#instantbird log on 09 06 2011

All times are UTC.

00:27:04 <clokep> This means I should go file a "Add tooltip information for Twitter" bug, shouldn't I? :P
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01:13:20 <lewellyn> clokep: i'm still installing stuff from your blog post.
01:13:41 <lewellyn> but you should note that people with vs2k5 pro don't need to disable accessibility nor download masm :)
01:16:20 <clokep> My blog post was more of how I got set up, not about full directions for everyone to get set up.
01:16:27 <clokep> We should probably make a wiki page though.
01:16:43 <clokep> (You also shuldn't have to disable jemalloc if you have pro btw.)
01:16:53 <lewellyn> yeah. it's more the masm thing. i fear it may screw up someone's installed masm :/
01:17:32 <lewellyn> and yeah. you don't mention to disable jemalloc up above anyhow :)
01:17:48 <lewellyn> i'll probably put some pro notes in a comment once i get it built
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01:20:23 <lewellyn> but while i wait for the checkout i suppose i should go do something useful. like pick up dinner :)
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01:22:32 <clokep> So MASM comes with pro then? Interesting.
01:22:51 <clokep> Ah yeah I guess you don't use an option to disable jemalloc, it must just do it automatically.
01:23:47 <clokep> that would help to put them somewhere. :) That way someone can eventually make a wiki page.
01:24:04 <clokep> And yes, downloading takes a longgggggg time. :(
01:35:34 <lewellyn> yeah. masm was one of the things they had to bring out after the fact for express, because people complained that express is really useless without it ;)
01:35:53 <lewellyn> i think they had yanked it from the psdk at the same time, too
01:36:02 <clokep> Ah, I see.
01:37:50 <lewellyn> but yeah. i have ml.exe in C:\Program Files\Microsoft Visual Studio 8\VC\bin
01:38:10 <lewellyn> just thought i would verify since i had asserted that :)
01:38:21 <clokep> Then yeah probably not good to install it again.
01:38:51 <lewellyn> if the installer's smart, it'll forbid it. i don't trust MSIs of that era, though, to be smart :)
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01:39:25 <clokep> Do you trust the ones of this era? ;)
01:40:11 <lewellyn> microsoft's gotten better and forbidding some level of user stupidity :)
01:42:36 <lewellyn> i hope my vm disk doesn't run out of space :D
01:43:43 <clokep> My instantbird dev directory is ~2.5 GB (including the mozilla source &amp; a compiled obj dir)
01:43:48 <clokep> So...hopefully not. :)
01:44:51 <lewellyn> it was mostly a reference to how slow the mozilla hg repo is and how much disk activity it does. :)
01:45:04 <lewellyn> hm. you're using instantbird to irc?
01:45:09 <lewellyn> & came out as &amp; there
01:45:13 <clokep> Hah. Yes, I am.
01:45:30 <clokep> I'm using a JavaScript version I'm rewriting, there's a few encoding issues like that. :-/
01:45:59 <lewellyn> ok. i hadn't noticed that sort of issue before :)
01:46:18 <clokep> Yeah the mozilla hg repo is really really slow, I think I stole it from a thunderbird build I had around originally.
01:46:41 <clokep> Yeah...it shouldn't be coming out as &amp;amp;
01:46:47 <clokep> I'll need to look into that. :(
01:47:17 <lewellyn> &amp;amp; :D
01:48:09 <clokep> It looks correct for mebtw.
01:49:28 <lewellyn> probably because irc doesn't echo back ;)
01:50:27 <clokep> Probably because I'm apparently HTML encoding it before sending. :P
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01:50:37 <clokep> But yes, echoing back would be nice.
01:50:42 <clokep> Idk if any protocols.
01:50:47 <clokep> really do that though.
01:50:53 <lewellyn> yeah. that'd be my first guess as to why you're sending an entity :)
01:51:12 <lewellyn> and echoing doesn't make sense from a bandwidth or a latency perspective
01:51:58 <clokep> Of course.
01:52:14 <clokep> And those don't matter as much now...but whenever it was that IRC was made...they mattered a lot.
01:53:06 <lewellyn> it'd matter for people like me who are almost literally everywhere ;)
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01:53:31 <lewellyn> i massively slashed my channel load a few months ago. down to about 90 irssi windows now.
01:53:36 <clokep> Nah it'd only matter if you talk a lot. :P
01:54:04 <lewellyn> one channel used to have a bot that kept stats like that. my average was 2.5 kilobytes/hour.
01:54:04 <clokep> Yeah I'm in no where near that many.
01:54:10 <clokep> More like 20ish.
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02:06:55 <clokep> Goodnight.
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07:12:11 <lewellyn> hrmpf. no love for me. bedtime i guess.
07:12:24 <lewellyn> http://www.greenviolet.net/paste/3b838047.html is where i'm giving up :/
07:12:44 <lewellyn> i followed clokep's blog instructions, plus added teh directx sdk, since that wasn't listed.
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08:21:14 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1018 filed by benediktp@ymail.com.
08:21:16 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1018 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Context menu openable on signing-off contacts
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08:25:32 <flo> hello :)
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08:32:22 <flo> I wonder if we should change the default IRC "Real Name" from "purple" (http://lxr.instantbird.org/instantbird/source/purple/libpurple/protocols/irc/irc.h#39) to "Instantbird"
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08:43:21 <flo> one of my french sametime testers reports that the plugin works fine for IMs, but he hasn't been able to participate in a MUC.
08:43:47 <flo> apparently the plugin supports MUCs, but to join one, the user needs to use a custom dialog rather than the standard join chat dialog (boo)
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08:44:17 <flo> and when invited, it seems the code goes through http://lxr.instantbird.org/instantbird/source/purple/libpurple/server.c#777 which will call purple_request_accept_cancel... which we don't display.
