#instantbird log on 08 25 2011

All times are UTC.

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01:10:49 <zeldo> Bonjour :)
01:11:00 <zeldo> Il y a 'il quelqu'un pour m'aider concernant InstantBird svp? :)
01:17:48 <zeldo> personne? :)
01:20:30 <zeldo> :(
01:20:35 <EionRobb> do you speak english?
01:20:40 <zeldo> yes :)
01:20:47 <zeldo> not very well but yes. :)
01:20:59 <EionRobb> ok.  you might have better luck asking for help in english :)
01:21:16 <zeldo> can you help me about insantbird?
01:21:17 <zeldo> instantbird?
01:21:27 <EionRobb> what do you need help with?
01:21:48 <zeldo> i have just 2 questions:
01:21:59 <zeldo> 1) Is there javascript/java in the code of instantbird?
01:22:36 <zeldo> 2) Is there a security plugin/add-on (like OTR or Pidgin Encryption for Pidgin) for InstantBird? (or maybe something in pgp?)
01:36:27 <zeldo> still here?
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02:40:19 <clokep> zeldo: A lot of the UI and some of the backend is in JavaScript. You can see the code at hg.instantbird.org
02:40:29 <clokep> And no, we do not currently have OTR. There's a bug about I believe.
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05:35:20 <Mook> hmm. with my _really_ flaky connection, it's hard to tell if I'm still connected right now... nothing in the conversation view says I'm (or I'm not) connected.
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08:16:37 <Mic> Hi
08:31:59 <Mic> No windows nightly build today :(
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09:17:51 <Mic> Hi flo.
09:17:59 <flo> hello :)
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10:21:13 * flo unchecks "Group MUCs in a separate window"
10:21:34 <flo> with that hidden conversations toy, I'll probably rarely have more than 5 tabs anyway :)
10:27:13 <clokep> :)
10:27:22 <clokep> Does it make sense to be able to auto-join into a hidden conversation?
10:27:54 <flo> does it make sense to show auto-joined conversations by default? ;)
10:28:26 <clokep> I'm not sure what you mean..
10:29:10 <flo> if it was only me, we would remove the annoying and confusing "auto-join" feature, and channels that he user has never parted would be auto-joined and put into the hidden conversations automatically
10:29:22 <flo> *the
10:31:26 <clokep> So you would just persist the conversations over restarts essentially.
10:31:51 <flo> yes
10:31:57 <clokep> Interesting.
10:32:37 <flo> with the current system, I hate that the user either has to decide whether to auto-join before joining, or to type the channel name in a confusing comma separated field
10:33:33 <clokep> Yes. :-/ I don't like it either.
10:33:36 <flo> + if we want to auto join MUCs with more fields, we can't keep the comma-separated list and need to store in a JSON format the list of auto-joined rooms
10:34:20 <clokep> What about having a way to "pin" chats? (hidden conversations would have another icon to pin them there and open conversations would have an icon in the header).
10:34:38 <clokep> (Maybe pin isn't the right word, but I think you get what I'm going for.)
10:36:28 <flo> I get that you are talking about a togglable feature for each MUC, but I don't understand which feature exactly
10:37:57 <clokep> Yeah.
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10:43:21 <clokep> But that way the user doesn't type any information in, they join a room...and if they're still interested they tick the "Always join this room" option somewhere.
10:44:55 <flo> isn't what I suggested even easier? They join a room, and they leave it if they don't want to be there any more. Otherwise they stay there.
10:45:15 <Mic> How do they leave it?
10:45:35 <Mic> Since just clicking [x] to close the tab doesn't work anymore?
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10:45:38 <flo> Mic: they read the bugs you filed ;)
10:46:09 <clokep> flo: No, it's not.
10:46:24 <clokep> I often will join the rooms that I always want to be in and might want to only be in a room for a session.
10:46:49 <clokep> But I don't want to have to rejoin those rooms manually to get them to auto-join again.
10:46:52 <flo> "want to only be in a room for a session" why? :)
10:47:13 <flo> the rooms where I wanted to be "only for one session"... it was because it wasn't worth keeping a tab open
10:47:57 <clokep> There's some rooms I go in occasionally to get help or to see what's up that I don't /always/ want to be in.
10:48:03 <clokep> Though maybe if they're hidden it doesn't matter.
