't make much sense for Tb as the theme selector UI won't be exposed but... don't tell them ;)
14:37:07 <aleth> ok ;)
14:37:51 <flo> "great search"? :-S
14:38:15 <aleth> Well, they have timeline displays etc for emails afaik?
14:38:31 <flo> do you find that user friendly?
14:38:32 <Nicolas> hello =)
14:38:39 <clokep> Hello Nicolas.
14:38:58 <flo> clokep: both Blake and Jb find Bubbles too colorful for Thunderbird
14:38:58 <aleth> flo: It could be nicer, but at least it's global in scope.
14:39:02 <Nicolas> i have decompress my  file omni.jar and now when i launch instantbird i have this error "Registering XPCOM component purplexpcom failed."
14:39:24 <clokep> Nicolas: Did you merge the manifest files?
14:39:55 <clokep> You need to merge chrome.manifest from omni.jar and chrome.manifest that isn't in omni.jar.
14:40:03 <flo> clokep: which file needs to be edited exactly? I couldn't remember to explain Nicolas what he needed to do
14:40:14 <clokep> flo ^ chrome.manifest
14:40:20 <aleth> Nicolas: chrome.manifest
14:40:25 <flo> clokep: isn't there just one line to uncomment so that one includes the other?
14:40:41 <aleth> No, you have to manually concatenate them
14:40:51 <flo> just an inclusion of binary.manifest and interfaces.manifest, or something like that?
14:40:52 <clokep> No.
14:41:00 <flo> I don't remember doing that :-S
14:41:05 <clokep> http://pastebin.instantbird.com/12556 is the merged one.
14:41:16 <clokep> Nicolas: ^ is what your chrome.manifest should look like.
14:42:07 * clokep wonders why you're unpacking omni.jar...
14:42:34 <Nicolas> my chrome.manifest -->manifest components/interfaces.manifest
14:42:35 <Nicolas> manifest components/components.manifest
14:42:37 <Nicolas> manifest chrome/nonlocalized.manifest
14:42:38 <Nicolas> manifest chrome/localized.manifest
14:42:50 <flo> clokep: Nicolas is "our" student from the Evry university.
14:43:02 <clokep> Ah. :) Nice to meet you.
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14:43:12 <aleth> Nicolas: That's because on unpacking omni.jar you overwrote the existing file.
14:43:26 <clokep> (Which has just the first line, the binary.manifest.)
14:43:32 <clokep> So you should be able to just add that back.
14:44:58 <flo> clokep: so after unpacking you just need to uncomment 2 lines at the top of components/components.manifest, right?
14:45:32 <clokep> flo: Maybe. I've never done that. I just merge the two chrome.manifest files.
14:45:47 <clokep> I haven't really done it in a while though as I just build now.
14:45:53 * flo thinks we should document that on the wiki
14:46:17 <flo> yeah, it's exactly the reason why I couldn't explain it clearly: I usually just build :)
14:46:24 <aleth> flo: As far as I recall, there is nothing that is commented out there
14:46:40 <flo> the last time I've done this unpacking thing was to test a fix on Windows I think
14:46:56 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1264 filed by clokep@gmail.com.
14:46:58 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1264 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Add a "Send" button.
14:47:16 <flo> aleth: that file looks like this in omni.jar!/components/ of my nightly: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/12558
14:47:37 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com set the Resolution field on bug 219 to INVALID.
14:47:39 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=219 enh, --, ---, nobody, RESO INVALID, [meta] Enhance the conversation window
14:50:55 <clokep> Unfortunately that doesn't actually close a bug. ;) Just replaces one.
14:51:18 <aleth> flo: I think if you uncomment those you will get duplication warnings. But I'm not sure.
14:51:21 <Nicolas> i have uncomment 2 line at the top of componentsmanifest and it's good thanks =)
14:51:37 <flo> cool :)
14:51:41 <aleth> Oh well ;)
14:51:43 <flo> Nicolas: sorry for the confusing answers :)
14:52:01 <aleth> Sorry...
14:52:18 * clokep isn't sorry. :P
14:52:20 <Nicolas> no probleme =)
14:52:21 <aleth> clokep:You can always close the send button one wontfix ;)
14:53:50 <aleth> Maybe rename it "Find a way to help novice users to send messages"?
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14:54:22 <clokep> I'd prefer something like "Add a discoverable way to send messages"
14:54:28 <clokep> But feel free to rename it if you'd like. :P
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14:55:37 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org denied review for attachment 1168 on bug 1261.
14:55:39 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1261 enh, --, ---, benediktp, ASSI, "Paper Sheets": use media queries for conditional CSS instead of JS
14:56:02 <flo> I'm not sure if I should r- or just fix before committing the changes in such a case.
14:56:24 <clokep> flo: Also note that Mic doesn't have a build env. :-/
14:57:02 <flo> clokep: but used hg export for the patch, which produced a nice file that already includes an author and a commit message
14:57:13 <clokep> Ah, OK. :)
14:57:19 <flo> very nice, but having to edit the changes before committing defeats the benefit of that
14:57:59 <flo> (as I would need to apply it with hg import --no-commit)
14:58:52 <clokep> Right.