08:44:36 <flo> would there be any issue with accepting chat invitations automatically?
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08:50:19 <flo> clokep: file twitter bugs as you like. It's even better if the patch is attached ;).
08:52:00 <flo> lewellyn: it's possible you need to close your terminal and reopen it for new environment variables added by the directx sdk install to take effect. And maybe you also need to force configure to run again (make -f client.mk configure).
08:52:29 <lewellyn> i did both. i'll try it again though. i'm not doing much of use right now :)
08:53:57 <lewellyn> it's too bad that 2> doesn't work properly under msys :/
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09:00:26 <lewellyn> flo: btw, i 100% think the realname should be changed from purple.
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09:00:50 <lewellyn> i always feel that projects are lazy for not doing so :/
09:01:17 <lewellyn> (though, really, libpurple should make it even easier to change)
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09:41:38 <Mic> The tooltips seem to work fine.
09:42:18 <flo> :)
09:43:24 <Mic> I've seen a "?" instead of the e with grave accent in your name though.
09:43:30 <aleth> I see no tooltips in IRC :(
09:43:50 <flo> Mic: I've noticed that too. Probably some encoding issue somewhere
09:44:10 * flo hates encoding bugs
09:44:33 <Mic> aleth: are you using the latest nightly build?
09:44:40 <aleth> Mic: yes
09:44:55 <aleth> (20110906041059)
09:44:57 <Mic> You should see them when hovering someones name on the participant list
09:46:07 <aleth> I will download the whole thing just to be sure there wasn't an update error
09:46:46 <lewellyn> hm. is there a way to get instantbird to accept multiple irc servers with the same hostname but differing ports?
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09:47:28 <flo> do you need to use the same nick on both?
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09:49:17 <lewellyn> i suppose not. it's irssiproxy, so irssi will force a nick change
09:49:24 * lewellyn tries using different nicks :D
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09:49:57 <aleth> aha! It works now
09:50:31 <aleth> Incremental update must have been incomplete somehow
09:50:35 <aleth> very nice :)
09:52:11 <flo> :)
09:55:12 * lewellyn grumbles
09:55:25 <lewellyn> instantbird mass-parted channels on me when i renamed that account
09:55:43 <flo> you can't rename an account
09:55:49 <lewellyn> well, i deleted it
09:56:02 <lewellyn> it should have just quit the server, not parted all the channels :/
09:56:28 <flo> ah, it has closed the conversations before disconnecting?
09:56:52 <lewellyn> yeah
09:57:03 <lewellyn> only about 90 channels, since i've lightened my channel load
09:57:35 <lewellyn> kinda negates the use of irssiproxy to reduce channel noise from coming/going when clients do that :(
09:58:03 <flo> file a bug? ;)
09:59:18 <aleth> Can anyone else reproduce this: Tooltips don't show if MUC IRC is the only conversation active. Opening one other conversation brings them back.
09:59:38 <flo> define "active" please ;)
10:00:08 <aleth> active = present = in existence ;)
10:00:59 <aleth> Aha! Turning on "always show the tab bar" in Prefs resolves the problem
10:01:03 <aleth> Strange
10:01:05 <lewellyn> flo: another bug. it didn't wait for them all to part before quitting. ;)
10:01:08 <lewellyn> let's test this
10:01:32 <flo> aleth: arg. That unfortunately makes sense, I reused the tooltip of the tab bar (the one used for conversation tabs) :(
10:01:43 <flo> file a bug please? :)
10:02:01 <lewellyn> hrm. now i can't reproduce it :(
10:02:22 <flo> lewellyn: 90 part messages weren't enough? :-D
10:02:34 <lewellyn> i did it to this network connection ;)
10:02:48 <lewellyn> only channel i'm in on this network is here ;)
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10:05:04 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 1019 filed by aletheia2@fastmail.fm.
10:05:06 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1019 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Participant tooltips do not appear if tab bar not shown
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10:05:58 <lewellyn> ok. is it a bug that it /part's when you close the window? :/
10:06:06 <flo> no
10:06:25 <flo> there's a pref in the advanced config editor to change that behavior though
10:06:26 <aleth> At least this means the incremental update worked after all ;) Unusual accidental coincidence that I only had one convo open...
10:06:45 <flo> aleth: nightly testing is definitely useful ;)
10:07:31 <aleth> flo: and the absence of session restore, I suppose ;)
10:07:46 <lewellyn> flo: how do i access the advanced config editor? :)
10:08:05 <flo> lewellyn: there's a button on the last tab of the "Advanced" preference pane
10:08:09 <Mad_Maks> a few days ago somebody said that it is difficult to see if somebody is idle in irc (grey-out like chatzilla) but in the (nice) new tooltip there is a status message
10:08:21 <flo> errr, first
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10:08:35 <flo> oh well, go to the pref window, then Adanced->General->Config Editor
10:09:14 <lewellyn> flo: yeah. i found it. it's late and i hit enter before thinking :)
10:09:19 <lewellyn> now to figure out what it's called.
10:09:29 <flo> filter on "alwaysClose"
10:09:49 <lewellyn> hrm. what implications does that have as false?
10:10:13 <flo> non destructive implications ;)
10:10:17 <lewellyn> good :D
10:10:36 <lewellyn> now to go rejoin channels again...
10:11:00 <flo> false will be the default once that feature is finished
10:11:05 <flo> but it's already usable
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10:11:20 <flo> aleth: is that "always show the tab bar" preference really useful?