10:48:26 <flo> would you like being able to search an indexed log of it? ;)
10:50:36 <flo> I'm very sad of http://crash-stats.instantbird.com/report/index/ee9ae376-289b-4e5c-a875-28ed32110825 :(
10:50:55 <flo> that was our top crash on 1.0.
10:51:02 <Mic> flo: I know that I filed some bugs for this but I think it's a different thing if you forget leaving a room until the end of the session or if it will reappear next time again
10:51:03 <flo> I thought updating to Moz5 fixed it
10:51:14 <flo> but I've just crashed with it again on my current nightly :'(
10:52:12 <flo> Mic: what's the usefulness of leaving a room?
10:52:28 <flo> if you leave because you hate people in there, you are unlikely to forget to do so.
10:52:48 <flo> if you leave just because you aren't so interested any more... oh well, joining it once more or not doesn't change anything
10:53:17 <flo> when I join a room for the first time, I rarely decide whether I want to keep coming here during the first session. Especially for low traffic rooms.
10:53:22 <Mic> "once emore or not" is everytime from now until you click a leave-room button
10:54:17 <flo> it's once more every time you don't click that button and restart.
10:56:41 <Mic> What about this: there's a "restore session" toggle that allows to exactly do that, no more auto-joined rooms beside the session restore feature?
10:57:24 <flo> my idea is to keep the state of the application across restarts, yes.
10:58:17 <clokep> I'm mostly convinced....but we definitely need a real "leave" room UI (instead of just hiding it). :)
10:58:26 <flo> sure
10:59:03 <flo> and the "Hidden Conversations" feature needs to become somehow discoverable
11:00:34 <clokep> Don't people find that by just closing a room once and going "WTF why is it now in my buddy list?"
11:01:05 * clokep thinks we need a "What's new?" window. :P
11:01:11 <clokep> Bye!
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11:01:15 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 988 filed by benediktp@ymail.com.
11:01:17 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=988 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, A long list of hidden conversations can make the contacts section unusable
11:02:05 <flo> I wonder how come my Contacts window is no longer resizable :-S
11:03:03 <Mic> The makers of your window manager decided that resizable windows are confusing their users and removed support for that? ;)
11:11:21 <flo> Mic: except I can still resize conversation windows ;)
11:11:48 <flo> I suspect something is broken in the CSS of the Hidden Conversations part
11:11:57 <flo> and breaks something somewhere else
11:12:36 <Mic> It works with yesterdays nightly build on WindowsVista, by the way.
11:13:39 <Mic> (There's no newer nightly for Windows)
11:33:27 <flo> ok, I've retrigerred the win nightly
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11:45:44 <clokep_work> Well you see Mic, no one should have that many open conversations and that many friends, so we're really helping you keep a reasonable online social life...
11:51:29 <clokep_work> Ah this bug sounds like it could fix my issue: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=673197 ;)
11:55:14 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 989 filed by benediktp@ymail.com.
11:55:15 <instantbot> benediktp@ymail.com added attachment 787 to bug 989.
11:55:16 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=989 min, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Bubbles Theme: collapsed status messages can be misleading
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11:59:53 <Mic> The inline bug history on  BMO is nice :)
12:00:16 <clokep_work> Yes, I wonder if the extension works with the version of Bugzilla we're using.
12:10:45 <aleth> Hi! An idea: how about, instead of a separate log viewer, just allowing a message window to "scroll up" into the logs? You'd then only need to add search functionality and "jump to date" (which are not even two separate things).
12:12:03 <Mic> What's what flo eventually wants .. I think there should be something on the recent logs about this?
12:12:10 <aleth> You'd then add a red line or something to denotate the beginning of the current session, or to be more precise: last point the message window was read by the user. The latter is better because it also applies within a running session when switching between tabs/minimizing the window
12:12:39 <Mic> Also wanted :)
12:12:40 <aleth> rly? cool, I haven't been following for a while
12:13:14 <aleth> I was just thinking about improving the log viewer when it struck me it really was not necessary (from the interface point of view)
12:13:33 <aleth> of course behind the scenes this could be tricky
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12:21:22 <flo> clokep_work: what would that fix?
12:22:43 <flo> it just separates the jemalloc compilation from the Microsoft DLL mess.
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12:24:26 <flo> aleth: what you suggested is definitely wanted (and I think we discussed it here as recently as yesterday).
