#instantbird log on 12 15 2011

All times are UTC.

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03:20:29 <clokep> :) I have whois w/ tooltips working for JS-IRC now!
03:22:30 <Mook> \o/
03:36:03 <clokep> Not quite ready for a new patch yet though. ;)
03:36:32 <clokep> But I didn't figure out how to write a Macro in Komodo! So I can slowly stop using websites to do things...
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11:15:02 <flo> clokep: hello :)
11:15:43 <clokep> Hello flo.
11:19:13 <flo> clokep: what's blocking you in bug 1199?
11:19:22 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1199 enh, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Only notify prplIAccounts of status changes when enabled
11:20:02 <clokep> flo: I'm just confused at where to go next with it. I think I just don't fully understand the interaction of the objects and where notifications, etc. are coming from.
11:22:58 <flo> do you want some explanations (ask specific questions then ;)) or is it something I should take over?
11:24:14 <clokep> http://pastebin.instantbird.com/3145 is what I have right now that doesn't work.
11:24:37 <clokep> I think I'd rather you take it over to get it done in a  reasonable time (I'm away on business next week).
11:25:55 <flo> didn't you have .connect and .disconnect calls in your previous iteration? Where are these gone?
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11:30:00 <clokep> I did, I thought got confused at whether those needed to be part of the _statusobserver.observe method or whether they should be in the connect/disconnect methods of the imAccounts object and apparently never added them back in.
11:30:19 <flo> you may want to check that _statusObserver isn't null before attempting to remove/delete it
11:35:09 <clokep> Alright.
11:36:01 <clokep> And where would the actual calls to connect/disconnect go now?
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11:55:18 <clokep> Got to go. bye!
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12:15:17 <flo> clokep: they would still be in the observer, like in your previous patch
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12:54:57 <flo> I'm always surprised that it takes only a few tweets to move from "testing instantbird for twitter.. #twiter somehow it works.. [random frustration] :(" to "@fqueze I love #instantbird" :)
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13:25:10 <Mic> Hello.
13:26:09 <flo> Mic: good afternoon :)
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14:01:23 * flo removes 20+ IM accounts from his Thunderbird profile
14:11:42 <flo> heh, mozilla-inbound is open :)
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16:58:21 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org requested review from clokep@gmail.com for attachment 1084 on bug 759.
16:58:23 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=759 min, --, ---, florian, ASSI, Reorganize purplexpcom
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17:28:52 <clokep_work> You know when I filled bug 759, I had no idea it was going to be *THE* bug for Instantbird 1.2. :P
17:28:56 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=759 min, --, ---, florian, ASSI, Reorganize purplexpcom
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17:57:33 <flo> clokep_work: heh :)
17:57:53 <flo> clokep_work: do you remember if we have an easy way to reproduce the bug that prevents startup if there's an error in a jsm import?
17:58:21 <flo> there's someone currently working on https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=463122
17:58:40 <flo> so if we have a similar bug, now would be a nice time to raise some attention to it
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18:18:54 <clokep_wp7> flo, import a file that doesn't exist or make asyntax error in tge file i think 
18:19:42 <clokep_wp7> Exactly though? I'd have to try stuff out.
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18:21:25 <flo> would be ideal if we could produce a reduced testcase... soon :)
18:21:39 <flo> I'm trying to find more information about https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=700421
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20:19:04 <bp> hmm, nice :) Customizable keys in Komodo Edit. I like it already ;)
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20:27:47 * aleth wonders if bp's prettified drop target is going to land soon
20:29:31 <flo> have you seen https://twitter.com/#!/stpeter/status/147378381204365312 ?
20:30:44 <BlueMaxima> Aw, for a minute there I thought the real St Peter had a twitter account :P
20:30:49 <flo> stpeter = Peter Saint-Andre
20:31:47 <aleth> Is that the Jabber guy?
20:31:58 <flo> Executive Director of the XMPP Software Foundation
20:32:22 <aleth> Shame DNS-SRV isn't ready, or JS-XMPP might get a right work-out ;)
20:32:41 * flo will ask for feedback
20:37:46 <bp> aleth: good idea
20:38:16 <bp> This time, at least, I attached a WIP to a bug. Seems I'm able to learn from past mistakes :P
20:39:47 <bp> The main css file of the Bubbles theme is full of discouraged ways of creating rules (according to this "writing efficient css" doc on MDN atleast) :(
20:40:38 <aleth> flo: https://twitter.com/#!/stpeter/status/147396398290186240 ;)
20:40:41 <bp> I think I'll fix that when I try to add user icons
20:41:06 <flo> aleth: I saw that too
20:41:33 <flo> although not in Instantbird, as he typoed Instan*d*bird
20:42:27 <aleth> bp: I had the same impression :( Though other message styles are worse
20:42:55 <aleth> There might be reasons for it of course
20:44:50 * flo wonders what you are talking about
20:45:53 <aleth> The efficiency of the message style CSS
20:46:42 <flo> bp: oh, you are planning to add user icons in Bubbles? :)
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20:49:36 <flo> hmm, I wonder if cleaning up the Bubbles css would save us a noticeable amount of time when restoring large conversations on hold
20:49:52 <flo> that would be a cheap win :)
20:50:23 <flo> I would be very surprised though
20:51:07 <BlueMaxima> Meh, take what wins you get
20:52:34 <bp> Concerning themes and accessibility: what about adding the aria-attributes to all the themes we ship (or to Bubbles at leastas it is the default theme)?