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10:11:43 <lewellyn> flo: i'd like to +1 that falseness :)
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10:12:56 <aleth> flo: I don't know, I had it turned off at any rate. I suppose for users with few conversations, or if you turn off tabbed conversations altogether, it is useful
10:13:21 <aleth> If each conv is a window, you don't want a tab bar there 
10:13:38 <flo> hmm. yeah, we still need to fix your bug for that case, even if we remove the pref
10:14:10 <flo> conv windows without a tab bar don't look as good as they could/should on Mac currently.
10:14:34 <flo> and I'm annoyed that there's no way to start dragging a conversation that has no tab to drop it into another conv window
10:15:13 <aleth> You can have multiple conv windows and tabs at the same time?
10:15:19 <flo> yes
10:15:42 <flo> just drag a conv tab out of the window
10:15:51 <lewellyn> ok. since i haven't played with irc in instantbird much yet, i have noobish questions. :/
10:16:00 <flo> or check the checkbox to have MUCs in a separate window
10:16:04 <aleth> Ah, of course - mozilla under the hood :)
10:16:38 <lewellyn> firstly, how do you tell whether a channel is "active" (e.g. talking/highlights) or just "crap" (e.g. joins/parts/modes/topic)?
10:17:42 <lewellyn> oh. i guess it only turns red if there's actual chatting. ok. good :)
10:17:52 <flo> and blue if someone said your nick
10:18:09 <lewellyn> awesome. a purple irc client which may actually be useable! :D
10:18:25 <lewellyn> next, how do i make smilies not trigger on strings in nicks? :/
10:18:58 <flo> we have a bug on file for that
10:19:53 <lewellyn> ok. and i'm not sure how i feel about /slashed/ text being auto-italicized... it makes paths hard to read. how does one turn that off?
10:20:34 <lewellyn> /opt/csw/lib/\$ISALIST was what just made me notice that, since /\ doesn't work well at all that way :/
10:21:55 <flo> an add-on could probably hack around it. I don't know if that's worth adding a pref to turn it off
10:22:56 <clokep> flo: we decided it wasn't. I think according to the Mozilla toolkit stuff it's using...paths /shouldn't/ be italicized...but obviously it's guessing in every situation.
10:23:22 <clokep> Turning off all formatting would get rid of it.
10:23:34 <flo> ah, right :)
10:23:53 <flo> I'm not even sure I find italic paths hard to read
10:25:28 <lewellyn> i see lots of paths in a day. i'm deciding whether i like non-monospaced fonts or not yet ;)
10:25:31 <lewellyn> but, turning off formatting will turn off incoming formatting from others on "real" im networks, right?
10:25:51 <flo> yes
10:26:22 <lewellyn> that's unfortunate :(
10:26:37 <lewellyn> also, is it a bug that the font list is sorted A-Za-z?
10:26:48 <lewellyn> i was expecting it to be non-case-sensitive
10:27:09 <flo> that code was copied from Firefox
10:27:37 <flo> I don't feel strongly about it either way
10:27:42 <lewellyn> ah yeah. the firefox font stuff kind of sucks for usability. perhaps i should see how hard it is to fix :)
10:27:54 <lewellyn> still waiting on My First Compile though.
10:28:30 <lewellyn> erk. is tab-completing nicks on the todo list? (or is there an alternate way to do it?)
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10:28:48 <aleth> lewellyn: there is an add-on for that
10:29:04 <flo> lewellyn: yes. But until it's done, there's a great restartless add-on for that.
10:29:08 <lewellyn> clokep: since you weren't around at the time, i found an omission in your guide. i'll add that to my comment notes for when i make the comment :)
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10:29:14 <flo> search for "Tab Complete" in the add-on manager
10:29:24 <lewellyn> ok. time to look at add-ons again. i haven't done it in so long, most of my addons are now incompatible :)
10:29:38 <clokep> lewellyn: The DirectX SDK?
10:29:43 <lewellyn> clokep: yup
10:29:53 <clokep> I don't thinK I had to install it.
10:29:56 <flo> lewellyn: you can follow the doc to build Firefox ;)
10:30:18 <lewellyn> clokep: it throws a warning at configure, but it's apparently now fatal.
10:30:42 <flo> can't to --disable-<something> to avoid needing it?
10:30:50 <clokep> --disable-angle should do it.
10:31:08 <lewellyn> i think that may have been in the output yes.
10:31:08 <clokep> (I think.)
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10:31:24 <clokep> It's also possible that that's changed since I wrote that guide. :)
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10:31:35 <clokep> I was compiling 0.3&lt;something&gt; with that originally I think.
10:31:51 <flo> clokep: fix that HTML escaping bug please :)
10:32:14 <clokep> flo: I'll look into it. :P
10:32:30 <lewellyn> hee
10:32:40 <clokep> (Am I getting pre-escaped things already from the input box for some reason?)
10:33:22 <lewellyn> heh. nicks get formatted as well. (probably related to the emotes?)
10:34:00 <flo> clokep: if you didn't add get HTMLEnabled() false, in your code, then probably.
10:34:13 <flo> twitter.js has it: http://lxr.instantbird.org/instantbird/source/purple/purplexpcom/src/twitter.js#176
10:35:28 <clokep> OK, let me restart...
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10:35:43 <clokep> Is this better? &amp;
10:35:50 <flo> no :(
10:36:10 <clokep> I'll have to look into it more then. Time to get to work.
10:36:15 <flo> clokep: by the way, twitter echos back the messages we send :)
10:36:19 <aleth> &
10:37:02 <lewellyn> hm. i hadn't noticed twitter support before... neat.
10:37:11 <lewellyn> (but how do we reply/retweet?)