12:24:35 <aleth> :)
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12:24:58 <aleth> I should search the logs before posting ;)
12:24:59 <flo> and yes, the behind the scenes part needs a lot of work. Especially, we need a good indexed log storage
12:26:05 <aleth> seems like a big rewrite since you would then basically "only have logs", constantly indexed
12:26:21 <aleth> unless there are libraries for that kind of thing?
12:26:30 <aleth> e.g. in thunderbird?
12:26:58 <flo> we also discussed this yesterday :)
12:27:02 <aleth> lol
12:27:07 <aleth> ok :) 
12:27:24 * aleth goes log hunting
12:27:48 <aleth> see, this is why we need that feature ;)
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12:28:45 <aleth> oh nice, you also discussed syncing them
12:29:08 <flo> sometimes we discuss "making Instantbird awesome" ;)
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12:31:44 <aleth> :D
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12:33:01 <aleth> https://developer.mozilla.org/en/thunderbird/gloda
12:33:20 <Mic> A small animation on the unread counter could be nice when the count changed a few seconds ago.
12:33:49 <Mic> Skype uses this jumping dot, I'd rather trying fading out the color from orange to grey maybe (will try later)
12:34:21 <flo> Mic: what's the goal?
12:34:38 <flo> if there are 5 unread messages. Why a 6th message would interest me?
12:35:04 <Mic> It gives a sense of activity
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12:37:04 <aleth> so yeah, they use sqlite with a page cache and asynchronous indexing
12:37:09 <flo> not something *I* would want.
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12:38:21 <flo> well, fading the previous number into the next number could be nice, to reduce the "eye catchyness"
12:39:15 <aleth> are you talking about an add-on?
12:41:24 <flo> aleth: about the feature I landed on nightlies 2 days ago (pref'ed off by default)
12:43:42 <aleth> flo: thanks, will turn it on and see what happens
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12:59:48 <aleth> flo: which pref? is it in about:config only?
12:59:59 <flo> yes, filter for "alwaysClose"
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13:33:08 <aleth> flo: thanks, that's a really nice feature
13:33:24 <flo> thanks. It's still a work in progress ;)
13:33:40 <aleth> there is a slight display imperfection on linux
13:33:49 <flo> on all OSes ;)
13:33:54 <aleth> ah ok
13:34:25 <flo> though it's probably on Linux that it looks the best (at least with the GTK theme I have).
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13:34:51 <aleth> it looks great, it's just that the bottom edge of the unread message indicator is cut off
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14:03:31 <aleth> umm, so how does one actually close a conversation (hidden or not) when this is enabled? (There is no context menu in the contacts window)
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14:12:04 <Mic> aleth: you /part the channel
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14:13:33 <aleth> mic: thanks, yes, but what I meant was it would be good to have this in the UI, in the context menu of the tab and in the contacts menu
14:13:46 <Mic> We have bugs filed about this already
14:13:57 <aleth> ok :)
14:14:03 <Mic> Check the bugs from number 978  onward
14:14:06 * aleth is behind the curve today
14:14:13 <Mic> Most of them are about this topic.
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14:34:29 <Mic> Could it be that messenger.warnOnQuit: true doesn't work at the moment?
14:56:50 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 990 filed by benediktp@ymail.com.
14:56:52 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=990 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Closing a conversation window warns about unread messages even though "hidden conversations" are act
15:04:57 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 991 filed by benediktp@ymail.com.
15:05:02 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=991 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Show status icon for hidden conversations
15:10:12 <instantbot> aletheia2@fastmail.fm added attachment 788 to bug 979.
15:10:14 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=979 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Fix look for "Hidden conversations" /"Contacts" contact list sections and their headers
15:39:48 <flo> Mic: it may not work for hidden conversations
15:42:26 <Mic> OK, just imagine I filed a bug for this then;)
15:45:05 <flo> yeah, this is based on the conversation tabs: http://lxr.instantbird.org/instantbird/source/instantbird/modules/imWindows.jsm#120
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15:57:47 <Mic> Yes, I tracked it to this "tab"-thing but wasn't sure I did it right ..
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16:44:54 <clokep_work> Bah I'll just have to compiled it on my laptop then, Oh well.