14:59:34 <flo> hmm, I guess I would still need to do it to add r= in the commit message :-S
15:10:59 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org denied review for attachment 1167 on bug 1259.
15:11:02 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1259 enh, --, ---, benediktp, ASSI, Replace JS animation code in messagestyle themes by CSS
15:11:13 * flo doesn't seem to be in the mood of editing patches himself ;)
15:11:56 <flo> but I guess it's better to r- almost r+ patches with clear instructions of what needs to be changed rather than letting them collect dust until I have time to test and edit them
15:13:03 <clokep> Any sort of review is good. :)
15:13:18 <flo> aleth: how does JS-IRC relates to the error in bug 1214 comment 2?
15:13:22 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1214 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, this.target is undefined (IRC DMs)
15:14:07 <aleth> Merely that I assume JS-IRC will replace the libpurple IRC DM code soon?
15:14:19 <aleth> Which may or may not fix that bug.
15:14:39 <flo> this sounds like "opening an IM conversation from someone not in your buddy list causes an error"
15:14:50 <flo> it doesn't seem like IRC-specific to me
15:15:00 <aleth> Right.
15:15:45 <aleth> I didn't realize that.
15:16:28 <aleth> I assumed libpurple was not setting some expected attribute
15:16:58 <clokep> I couldn't reproduce that bug with /msg nickserv help
15:18:12 <flo> could be related to an add-on
15:18:15 <aleth> I can't reproduce it that way either.
15:18:31 <flo> NickServ killer seemed like a good candidate to me
15:18:43 <aleth> It could be that some additional step is missing.
15:18:48 <flo> yeah
15:19:06 <aleth> I've seen the error in non-NickServ DMs 
15:21:17 <aleth> What they have in common, as I said in the bug, is that they are initiated by someone else
15:21:32 <clokep> I wonder if it's http://hg.instantbird.org/addons/file/23a6c11f2b6c/nickservkiller/bootstrap.js#l57 ?
15:21:56 <clokep> If a subject doesn't have target for some reason from somewhere?
15:23:04 <flo> the only good reason I remember for not having a target is "the conversation is already closed"
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17:47:47 <go8765> hm... in irc contaks i see 5 different small icons between nicksg(without icon, wit white star, with yellow star, ets...). what they means?
17:48:23 <clokep> go8765: gold start is channel op, silver star is half op.
17:48:27 <clokep> No icon is no status.
17:48:40 <clokep> There's a house for founder, and a sound wave icon thingy for voice.
17:49:16 <go8765> clokep: ok. thanks for answers)
17:49:30 <clokep> You're welcome! :)
17:49:52 <go8765> ...but what mean bright yellow and not so bright yellow&
17:50:01 <go8765> *?
17:50:13 <go8765> *ыефкы ш ьуфт
17:50:27 <go8765> *yellow stars i mean
17:50:45 <clokep> Is the "not so bright yellow" next to someone w/ a greyed out name?
17:52:20 <go8765> hm... its mean away i think...
17:52:50 <clokep> It means they haven't participated yet in the coversation.
17:52:52 <go8765> becouse only your and my nicks now - colored ;)
17:53:13 <clokep> Once people talk their names are colored, yes.
17:53:29 <go8765> okay. thanks)
17:55:18 * go8765 now know how universe made :)
17:57:59 <go8765> is anyway to sshow lag in instandbird?
17:58:21 <clokep> Uhhh...I don't think so right now.
17:58:30 <clokep> You mean lag to the server, right?
18:00:44 <aleth> go8765: or did you mean Show logs?
18:03:32 <go8765> lag of the server )
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20:49:54 <clokep> flo: I got rid of the server tab by default. :P
20:50:03 <flo> :)
20:50:21 <clokep> ~15 lines of code changed.
20:50:49 <clokep> OK, well..I lied.
20:50:53 <clokep> I got rid of MOST of it.
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21:08:07 <clokep> Bah just found an error in one of my regexs to parse messages hah.
21:08:12 * clokep should write tests for that.
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21:16:56 <clokep> OK... /now/ I've gotten rid of the server tab. :P
21:26:25 <clokep> Ah flo, that msn problem you didn't get an email about? Was replied JUST to me.
21:26:36 <clokep> The way we have our mailing lists set up is non-ideal. :-/
21:29:10 <flo> yeah, all configuration options have a problem :(
21:30:33 <aleth> The spam makes them appear a bit defunct... why doesn't Google filter it?
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21:31:35 <aleth> I thought they were good at that kind of thing...
21:31:50 <clokep> Do no evil. ;)
21:37:36 <flo> the spam filter is annoying on the mailing list :(
21:37:51 <flo> messages that are detected as spam there tend to go to /dev/null
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21:38:22 <flo> as I receive a spam report every few days saying that I need to moderate them; but gmail puts that report in the spam folder of my gmail account...
21:47:18 <aleth> People can always come here instead :)
21:47:54 <aleth> After all, they have an IRC client installed ;)
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