10:37:18 <clokep> Ah, speaking of Twitter...my bug to only get things from the previously last read Tweet&gt;...? We should really only mark the last tweet as "read" if the conversation isn't hidden. :(
10:37:26 <clokep> lewellyn: You can't.
10:37:32 <lewellyn> fair enough. :)
10:37:32 <clokep> We're working on it.
10:37:48 <flo> lewellyn: I'm working on that (reply/RT)
10:38:19 <lewellyn> it's still usable :D
10:39:09 * clokep doesn't have pretty tooltips until he implements requestBuddyInfo. :'(
10:40:29 <lewellyn> hm. yeah. i can't deal with twitter making noise every few seconds. :/
10:41:44 <clokep> It's probably not a great client for intense Twitter users (like if you get an @-reply every few seconds it'll ping :P).
10:42:14 <lewellyn> yeah. i just can't find a fairly-basic desktop client that doesn't suck. :)
10:42:41 <flo> define "doesn't suck" and it's likely things will go in that direction if you can convince people to agree with your definition ;)
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10:43:56 <lewellyn> well, most clients that don't suck start getting too many features added to them ;)
10:44:31 <flo> "not sucking" may be a feature
10:44:35 <lewellyn> my favorite twitter client is the one i use on my phone, actually. unfortunately, there's no easy way to run it on the average pc, i don't think.
10:45:36 <clokep> Bye.
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10:47:32 <lewellyn> it's kind of too bad you don't get a tooltip with the user's hostmask (only) when you hover over the joining/parting/whatevering nick.
10:48:56 <flo> you mean the hostmask shouldn't be visible in the joining messages until it's hovered?
10:49:19 <lewellyn> that would work, too. but i noticed with clokep's part :)
10:50:08 <lewellyn> it'd be consistent and useful! (just like the timestamp tooltip)
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11:33:36 <Mic> Ah, nice! I didn't know our pastebin had a "download this post"-feature :) 
11:34:15 * Mic adds pastebin to the list of possible previews  ..
11:35:17 <FeuerFliege> hi!
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11:36:25 <Mic> Hello Feuerfliege
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12:08:09 <clokep_work> flo: http://hg.instantbird.org/instantbird/rev/6663790446e3#l4.7 implies another event should be fired to return the information, but http://hg.instantbird.org/instantbird/rev/6663790446e3#l5.15 seems to return an EmptyEnumerator, shouldn't it just throw not implemented?
12:09:30 <flo> I dislike throwing an error each time we attempt to open a tooltip for a plugin that doesn't support it
12:09:41 <flo> but yeah, it shouldn't return anything, just an empty function
12:10:26 <flo> if we want to throw NOT_IMPLEMENTED, we can just remove that line, as it will find another implementation in the prototype, which will forward to the purpleIAccountBase.
12:12:42 <flo> clokep_work: what do you think of accepting chat invites automatically?
12:14:05 <clokep_work> flo: Was this in response to Sametime?
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12:14:28 <clokep_work> Don't we need someway to be "invited" to a chat anyway (IRC also has the capability I believe).
12:14:33 <flo> yeah, for sametime, but also for bug 628
12:14:37 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=628 nor, --, ---, mook.moz+bugs.instantbird, ASSI, Unable to accept IRC invite
12:14:55 <clokep_work> I don't like that, it's a privacy thing. :-/
12:15:15 <clokep_work> (Maybe not for Sametime, which is most likely a corporate environment, etc. But definitely for IRC.)
12:15:30 <clokep_work> Bah, Mibbit ate my comment "a privacy thing / a spam thing"
12:15:52 <flo> yeah, there's a spam potential
12:16:14 <flo> and what about accepting automatically, but with an about:config pref to disable it?
12:16:38 <clokep_work> I'd like to open the conversation, use the notification bar at the top that says "You've been invited to blah blah [Accept] [Cancel]"
12:17:07 <clokep_work> Accept would actually open the conversation (i.e. for IRC it would JOIN and do all the results from that), Cancel would close the conversation.
12:17:11 <flo> would that model work too for buddy requests?
12:19:39 <clokep_work> Hmmm...maybe...does it make sense to open a conversation for buddy requests?
12:19:50 <clokep_work> (I'm not very familiar with buddy requests...I've never really used a protocol that has them.)
12:21:30 <flo> at least XMPP and MSN use them
12:22:03 <flo> ICQ too I think, but maybe only with some privacy settings
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12:24:31 <clokep_work> I think that makes more sense on the contact list (but not as pop up, as a notification of some sort).
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12:28:21 <clokep_work> But perhaps it would work as a conversation (especially if you get a message from them).
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12:30:24 <clokep_work> ("from them" meaning "as part of the authorization request")
12:30:51 <lewellyn> icq sends a message with the auth request, as does qq.
12:31:20 <lewellyn> i think gadu gadu does, as well. but i haven't used that in years
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12:42:42 <clokep_work> Well if that's the case it would probably be a convenient way to combine them all into one code path? :)
12:44:49 * lewellyn was just filling in blanks, not opining :)
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12:56:44 <lewellyn> oh hey. real    119m3.506s
12:56:50 <lewellyn> i had forgotten about it :)
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14:10:49 * flo is trying the AIM included in Netscape 7.2
14:13:35 <flo> no licence headers in the files :-/
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14:15:28 <flo> inconsistent indentation, inconsistent coding style, dead code in the middle of the files... wow
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14:21:24 <flo> putting an away message hides the buddy list
14:21:37 <flo> typing in an existing IM window removes the away message immediately
14:21:43 <flo> that's... interesting :)
14:24:50 <lewellyn> netscape 7.2? erg.