16:45:20 <clokep_work> Next up is to get the unread over the icon in the Windows Taskbar. ;)
16:46:19 <Mic> i.e. a Windows 7 icon overlay for the taskbar item?
16:46:50 <Mic> iirc the bug on BMO for icon overlays is not fixed yet, do you plan to take that one if necessary?
16:53:22 <clokep_work> sid0 is working on it.
17:00:22 <clokep_work> But maybe. ;)
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19:54:41 <Mic> uuuhh, reopening a conversation with >300 messages (that was the unread count at least) is painfully slow on this Core2 Duo (2GHz) with 2GB RAM :(
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20:44:27 <flo> Mic: opening #developers (900+ unread messages) just took ~8s for me.
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20:50:16 <aleth> One fine day in the future, when you have implemented the seamless log idea, this problem will probably go away automagically, as you just wouldn't load all the 300 messages at once?
20:51:18 * flo agrees that if we fix the problem it will go away :)
20:51:49 * aleth was thinking that fixing a different problem would also make it go away :)
20:52:20 <flo> it would be interesting to know what's so slow
20:52:34 <flo> the Bubbles theme has quite a bit of JS
20:52:57 <flo> and receives events each time something is inserted to the DOM
20:53:52 <flo> if we could insert everything at once and then display / execute the JS, it may perform much better
20:54:12 <flo> but anyway, it would clearly be much better to have only what's visible in the DOM :)
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21:02:29 <aleth> just a lot of work :)
21:05:09 <flo> I think we just need someone crazy enough to try ;)
21:06:49 <aleth> oh, this is odd: when reopening a hidden conversation, all the smileys disappear.
21:08:19 <flo> aleth: bug 306. Already discussed in the last 2 days ;)
21:08:22 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=306 min, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Emoticons are not displayed when a message is displayed several times
21:08:52 <aleth> sorry, I only have incomplete logs
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21:09:28 <aleth> I am impressed you had a bug pre-filed for this in 2010
21:09:28 <flo> there's a link in the topic to the logs
21:10:08 <aleth> aha! in the tooltip ;)
21:10:16 <flo> I knew something was wrong and filed it "because it could become visible" ;)
21:10:23 <Mook_as> ooh. that means (once magic streaming history is implemented) I need to write an addon that pulls logs from the website instead of ib's history :D
21:10:52 <flo> I don't understand why my Contacts window isn't resizable on my nightly, but is resizable correctly on my debug build :-/
21:11:19 <aleth> Resizes fine for me (latest nightly)
21:11:37 <flo> Mook_as: don't you think we should just download channel histories from "safe" sources? ;)
21:11:52 <flo> (automatically, I mean)
21:12:07 <Mook_as> define "safe" ;)
21:12:28 <Mook_as> (I wouldn't expect people-not-me-or-you to consider bezut.info to be safe)
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21:26:06 <clokep> We need that idea I had to share logs over IRC. ;)
21:27:58 <flo> Mook_as: signed by the channel founder?
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21:42:19 <DGMurdockIII> im soryy aboy the offtopic stuff I have been talking about in here
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21:48:48 <flo> the fix for bug 306 seems as easy as http://pastebin.instantbird.com/915
21:48:51 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=306 min, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Emoticons are not displayed when a message is displayed several times
21:48:56 <flo> I wonder if there's anything that could regress
21:51:22 <flo> hmm, ok it's written in the bug "In this case, how can add-ons modify on-the-fly the received messages before
21:51:22 <flo> they are displayed?" :-/.
21:52:46 <flo> seems like bug 692 though
21:52:49 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=692 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, redesign the purpleIMessage xpcom interface
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22:00:07 <clokep> Hah, simplest fix ever. :)
22:01:40 <flo> it would be great if someone could have an idea about how we can theme these list headers :-S
22:02:58 <-- jb has quit (Ping timeout)
22:05:02 <DGMurdockIII> what to mean by list hedders?
22:05:43 <flo> DGMurdockIII: bug 979
22:05:46 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=979 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Fix look for "Hidden conversations" /"Contacts" contact list sections and their headers
22:09:38 <DGMurdockIII> i sill dont know exzatly what list hedders are could some one tell me based on the picture in that bug
22:10:44 <DGMurdockIII> are list headers the group name
22:13:10 --> Mic has joined #instantbird
22:13:11 * ChanServ sets mode +h Mic 
22:14:21 <Mic> DGMurdockIII: you won't know if you haven't enabled an experimental thing on your nightly build.