20:53:33 <bp> Or create another one, explicitly labelled as "Accessible theme" in the options, so people know which one to use?
20:53:45 <flo> BlueMaxima: I would take the readability win anyway ;).
20:55:29 <flo> bp: I think I commented in that bug that we could either add the accessibility attributes automatically on the message <span> tag in imThemes.jsm so that all themes automatically have it, or decide that blind users are unlikely to change the theme they use, and just add the tags in the default theme
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20:56:14 <bp> Oh, we have a bug about this already?
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20:56:47 <aleth> Currently only Simple has aria tags
20:56:47 <flo> hmm, it's possible that was just comments in the old resolved bug
20:57:51 <flo> bah, I can't find my comment :(
20:57:55 <flo> maybe I said that on IRC instead
20:58:20 <flo> it was definitely reported at https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=103#c3
20:58:24 <instantbot> Bug 103 tri, --, 0.1.3, pvdeejay, RESO FIXED, Use WAI-ARIA live regions while displaying incoming messages
20:58:42 <bp> bug 103
20:58:51 <bp> Ah :)
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20:59:07 <Tomek> flo: is the "restoring large conversations on hold" problem taking place also with other msg styles than bubbles? (I'm using the dark one from defaults, but I don't have conversations large enough to see any significant delay)
20:59:45 <flo> Tomek: it's happening even with Simple
20:59:57 <Tomek> Oh :(
21:00:00 <flo> but the delay is longer with Bubbles
21:00:13 <aleth> That fix (103) actually isn't in the message style
21:00:23 <DGMurdockIII> when will you guy add the abality to block people on instantbird
21:00:29 <flo> aleth: there was no message styles at the time
21:00:45 <aleth> flo: ah, ok:)
21:01:04 <flo> yeah, it's an old bug ;)
21:01:11 <bp> Adding it to all new messages independently from the theme sounds better in my opinion.
21:01:39 <DGMurdockIII> that the only feature I could use now that im getting more and more spam
21:01:39 <bp> If that means that we're accessible no matter what the user does to his message style themes, of course.
21:01:55 <bp> http://hg.instantbird.org/instantbird/file/8d564c726cfb/instantbird/themes/messages/bubbles/main.css#l111
21:01:58 <bp> :(
21:02:00 <flo> what happened to my nospam add-on?
21:03:05 <flo> bp: the worse thing about that rule is probably that *I* wrote it :(
21:03:10 <bp> Maybe it'sstill experimental and nobody is finding it because of that? :P
21:03:44 <flo> or maybe I never wrote the configuration UI because I wasn't interested in that part :-S
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21:04:01 <flo> that add-on would probably help for DGMurdockIII's problem
21:04:19 <flo> stpeter: hello :)
21:04:36 <stpeter> hey guys, I've added Instantbird to http://xmpp.org/xmpp-software/clients/
21:04:41 <stpeter> and I've been testing it out
21:04:52 <stpeter> it passed the "stpeter roster test" with flying colors :)
21:05:00 <stpeter> good work!
21:05:05 <flo> thanks! :)
21:05:37 <flo> is it mostly a performance test?
21:05:53 <stpeter> I have ~2700 people in my roster
21:05:58 <bp> :O
21:06:00 <stpeter> some clients crash on trying to load it
21:06:13 <stpeter> s/roster/buddy list/ for you AIM types :)
21:06:21 <stpeter> crash, hang, etc.
21:06:21 <flo> I think large rosters are frequent on Facebook
21:06:27 <stpeter> probably
21:06:39 * stpeter shudders at the mention of Facebook :)
21:06:47 <bp> flo: is nospam the "do not disturb" add-on?
21:06:50 <flo> we connect to it through XMPP though ;)
21:06:54 <aleth> bp: no
21:06:54 <flo> bp: no
21:07:21 <bp> I can find it neither in your add-on list not in the add-ons repository.
21:07:26 <DGMurdockIII> can find the nospam addon
21:07:38 <DGMurdockIII> can't find the nospam addon
21:07:48 <stpeter> will some of you be at FOSDEM?