14:26:59 <clokep_meeting> flo: I don't think that code is "free" in any sense. :(
14:27:37 <flo> I was wondering if there could be an oscar implementation in there that could be reverse engineerable ;)
14:27:38 <clokep_meeting> Typing immediate makes you not away? Interesting.
14:27:54 <clokep_meeting> I remember that /sending/ one always did that in the standalone AIM client.
14:28:09 <clokep_meeting> I'm sure it could be reverse engineered...how old it would be and how legal it would be are debatable probably. ;)
14:28:20 <flo> oh, the "hidden window" is visible :-D
14:28:32 <clokep_meeting> AOL iused to provide documentation about the protocol I believe.
14:28:43 <flo> clokep_meeting: well, if aim.jar is only the UI, there's no point in reverse engineering it
14:29:01 <clokep_meeting> Ah, that's true.
14:29:06 * clokep_meeting is now known as clokep_work
14:29:42 <flo> you are right, it's sending, not typing.
14:30:22 <flo> it's nice that there are DOM inspector and Venkman by default and that they actually work ;)
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14:32:28 <lewellyn> clokep_work: perhaps you're remembering the OpenAIM thing?
14:33:48 <clokep_work> Yeah, although Idk if it was always called that.
14:35:24 <clokep_work> The AIM protocol is fairly well understood I believe flo, it wouldn't be ridiculous to recreate I don't think.
14:35:53 <clokep_work> http://imfreedom.org/wiki/AIM has some documentation.
14:38:09 * clokep_work is scared by the changes going on in libpurple 3.0.0 with their lack of a testing infrastructure.
14:38:28 <flo> some screenshots: http://queze.net/goinfre/netscape-aim/
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14:39:04 <flo> clokep_work: are you afraid it may stop crashing? ;)
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14:39:59 <clokep_work> flo: I'm afraid it may not stop crashing. :P
14:39:59 <Mic> What about another section with buddy requests on the contact list? It seems strange to me to use a bar on the conversation window for this.
14:40:13 <flo> clokep_work: it needs to compile to crash ;)
14:41:04 <clokep_work> So much bling on those windows...
14:41:21 <clokep_work> Bah that address book /is/ the Thunderbird address book...
14:41:25 <clokep_work> (Still)
14:42:02 <flo> clokep_work: notice the "IM" icon in the toolbar :)
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14:42:59 <clokep_work> flo: Yes. Is that still there somewhere? :P
14:43:12 <flo> like with a display: none on it? :-D
14:44:40 <clokep_work> Is it seriously? :(
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14:45:44 <clokep_work> So is aim.jar just GUI stuff then?
14:45:59 <flo> the screenname colomn is still there in Thunderbird
14:47:45 <clokep_work> Yes, you can enter screennames into the address book.
14:48:35 <lewellyn> clokep_work: of course the addressbook is the thunderbird address book. there hasn't been THAT much innovation since carving up the suite ;)
14:49:04 <clokep_work> flo: mconley in #maildev would probably appreciate the address book in that picture. :P
14:49:11 <lewellyn> instantbird is probably the most interesting thing to happen to mozilla since that time
14:49:34 <flo> clokep_work: what do you think he would do with that?
14:50:40 <clokep_work> laugh. :)
14:51:29 <clokep_work> He had some interesting ideas for the addressbook: http://mikeconley.ca/blog/2011/08/25/fidding-with-designs-for-a-future-thunderbird-address-book/
14:53:08 <flo> he already has http://mikeconley.ca/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/netscape-address-directory.png in his collection ;)
14:55:13 <clokep_work> Ah, you're right. :(
14:55:19 <clokep_work> It looks a lot nicer on Mac. :P
14:55:53 <flo> he probably took a way older netscape
14:56:18 <flo> I used the latest that had AIM integration for my screenshots, as it's the AIM integration that I was interested in
14:57:04 <lewellyn> yeah. the one good thing about aol+netscape is the ui overhaul they did
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14:57:23 <lewellyn> he looks to be using 4.x in that screenshot
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15:06:14 <clokep_work> Hey so we really need to do a blog post. I had prepared one about us responding to Feedback from 1.0 here: http://typewith.me/NYVRsNnWwZ it probably needs to be updated a bit (i.e. we've added Sametime support) and oculd use a few more eyes looking over it if anyone is interested.
15:07:18 <lewellyn> hrm. ok. i just started poking at the built bits...
15:07:23 <lewellyn> how do i use them now? :)
15:11:23 <clokep_work> Uhh...the built exectuable is under <obj dir>/mozilla/dist/bin I believe
15:11:29 <clokep_work> And you can run Instantbird from there.
15:11:42 <clokep_work> (The -P flag might be useful, it lets yyou speify a different profile)
15:15:18 <lewellyn> ok. it built
15:15:33 * lewellyn is pleased by this. (it ran too)
15:15:47 <lewellyn> so i'll spend some time poking at libqq later :)
15:18:42 <clokep_work> Awesome! :)
15:18:46 <clokep_work> Congrats. ;)
15:21:10 <lewellyn> my problem, btw, is that i tried running from objdir-ib-release\instantbird\app :/
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15:23:42 <clokep_work> Ah, yeah it's the build structure from mozilla so...
15:24:51 <lewellyn> yeah. i noticed at the end of the build that there was some installer made in that tree, so i assumed that it'd be a sane binary ;)
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15:36:58 <clokep_work> Yup! Btw I don't think we have a bug about upgrading to libqq, so just file one at some point. :)
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15:42:38 <lewellyn> at some point. perhaps with a patch ;)
15:43:02 <lewellyn> i'm going to have to dig through their autoconf cruft and see what they're doing
15:46:32 <clokep_work> Why?