22:14:56 <Mic> It's possible to completely hide conversations from the conversations window since two days, check the screenshot in this bug to see what it looks like.
22:14:58 <DGMurdockIII> tell me how to do that
22:15:36 <Mic> Search for alwaysClose in about:config and change it to .. aehm, the other value (it's a true/false thingie)
22:16:04 <Mic> false is it.
22:16:47 <DGMurdockIII> ok
22:17:47 <Mic> We have lots of bugs filed on this already by the way.. you better search Bugzilla thoroughly before reporting anything since we might already have it.
22:18:29 <flo> Mic: fixing the Quit warning is more complicated than it seems. If the conversations with unread messages are hidden and no conversation window exists, which window can we focus as the parent of the message? :-S
22:18:48 <flo> hmm, or maybe that prompt should always use null as the parent window :-S
22:19:50 <DGMurdockIII> mic, one i set it false do i have to restart instantbird before i see the change
22:20:22 <Mic> No, you don't.
22:21:00 <Mic> Next time you close a conversation window, all MUCs/channels will go to this new section and all direct conversations with unread messages too.
22:21:14 <Mic> This section is hidden if empty
22:22:14 <-- gmoro_ has quit (Quit: Leaving)
22:22:43 <-- chrisccoulson has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
22:22:55 <Mook_as> flo: buddy list, if it exists? (using visible unread windows as parent is a nice feature, though, since that tells you which ones are not read)
22:23:22 <flo> on mac the buddy list may not exist
22:23:32 <clokep> Then center of the screen. :)
22:23:38 <clokep> (Or pop up the buddy list?)
22:23:50 <Mook_as> same on windows (if you have it in the tray); in those cases, yeah, null parent
22:24:01 <Mook_as> (or, yeah, pop up the buddy list...)
22:24:07 <Mic> Group the unread ones into a new window and focus it?
22:24:07 <flo> hmm, currently we use Services.wm.getMostRecentWindow("Messenger:convs") unconditionnally
22:24:24 <flo> I guess it would just return null if there's no conv window and that wouldn't cause more failure?
22:24:57 <flo> Mook_as: it's not the same on Windows, the blist is minimized. On Mac it's *really* closed.
22:24:59 <Mic> hmm, but this would need to be temporary most likely? Sounds too complicated on second thought ..
22:25:31 <Mook_as> ah, it's just hidden on windows? okay. that makes sense, now that I think about it - gecko doesn't like it when you have no windows open (on not-mac)
22:25:40 <DGMurdockIII> i dont use instantbird for irc so will i anything
22:25:57 <clokep> You can do it with any chat window.
22:26:04 <DGMurdockIII> ok
22:26:12 <clokep> You could use do it with an unread private message.
22:26:18 <flo> Mook_as: I think we could get away with having no window. It was minimized instead of closed mostly because that's what the minimize to tray code expects
22:26:19 <Mook_as> and yeah, irc conversation windows definitely need to tell me harder that I"m disconnected
22:26:46 <Mook_as> flo: heh, go go old assumptions that made sense when it was dealing with firefox browser windows! :p
22:27:01 <clokep> Mook_as: The icon has a little gray bubble when you're disconnected.
22:27:15 <flo> I would prefer if we could actually close it, it would use less resource (thinking more about the CPU wake-ups draining the battery than memory here) as there wouldn't be so many observers on contact status changes
22:27:59 <flo> Mook_as: "tell me harder that I"m disconnected" what should it do?
22:28:51 <clokep> He wants it to smack him in the face. :p
22:28:55 <clokep> Spray water at him.
22:28:56 <Mook_as> flo: dunno. have some actual text somewhere that says "disconnected"? :p
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22:29:45 <clokep> It should say that you disconnected when Instantbird knows you're disconnected.
22:29:47 <flo> Mook_as: isn't that the last system message in the conversation?
22:30:07 <clokep> Unfortunately often times Instantbird doesn't know (if the server thinks you timed out, but the client doesn't).
22:30:13 <Mook_as> flo: I seem to not see it... I just see <topic> <topic> <topic>
22:30:15 <clokep> Wrecks havoc on me on occasion.