21:07:54 <flo> stpeter: have you received my tweet? I mentioned that we have implemented XMPP in JavaScript recently for more extensibility
21:08:11 <flo> stpeter: I'm at FOSDEM every year, I gave an Instantbird talk last year.
21:08:30 <stpeter> sorry, maybe I don't remember :|
21:08:43 <stpeter> flo: probably I did receive your tweet, I've been on the phone a lot today
21:09:22 <flo> stpeter: we met (briefly) two years ago I think. I stayed an additional day to attend the XMPP summit ;).
21:09:37 <stpeter> aha, yes, received
21:09:46 <stpeter> on the phone again, brb
21:10:49 <DGMurdockIII> Error: Corrupted database: duplicated account_buddy entry: account_id = 4, buddy_id = 273, tag_id = 3
21:10:49 <DGMurdockIII> Source File: jar:file:///C:/Program%20Files%20(x86)/Instantbird/omni.jar!/components/imContacts.js
21:10:49 <DGMurdockIII> Line: 1247
21:11:27 <DGMurdockIII> http://pastebin.instantbird.com/3205
21:18:58 <flo> bp: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/3206
21:22:23 <bp> Thanks, but I don't need it for myself. I only wanted to point DGMurdockIII to it (and I think he can't do anything with that;)
21:22:33 <bp> I can't even make it an xpi here :(
21:22:50 <flo> bp: anyway, the important part is "//TODO check if we prevent spam from this protocol/account."
21:23:59 <DGMurdockIII> 2(flo2): cant find the nospam addon
21:25:18 <flo> DGMurdockIII: it's not finished. The work-in-progress code is in my pastebin.
21:26:48 <aleth> I suppose you could push v 0.1 which blocks spam from all accounts ;)
21:27:34 <bp> And version 2.0 is going to let through acceptable spam one day? ;)
21:28:03 <aleth> heh ;)
21:28:05 <DGMurdockIII> flo you shold realese it to for people who want to help you test it
21:28:26 <flo> aleth: I guess I won't work on it until I get more AIM spammers. They've been quiet these days. About one or two messages a month
21:28:37 <flo> at the time I started working on the add-on, it was several a day
21:29:23 <flo> DGMurdockIII: that's what I've just done. I released the code because at this stage people who could help are those who can understand the code.
21:29:40 <aleth> I have never seen IM spam(apart from on twitter), but I am not on AIM either
21:29:53 <flo> I can't remember when was the last time I received an *useful* message from AIM though.
21:30:06 <DGMurdockIII> ok
21:30:10 <flo> if I wasn't working on Instantbird, the obvious solution would be to just not connect to AIM anymore.
21:31:41 <flo> all my AIM contacts who don't live in the US don't connect their AIM accounts any more anyway
21:32:23 <Mook_as> odd, I find that instantbird (and multi-protocol clients in general) make me connect to more networks
21:32:38 <Mook_as> I don't know why I'm still on ICQ. but I connect to it, everyday...
21:33:16 <flo> Mook_as: same for yahoo I guess.
21:33:33 <flo> I connect to it everyday, but I've never had a single yahoo contact :-D.
21:33:43 <Mook_as> haha
21:34:03 <flo> (just another test account of someone else testing Instantbird at some point)
21:34:33 <flo> so I've probably had a total of 2 conversations through yahoo, with only test messages.
21:35:06 * Mook_as is pretty sure he had more spam over the last year on ICQ than all other messages
21:37:01 <flo> all my real conversations happen on Google Talk, Facebook Chat (boo :() or IRC. I could forget all other accounts if I didn't want to be informed quickly if they can't connect any more.
21:37:29 <instantbot> aletheia2@fastmail.fm requested review from florian@instantbird .org for attachment 907 on bug 1074.
21:37:31 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1074 nor, --, ---, aletheia2, ASSI, Default message styles lack context message support and override font choice
21:38:07 <aleth> Seems I forgot to r? over 2 months ago :(
21:39:41 <aleth> flo: It's kind of sad that everyone uses XMPP, but only via fb/google
21:40:25 <EionRobb> at least they use xmpp
21:41:32 <flo> I'm not sure of that. I suspect if they contact me through facebook they are likely using the web UI :(.
21:42:53 <aleth> True for Gtalk too I suppose.
21:44:56 <flo> people talking to me through gtalk often use Instantbird/Adium/Pidgin
22:00:14 <flo> clokep_work: I've tried to reproduce our Cu.import bug that prevented startup by importing non existent js modules, but I couldn't reproduce.
22:01:08 <bp> Another WP-programmer, great ..