15:47:14 <clokep_work> We already have a makefile in place, no new files were added (when I checked at least...) you might need to add a couple of defines I suppose.
15:49:01 <clokep_work> (My point being, just don't waste too much time on their make garbage. :-D)
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15:53:31 <lewellyn> well, i have to wait for the build to fail. but i expect that they're autoconfing something stupidly.
15:55:10 <flo> by the way, we apply patch against the QQ plugin of libpurple for MSVC compatibility, so you may want to try to get them and apply them, rather than figuring out each of the compatibility issues again
15:55:50 <lewellyn> flo: thanks :)
15:56:09 <clokep_work> Yeah, upstreaming as much of that as we can is good! :)
15:56:42 <clokep_work> lewellyn: The build should fail essentially "immediately" (< 1 minute on my machine) if you build just the purple directory.
15:56:46 <lewellyn> it seems more likely to be accepted by these guys than the pidgin folk
15:57:02 <lewellyn> clokep, i'm just running a regular build
15:57:06 <lewellyn> i'm in no rush :)
15:57:13 <lewellyn> it's 9am. i need coffee.
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15:58:21 <clokep_work> "running a regular build"? I'm just offering a way to save time (and it doesn't do anything different! Just builds a subdirectory).
15:58:32 <flo> lewellyn: here is what we applied against the qq plugin of libpurple 2.7.9: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/936
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15:58:53 <lewellyn> k. thanks. i'll check it out in a bit. :)
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16:00:37 <clokep_work> (And just to throw it out there...I don't think we support WINCE anymore, so that's not necessary...)
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16:05:47 <lewellyn> didn't instantbird start after mozilla killed ce support?
16:06:02 <lewellyn> (which kind of sucks since i'd love to use instantbird on my netbook)
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16:07:17 <flo> lewellyn: no. the wince support was for Firefox 3.6/Mozilla1.9.2. (not to be confused with the old minimo project that was already long dead)
16:07:29 <flo> your WINCE ifdef can be removed of course :)
16:07:56 <lewellyn> oh? they brought back support after killing it last year?
16:08:22 <flo> lewellyn: instantbird started in 2007.
16:08:57 <lewellyn> oh. i didn't hear about it till whenever i first installed it. no more than a year ago, surely.
16:09:46 <lewellyn> hrm. is searching addons broken from the addons manager, or is it just me?
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16:13:41 <Mic> lewellyn: the search seems to be quite picky with respect to search terms (and sandboxed add-ons/such stuff)
16:13:46 <lewellyn> yup. i gotta automake at the least, it seems
16:14:04 <flo> automake is *never* needed for Instantbird
16:14:05 <Mic> You can find an add-on if you exactly know which one you're looking for;)
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16:14:29 <lewellyn> Mic: hm. i was searching for Trollicons 1.0
16:14:36 <lewellyn> i have to see this on irc ;)
16:15:40 <Mic> uuh :S I really don't like the look of these ..
16:16:20 <lewellyn> i don't see them anywhere once i drag the xpi to my addons manager :/
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16:17:22 <lewellyn> trying to install it via the gear doesn't work either, naturally.
16:17:43 <flo> any error in the Error Console?
16:18:35 <Mic> The website says they're compatible with 1.0.* only ..
16:18:49 <lewellyn> flo: nothing obviously related.
16:19:04 <lewellyn> Mic: i was expecting some sort of notification or something if they're really not compatible :/
16:19:14 <Mic> .. there should be one, yes.
16:20:20 <lewellyn> aha. just had to modify the install.rdf. let's restart and see what happens.
16:23:52 <lewellyn> wow these icons are huge. :/
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16:32:49 <aleth> Mic: did you get my message yesterday re your add-on?
16:37:45 <Mic> That was the one to open the join chat dialog not working on the nightlies?
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16:39:01 <lewellyn> hm. does anyone know of a version of Input History which works with nightlies?
16:39:06 <aleth> It *does* work on the nightlies, flawlessly
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16:39:23 <lewellyn> it isn't, here, after updating install.rdf to make it install.
16:39:43 <aleth> But you should change the install.rdf, because currently it's not findable via search in IB, and the website lists "compatible with 1.0" regardless
16:39:55 <Mic> well, if it works with 1.0 it should work with the nightlies as well
16:40:27 <aleth> The problem is the users currently have to hack install.rdf when you could do it for us :D
16:40:28 <lewellyn> oh interesting. apparently it requires a restart to work. :/
16:40:31 <Mook_as> lewellyn: hmm, I didn't read the full logs, but did you eventually find http://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/firefox/bundles/?
16:41:17 <aleth> lewellyn: btw I was referring to "Join Chat" add-on not "Input History"
16:41:34 <lewellyn> Mook_as: no, i didn't need them. i just did other things. (read: wasted time playing with irssiproxy so now i have irc in instantbird which doesn't generate lots of noise in many channels)
16:41:45 <lewellyn> aleth: oh :)
16:41:47 <Mook_as> ahh, :D
16:43:05 <Mic> lewellyn: I guess the "hidden conversations" feature breaks some restartless add-ons that attach stuff to the window
16:44:49 <Mic> I haven't checked it though, it's really only a guess (I earlier had a problem with detaching tabs into a new window as well, this also broke input history, scroll keys, ..)
16:44:54 <lewellyn> hm. no /ignore support yet? :(
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16:46:11 <Mic> (it's not exactly "attaching stuff to the window" but the description should be good enough here)
16:46:17 <Mic> bbl
16:49:46 <Mic> aleth: it should appear in the "get add-ons" search of the add-on manager now.