22:30:25 <Mic> I think we should rejoin channels automatically after an account got disconnected and reconnected
22:30:26 <flo> topic is when you are back online
22:30:43 <Mook_as> right. but there's no disconnect message between topics :)
22:30:47 <clokep> Mic: I think there's a bug for that. :)
22:30:51 <clokep> One of us filed it probably. :p
22:30:56 <flo> Mook_as: that's strange
22:30:58 <flo> let me try :-P
22:31:00 <Mic> And should offer a way to rejoin easily if the channel was parted (maybe even to reconnect if the account is currently disconnected)?
22:31:45 <flo> heeey, with the new conversation stuff, we are ready for dynamic message theme change! :)
22:31:55 <Mic> "You can't send messages to this channel because you left it. _Rejoin_ now." in the input box?
22:31:58 <flo> well, it would lag a bit, but we have all the needed info to redisplay a conversation
22:32:25 <aleth> or forget the quit warning and implement session restore instead :p
22:34:04 <flo> Mook_as: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/916 I don't know why it's not in the mood of showing me the topic, but there's definitely a message saying the account is disconnected
22:34:46 <flo> aleth: session restore would get rid of the restart warning. The quit warning may still be useful if you quit because you want to go offline for the day and haven't noticed some unread messages
22:35:04 <Mook_as> in my case it's probably because I was on a really crappy connection and I pinged out?
22:35:08 <flo> aleth: generally, I prefer if we can avoid putting warnings in the face of the user ;)
22:35:34 <clokep> Mook_as: That would be my guess, it used to happen to me all the time at one of my internships.
22:35:49 <clokep> flo: So for bug 749 (if I can steal a few minutes of your time), what's the proper way to handle that?
22:35:52 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=749 enh, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, System Tray Icon should persist even when Buddy List is open
22:36:01 <clokep> Is it to not bind anything and just use the global variable instead of "this" everywhere?
22:36:12 <flo> that works
22:36:30 <aleth> flo: That's true. But a "you still have unread messages" query would be a slightly different thing?
22:36:42 * clokep feels like everyeone in this room is pink...
22:36:58 <flo> you can also get away with using the global variable only once in a method that then calls the real method
22:37:11 <flo> aleth: different from what?
22:37:47 <aleth> flo: maybe I misremember the current quit warning text, as I have it turned off
22:37:48 <Mic> Cool, can we change the color of a participant now and re-display all messages?
22:40:54 <flo> aleth: it says "you have unread messages in <N> conversations, are you sure you want to quit? [QUIT] [Cancel]"
22:41:26 <flo> Mic: not at a decent speed ;)
22:42:32 <aleth> flo: sorry, i was mistaken, i somehow thought there were 2 distinct things. must be a hangover from pidgin
22:43:00 <Mic> Good night
22:43:33 <-- Mic has quit (Quit: Instantbird 1.1a1pre)
22:43:34 <flo> aleth: 2 distinct things?
22:43:45 <aleth> flo: yes, i was wrong
22:44:21 <flo> we have another warning when closing a conversation window with tabs containing unread messages. We will probably get rid of it soon, now that the conversations get hidden instead of closed in that case :)
22:44:48 <aleth> as far as i recall, in pidgin quit confirmation would appear in any case (i.e. "you have open chats")
22:47:17 <aleth> but i may be wrong about that too
22:49:04 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com added attachment 789 to bug 749.
22:49:05 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com cancelled review?(florian@instantbird .org) for attachment 785 on bug 749.
22:49:06 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com requested review from florian@instantbird .org for attachment 789 on bug 749.
22:49:07 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=749 enh, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, System Tray Icon should persist even when Buddy List is open
22:51:05 <flo> aleth: I haven't used Pidgin in years. I started using Instantbird over 4 years ago
22:51:24 <aleth> I uninstalled it soon after I switched
22:51:40 <clokep> :)
22:51:46 <flo> I remember the first private development build that could start a conversation (= had a working buddy list) was on August 21st, 2007. I haven't used Pidgin much after that.
22:52:07 <aleth> early dogfooding :)
22:52:17 <flo> yeah, very early!
22:52:46 <flo> it worked only on Linux at the time (still relied on the glib event loop)
22:54:12 --> Chris has joined #instantbird
22:54:36 <Chris> Hello?