22:01:56 <bp> .. I've read on Twitter that there seems to be a Google Chrome-extension that adds Jimmy Wales to every webpage, btw :D
22:02:04 <EionRobb> awesome
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22:07:34 * flo first read WP as WordPress and wondered what you were talking about
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22:08:46 <EionRobb> ditto
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22:15:39 <bp> Good night
22:16:24 <-- bp has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.2a1pre)
22:22:29 <Mook_as> wait, it _isn't_ wordpress?
22:22:48 <flo> WikiPedia
22:22:56 <Mook_as> ah
22:23:18 <flo> or maybe WikiMedia + typo :-S
22:23:57 <aleth> I guess you didn
22:24:03 <aleth> t look it up on wikipedia ;) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP
22:25:17 <flo> ahah
22:27:02 <aleth> https://github.com/liveservices/LiveSDK/tree/master/Samples/XMPP-Samples
22:27:08 <aleth> http://windowsteamblog.com/windows_live/b/windowslive/archive/2011/12/14/anyone-can-build-a-windows-live-messenger-client-with-open-standards-access-via-xmpp.aspx
22:27:11 <aleth> !
22:29:34 <aleth> Is this new or just more official?
22:29:43 <flo> what's new in that announcement compared to what we already knew in september when bug 1033 was filed?
22:29:49 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1033 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Implement Microsoft Live XMPP
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22:30:37 <aleth> flo: I don't know. I only just spotted it by accident
22:31:45 <aleth> "Roster management is not supported." is probably the most pertinent lack
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22:32:09 <aleth> I was surprised Microsoft had code on github...
22:33:19 <Mook_as> meh, I realized today that msdn blog comments (specifically, oldnewthing) needed to pull script from googleapis.com...
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22:35:07 <EionRobb> is roster management supported via any api?
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22:37:12 <flo> maybe through a REST API, but I haven't read the doc of their REST API yet
22:37:50 <Novarg> I think somebody here said I could debug the facebook chat connection over xmpp, is that right?
22:37:57 <Novarg> I wonder if there's something I can do to fix it
22:40:08 <flo> Novarg: are you the reporter of bug 1203?
22:40:11 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1203 maj, --, ---, florian, ASSI, No longer able to log into Facebook Chat via Instantbird since patches enabling JS XMPP
22:41:25 <Novarg> flo: no
22:41:34 <Novarg> I can log in and receive messages, I just can't send
22:42:02 <flo> ah, right
22:42:51 <flo> I posted in that bug the instructions to enable logging to the error console of all the data exchanged through the XMPP connection, so hopefully you will be able to see what we send and what the server replies (if anything)
22:43:18 <Novarg> ok let me try that
22:46:01 <Novarg> so it issues a <message> with my text in it, then it does onTransportStatus(STATUS_SENDING_TO)
22:46:05 <Novarg> does it miss anything?
22:46:28 <flo> pastebin the relevant parts, instead of trying to describe them ;)
22:47:55 <Novarg> http://privatepaste.com/658d00fe84
22:51:39 <Novarg> that's what I send and all I get in reaction
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22:57:22 <Novarg> can it just absorb my message?
22:58:28 <flo> both of these messages are what you send (the first is a typing notification, the second is the actual message)
22:58:57 <Novarg> I thought so, but they never reach their target
22:59:10 <Novarg> but I guess that's not under instantbird's control then :)
22:59:12 <flo> do you receive an error message after that?
22:59:15 <Novarg> no
22:59:15 <flo> or a strange message?
22:59:17 <Novarg> nothing
22:59:28 <flo> probably facebook's brokenness then
22:59:41 <Novarg> I'm wondering how it works for some people
22:59:45 <Novarg> why doesn't it for me :)
23:00:54 <EionRobb> magic
23:01:18 <Novarg> but it supports me on my quest to get people away from the facebook chat
23:01:40 <flo> not really if you can't send them messages to tell them that ;)
23:01:52 <Novarg> I'm chatting through the web ui now
23:02:01 <Novarg> but that's highly uncomfortable
23:28:22 <DGMurdockIII> http://www.theverge.com/2011/12/15/2637835/windows-live-messenger-xmpp-protocol
23:28:49 <DGMurdockIII> http://windowsteamblog.com/windows_live/b/windowslive/archive/2011/12/14/anyone-can-build-a-windows-live-messenger-client-with-open-standards-access-via-xmpp.aspx
23:30:53 <flo> DGMurdockIII: you are obviously ignoring the links that have been posted here 2 hours ago (otherwise you would have noticed that it's the same as what you just pasted), so why do you expect others to pay attention to your links?
23:31:23 <DGMurdockIII> yeah i just saw it after i posted it
23:32:09 <flo> which confirms that you didn't look before...
23:32:25 <DGMurdockIII> my mistake
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