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16:52:11 <flo> I've added some HTML markup to http://typewith.me/NYVRsNnWwZ
16:52:17 <flo> + a paragraph at the end
16:52:23 <flo> is this ready to go today?
16:56:09 <Mook_as> style nit, first time reading it (and please feel free to ignore, it's not important): too! many! exclaimation! marks! makes! me! think! you! are! william! shatner!
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16:57:29 <flo> Mook_as: did I put more than one?
16:57:48 <Mook_as> not in the same sentence, there's just a lot of them over the whole document
17:00:00 <lewellyn> When asked why people want this we often get a response as "that's what &lt;another IM client&gt; does" or that they use accounts for separate identities: but it is our wish that you take more of a 'contact level view' of people!
17:00:06 <lewellyn> that sentence doesn't parse well :(
17:01:08 <lewellyn> and i think the "high" probably should be omitted from the parenthetical following.
17:01:27 <Mic> The beginning of paragraphs are printed in bold font for me, sometimes ending with the strong-tag, sometimes earlier and sometimes later .. is that actually OK? 
17:02:01 <flo> ignore the bold
17:02:06 <flo> strong tags are what matter
17:02:32 <clokep_work> Mook_as: I tried to amke it sound exciting, but it was written piecemeal, feel free to tak esome out.
17:02:53 <clokep_work> lewellyn: Our IRC support is currently from libpurple, so we only support what they support. ;)
17:03:07 <lewellyn> clokep_work: ?
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17:03:30 <lewellyn> also, shouldn't the sentences following the lead-in colon begin with a capital letter?
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17:04:02 <clokep_work> flo: It's mostly ready. Maybe some of the bug links should be place in paragraph instead of links that say "bug xxx", besides that I didn't have changes to make.
17:04:30 <lewellyn> (i admit that's a style nit)
17:04:41 <Mic> I read through it and it looks good for me too 
17:06:15 <clokep_work> lewellyn: What was the ? about?
17:06:42 <lewellyn> lewellyn: Our IRC support is currently from libpurple, so we only support what they support. ;)
17:07:06 <clokep_work> Which part of that is confusing.
17:07:25 <clokep_work> libpurple == Pidgin.
17:08:13 <flo> for what is worth, I don't think blaming libpurple for the things we don't do is a good excuse ;)
17:08:24 <lewellyn> clokep_work: i don't know what that's in reference to.
17:08:34 <lewellyn> irc isn't threaded and i've been up way too many hours :)
17:09:43 <clokep_work> lewellyn: You asked about /ignore support. I don't know if it supports it off the top of my head, but I'm saying if libpurple/pidgin doesn't, then we don't either.
17:09:47 <lewellyn> and i still feel iffy towards the "high" in front of school.
17:09:58 <lewellyn> clokep_work: oh. i don't know if they do either. :)
17:10:18 <clokep_work> And yes, flo, we could add it...my point just being that we haven't made major changes to protocols that I know of? (Except maybe netsoul?)
17:10:19 <lewellyn> but the bad thing is that it sent the /ignore to the channel instead of, well, ignoring it. :)
17:10:59 <clokep_work> I made it just "school"
17:11:08 <flo> lewellyn: ahah :)
17:11:17 <flo> "hey you, I want to ignore you. Oops"
17:11:25 <lewellyn> clokep_work: that's better wording, yes. :)
17:11:26 <clokep_work> It should probably say "/ignore isn't a command, if you really meant to send that, type //ignore"
17:11:42 <clokep_work> lewellyn: File a bug and I might fix it. ;)
17:11:52 <lewellyn> clokep_work: yes. or just send all unrecognized slash-commands as raw to the server ;)
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17:12:19 <clokep_work> I don't know if libpurple supports that.
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17:13:40 <clokep_work> (And I don't remember IGNORE being a command in IRC...)
17:14:34 <lewellyn> it's not. but at least you let the server handle error messages then :)
17:14:35 <flo> clokep_work: were there still blog posts that you wrote that are posted as written by me?
17:14:49 <clokep_work> flo: Yes, a bunch are.
17:14:49 <flo> I'm currently connected to the mysql database on my terminal, so it's a good time to fix them
17:14:59 <clokep_work> I can find them...
17:15:32 <lewellyn> "ignore Unknown command" is what i get when i use /quote ignore from another client
17:15:44 <lewellyn> seems like a very easy way to punt :)
17:16:15 <clokep_work> flo: At least http://blog.instantbird.org/a41-status-update-april-2011-may-2011.html , http://blog.instantbird.org/a39-status-update-february-2011-march-2011.html
17:16:27 <clokep_work> lewellyn: I agree, it needs to be handled better, please file a bug so we don't forget though! :-D
17:16:57 <clokep_work> And I think I wrote http://blog.instantbird.org/a35-status-update-november-2010-january-2011.html
17:17:05 <clokep_work> And then the ICQ one is correct.
17:17:48 <clokep_work> Yup, that's it.
17:17:54 <flo> fixed
17:17:54 <flo> thanks :)
17:18:21 <clokep_work> Thanks! :) You shuld add UI for that. ;)
17:18:28 <flo> so I really wrote the last 9 posts?
17:18:59 <flo> clokep_work: wanna have a login/password and post yourself?
17:19:26 <clokep_work> flo: Actually I wrote http://blog.instantbird.org/a48-instantbird-1-0-released-in-11-locales.html kind of...I wrote the release notes that those are mostly a copy and paste of.
17:19:43 <flo> done
17:19:43 <lewellyn> clokep_work: gimme a bit :)
17:19:48 <clokep_work> flo: Yes, I could post things more easily then. :)
17:20:07 <flo> can you /msg me the MD5 of a password?
17:20:41 <clokep_work> Eek two months between posts!