22:55:13 <flo> Chris: that question isn't going to give you interesting answers ;)
22:55:14 <clokep> Hello Chris.
22:56:05 <Chris> Sorry, it was so quiet I'm not used to quiet IRC channels lol...Hey, is there a way in instantbird to set it to ignore any incoming message from someone not on your contact list? I constantly get camsite adds and their annoying
22:56:41 <flo> arg, that change is ugly :(
22:57:19 <clokep> Chris, there isn't currently any spam protection / blocking mechanism in place.
22:57:25 <clokep> We have a few bugs on file abou tit...but not yet.
22:57:26 <flo> clokep: have you read the "load" method that you patch removes? It was exactly a solution for that "this" problem :(
22:58:05 <Chris> I just downloaded it so I havn't read anything yet, just trying to find things
22:58:35 <clokep> Bah it does, doesn't it.
22:59:15 <Chris> I just switched from Digsby which i changed to when my GF changed from Trillian...so I'm interested, but still in noobphase
23:00:27 <Chris> ok, given that parts not there, I assume the same is for the "Autohide" and "Always on top" feature?
23:00:40 <flo> don't hesitate to give feedback about your first impressions, what you had a hard time figuring out, etc... :)
23:01:07 <clokep> "Autohide"?
23:01:16 <flo> by the way, have you noticed that you can use it for IRC too? :)
23:01:34 <Chris> Nope, I'm using mibbit, and i have no idea how that got there lol
23:02:52 <Chris> As for problems, those are the only 3 i'm missing, autohide (ability to dock it at a part of the screen and it dips beyond it when not in use) "Always on top" and "spamblocker" those are the only things..oh and somethings weird with my facebook chat but i think its credentials based
23:03:42 <clokep> What's the issue you're having (it's probably one of the two in the FAQ though...)
23:04:11 <Chris> I can't find those features is all
23:04:16 <flo> clokep: do you really prefer that solution over the old load+init method?
23:04:27 <clokep> flo: No, I'm about to pastebin a patch for you.
23:04:44 <flo> don't want to attach a 1.4? :-D
23:05:03 <clokep> I'm verifying this time. :-D
23:05:17 <clokep> Chris: I was referring to your Facebook issue.
23:05:34 <flo> you could attach a 1.4 and rename it as 2.0 once it's verified :-P
23:05:39 <Chris> oh, that, like i said i think its credentials based, because its not liking my username and password is all
23:05:55 <clokep> What's the error you're getting? :P
23:05:58 <flo> yeah, you should read the FAQ about that ;)
23:06:02 <Chris> says its not authorized
23:07:37 <clokep> Chris: http://instantbird.com/faq.html#facebookauthorization
23:07:59 <clokep> (It's Facebook being stupid pretty much. :-D)
23:08:13 <clokep> flo: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/917 I think I got it this time. :-D
23:09:52 <Chris> that did it, thanks, guess i'll have to wait for updates to filter down for the other 3 haha, otherwise great IM so far
23:10:12 <Chris> havn't given file transfer a try yet but my GF and I RP enough via IM that it'll happen eventually lol
23:10:17 <clokep> You could always write an extension. :-D
23:10:17 <flo> uh, the |window.removeEventListener("load", gMinTrayR.init, true);| line in the old code was just plain wrong :-/
23:10:54 <clokep> There isn't file transfer yet, unfortunately. :-/
23:10:58 <clokep> (And what is "RP"?)
23:10:58 <Chris> true, but I've never written one, might be fun though, and I am just getting out of college for a programing degree, would be good for my port....
23:11:02 <Chris> Roleplay
23:11:06 <Chris> aka D&D
23:11:12 <clokep> Ah, got it. :)
23:11:19 <flo> didn't Mic hack something for the "always on top" feature?
23:11:41 <clokep> Chris: They're fairly easy to write (IMO), if you're interested, we'd certainly be willing to help you out w/ questions. :)
23:12:04 <Chris> where would the instructions on writing your extentions :) get me bored enough and you'll wind up with all the nifty features ready to load lol
23:12:54 <clokep> Uhh...well...our extension system is the Firefox/Thunderbird one, so we don't have a ton of general documentation about it...
23:13:00 <flo> maybe you could add webcam support for MSN? bored+having a GF to IM with seems like the perfect prerequisites ;)
23:13:11 <clokep> http://wiki.instantbird.org has some stuff. :)
23:13:27 <Chris> well going to start with something important first, spamblocker lol
23:13:51 <clokep> Haha. I started a spam blocker extension but didn't get very far...
23:13:58 <flo> clokep: that patch is not ready yet :P
23:14:08 <flo> what's the value of "this" in |uninit|? ;)
23:14:20 <Chris> well what i'm planning is a "don't IM me unless I Know you" extention mroe then a spamblocker lol
23:14:29 <flo> mine (spamblocker add-on) should be ready soon
23:14:32 <clokep> flo: Is it not gMinTrayR?
23:14:45 <flo> nope, it's "window" :-P
23:15:05 <flo> you didn't use bind on it ;)
23:15:06 <clokep> Bah. I'm really bad with events. :(
23:15:13 <clokep> Oh, so I'm supposed to use bind there?!
23:15:17 <clokep> But then how can I remove it?!
23:15:17 <flo> so you need the global variable on these 2 lines
23:15:26 <clokep> I see...
23:15:40 <flo> Or if you really don't wanna see that global variable, there's Nils method
23:16:01 <flo> clokep: "Bah. I'm really bad with events. :(" nah, they are just being mean with you ;)
23:16:26 <clokep> flo: http://pastebin.instantbird.com/?diff=918 ?
23:16:50 <flo> you should get interdiff someday ;)
23:17:24 <clokep> ...?
23:17:45 <Chris> ok guys, thanks for the help, I'll be back when and if I get something built
23:17:50 <flo> I think the patch is OK though
23:18:18 <clokep> OK. :)
23:18:24 <-- Chris has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
23:18:33 * clokep would like to check this in and start cleaning up his trees. :)
23:18:53 * flo thinks the same for a different value of this
23:18:56 <flo> sametime...
23:19:06 <flo> but maybe I should rather just revert it
23:19:26 <clokep> Hahah, that's why I want to get this checked in so that tree only has sametime diffs in it. :)
23:20:09 <flo> I'd like to have only conversation UI stuff in mine ;)
23:20:41 <clokep> I'm literally about to start the sametime stuff though...as soon as I get this r+ed. :P
23:21:02 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com added attachment 790 to bug 749.
23:21:03 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com cancelled review?(florian@instantbird .org) for attachment 789 on bug 749.
23:21:04 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com requested review from florian@instantbird .org for attachment 790 on bug 749.
23:21:05 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=749 enh, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, System Tray Icon should persist even when Buddy List is open
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23:22:46 <clokep> Oops, sorry.
23:25:27 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org granted review for attachment 790 on bug 749.
23:25:29 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=749 enh, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, System Tray Icon should persist even when Buddy List is open
23:26:06 <flo> It's nice that I've about 10 spammers per day on AIM. Very motivating to finish my spam handler :)
23:26:37 <clokep> Mine seem to go in waves, it'll be really bad a few days, I'll write a few lines of code, then it'll disappear.
23:26:41 <clokep> Aka, not motivating for my spam handler.
23:27:31 <flo> mine depends on the conversation stuff I'm working on
23:27:46 <flo> I would like to just hide by default (when the add-on is installed) conversations from unknown buddies
23:27:59 <clokep> Ah, so you can just ignore them.
23:28:05 <flo> I may need to add an exception for IRC
23:28:07 * clokep is reading about mercurial queues.
23:28:12 <clokep> Do you use them?
23:28:18 <flo> so that I'm not interrupted and can close them later
23:28:24 <flo> no, but I should.
23:29:15 <clokep> Mmmm.
23:29:25 <clokep> They seem overly complicated. :(
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23:34:43 <DGMurdockIII> flo, that would be good but dont revent the wheel on spam pertion there is a good adon for pidgon for blocking IM Bots that you could use as a start http://sourceforge.net/projects/pidgin-bs/
23:41:03 <clokep> We can't "use it as a start" though.
23:41:55 <DGMurdockIII> not use it as start for the anti-spam
23:42:46 <DGMurdockIII> use as somthing that can help when building the anti-spam protection
23:43:14 <flo> DGMurdockIII: so you suggested using something very complicated as a start before implementing something very simple?
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23:44:34 <DGMurdockIII> how ever you want to use when building you spam blocker extension you dont have to use it at all
23:44:40 <DGMurdockIII> it just a suggestion