17:20:44 <clokep_work> Yes.
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17:57:48 <instantbot> Just appeared in Blog@instantbird.org - http://blog.instantbird.org/ :
17:57:49 <instantbot> http://blog.instantbird.org/n51-feedback-received.html - Feedback received
18:01:22 <lewellyn> clokep_away: which component should i use for irc and qq bugs? :)
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18:02:35 <lewellyn> and i'm still unsure how i feel about this sentence :/
18:02:36 <lewellyn>  Well, ok but we wish that you take more of a 'contact level view' of people:
18:03:49 <lewellyn> something like the change i edited (i'm not sure if they're showing up to you)
18:03:58 <clokep_away> lewellyn: purplexpcom in general is for "protocol stuff".
18:04:42 <lewellyn> that's what i thought. i noticed that twitter and netsoul had their own subcats, so i was wondering if i missed something.
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18:08:28 <clokep_away> Nope.
18:08:53 <clokep_away> They have their own because we maintain them to a larger to degree (Twitter is all our own code and flo added a bit to netsoul).
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18:12:56 <lewellyn> figured
18:13:01 <instantbot> New purplexpcom - General bug 1020 filed by matt@greenviolet.net.
18:13:04 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1020 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, IRC sends unrecognized commands to active conversation
18:13:15 <lewellyn> there's 1!
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18:14:01 <lewellyn> clokep_away: what's the status of bug #576?
18:14:04 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=576 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Replace QQ with JavaScript protocol
18:14:20 <lewellyn> you didn't start work on it, right?
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18:19:29 <instantbot> New purplexpcom - General bug 1021 filed by matt@greenviolet.net.
18:19:31 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1021 maj, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Replace unsupported libpurple QQ with libqq-pidgin
18:22:00 <lewellyn> i added #576 to #1021's See Also list since there's no "Conflicts" in bugzilla, after all these years :/
18:29:25 <clokep_away> lewellyn: bug 576 you could pretty much have hijacked.
18:29:28 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=576 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Replace QQ with JavaScript protocol
18:29:38 <clokep_away> No we didn't start working on it...was more of a "QQ protocol sucks and needs to be replaced.)
18:29:51 <lewellyn> i wanted to leave it in case someone enterprising eventually wants to adopt it :)
18:30:54 <clokep_away> It won't be me, I don't know Chinese. ;)
18:32:38 <lewellyn> you don't need to. you just need to speak binary, apparently :D
18:32:53 <lewellyn> http://code.google.com/p/libqq-pidgin/wiki/QQ2010Protocol
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18:35:34 <clokep_away> Yes, but it helps to know what error messages and such mean. :P
18:35:44 <clokep_away> Or to be able to use the official client. ;)
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19:12:48 <flo> clokep_away: is this the only change I need to make for my changes from yesterday to look good to you http://pastebin.instantbird.com/937 ?
19:16:02 <clokep_away> I mean either way works fine. Some of the jsprotohelper stuff could probably just refer to the handles of this.base functions instead of returning the result of calling the function.
19:16:12 <clokep_away> But, yes that was the only thing I noticed.
19:19:00 <flo> "just refer to the handles of this.base functions instead of returning the result of calling the function" I didn't understand that part :-S
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19:20:18 <clokep_away> Yeah, it was confusing. So in http://hg.instantbird.org/instantbird/diff/6663790446e3/purple/purplexpcom/src/jsProtoHelper.jsm couldn't you actually just do: |requestBuddyInfo: this._base.requestBuddyInfo|
19:20:19 <flo> bug 1019 is easier to fix than I thought :)
19:20:24 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1019 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Participant tooltips do not appear if tab bar not shown
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19:24:23 <flo> clokep_away: is this about https://hg.instantbird.org/instantbird/rev/6663790446e3#l5.7 or https://hg.instantbird.org/instantbird/rev/6663790446e3#l5.15 ?
19:26:02 <clokep_away> flo: The former, but really the whole file is structured that way.
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19:26:12 <clokep_away> s/the whole file/ the whole forward protocol part/
19:26:42 <flo> the current code calls this._base.requestBuddyInfo with this = this._base
19:26:55 <flo> the code you wrote would use "this" as the this value.
19:30:27 <clokep_away> Ah OK.
19:30:30 <clokep_away> Never mind then. :)
19:31:41 <flo> Mook_as: I'm working on actionable messages. Do you happen to remember why you used the nsIDOMEventListener interface for actions?
19:32:44 <flo> Mook_as: was there an intent to use the |event| parameter?
19:33:04 <flo> (if no, why not nsIRunnable?)
19:33:43 <Mook_as> I think I wanted 1) something that is [function] and 2) can carry data?
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19:35:42 <flo> can carry data?
19:36:21 <Mook_as> gets passed something in that I can use as function arguments, IIRC
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19:37:53 <flo> did you intend to pass the message object?
19:38:44 <Mook_as> hmm. I can't remember; it was either that, or some sort of data about the event (mouse, modifier keys, etc.)
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19:40:18 <Mook_as> bbl, food
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22:15:27 <flo> retweet works! :)
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22:34:02 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org added attachment 806 to bug 682.
22:34:04 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=682 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Reply to and retweet actions on twitter
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22:40:38 <flo> Good night! :)
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22:48:06 <instantbot> Check-in: http://hg.instantbird.org/instantbird/rev/a370c37490f7 - Florian Quèze - Bug 1019 - Participant tooltips do not appear if tab bar not shown.
22:48:07 <instantbot> Check-in: http://hg.instantbird.org/instantbird/rev/b500a91e30e7 - Florian Quèze - Bug 721 - Follow-up to address clokep's review comment.
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