#instantbird log on 05 14 2011

All times are UTC.

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10:45:35 <flo> ah, we have a new Windows nightly... finally :)
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11:56:08 <Mic> flo: the new contact list header looks great :)
11:59:23 <Mic> And it's even working :D :P
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12:35:30 <flo> Mic: :)
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12:55:46 <Mic> How can I unset a buddy image?
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12:58:19 <flo> Mic: you set another one
12:58:43 <flo> there's no UI to just remove the current image.
12:59:01 <flo> but the XPCOM C++ code is designed to allow that, you just need to pass null as the image URL
12:59:02 * instantbot frowns at flo
12:59:15 <Mic> Ok .. I guess I can always pick an invalid file? ;)
12:59:45 <flo> how do you do that?
13:01:18 <Mic> Select a file that isn't an image file?
13:01:29 <flo> that's not supposed to be possible
13:01:42 <flo> the file picker filters the files based on the extension
13:01:43 <Mic> Why not?
13:01:51 <flo> or do you mean change the extension of another file?
13:02:23 <Mic> You can always enter *.* in the file input box and pick one from the complete list that gets shown through this
13:03:31 <Mic> I have a blank space where the icon used to be now and it didn't even display an error on the console
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13:03:42 <flo> :-/
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13:05:51 <Mic> Shall I file a bug about this feature? ;)
13:06:06 <flo> yes, please
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13:07:22 <Mic> Have you checked if this is possible to do on Mac OS?
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13:08:23 <flo> to do what?
13:08:31 <clokep> Yeah Windows always supports *.* as a file type in the file picker.
13:08:40 * clokep needs to update!
13:08:42 <flo> it's not possible on Mac to select a file that doesn't match the filter
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13:09:10 <Mic> Not even to type its name by hand?
13:09:20 <flo> there's no textfield at all
13:09:20 <clokep> Bleh partial failed. :(
13:09:49 <Mic> Ah, I remember .. Apple knows what's good for you :P
13:10:00 <flo> ah, no. There's a textfield actually. A search box.
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13:10:24 <flo> it can't be used to bypass the filter
13:10:32 <clokep> So does this default to an Instantbird icon flo? ;)
13:10:55 <flo> clokep: when the src attribute is empty, the CSS displays about:logo
13:10:56 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 781 filed by benediktp@ymail.com.
13:10:58 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=781 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Possible to select a non-image file as buddy icon
13:11:08 <clokep> OK. :)
13:11:08 <flo> hmm, well, not exactly about:logo, but the branding image
13:11:17 <clokep> Just wondering.
13:11:25 <flo> it's just the image displayed when there's no image, it's not sent over the network.
13:11:30 <flo> it's like the "Display Name" placeholder
13:11:56 <Mic> I found another issue, I think
13:12:02 <clokep> To remove it we could put an "X" in the top corner while hovering.
13:12:11 <Mic> Could be like the buddy icon problem I had for buddy status extension
13:12:36 <flo> and if anybody believes we should use a more descriptive icon there, that person is welcome to file a bug and motivate someone with graphic skills ;).
13:12:57 * clokep thinks about filing a bug and assigning to idechix. ;)
13:13:02 <flo> clokep: sure, you can file an enhancement request for that
13:13:16 <flo> clokep: I'm afraid "assigning" won't be enough for the motivation part ;)
13:13:24 <Mic> The buddy icon doesn't appear on the tooltip (for my ICQ buddy -> ie I have myself on the list) after a restart of the application
13:13:29 <clokep> Well I'm not flying to France to poke him. :P
13:13:37 <Mic> it works right after setting a buddy icon though
13:13:40 <Mic> Can someone confirm this?
13:13:56 <flo> I don't use ICQ
13:14:10 <flo> I tested mostly with AIM and MSN (and a bit with Gtalk)
13:14:13 <Mic> I guess we could have an abstract buddy image, like the placeholder on facebook?
13:14:36 <flo> the concern I have is "how do we make it discoverable that people should click on the icon to change it?"
13:15:14 <flo> I thought we could display "click to change" in graytext above the current image when hovering it. Or maybe just a tooltip text
13:15:25 <clokep> Mic I like that idea. A vague humanoid form.
13:15:41 <flo> same thing for the display name, but I hope the cursor and the "Display Name" text help there
13:16:49 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 782 filed by clokep@gmail.com.
13:16:50 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=782 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Ability to remove buddy icon
13:17:04 <clokep> I think the Display Name makes more sense.
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13:17:22 <clokep> My first thought when I opened up though was that the icon was set to the Instantbird icon.
13:17:25 <clokep> (Which is OK w/ me. :))
13:17:39 <flo> clokep: it could be a nice marketing thing ;)
13:18:06 <flo> but sending something without the user's consent is not fine with me ;).
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13:18:49 <clokep> flo: I agree, but some programs do it.
13:19:06 <flo> like digsby?
13:19:08 <clokep> Was just my first thought. I think it'd be better to use something like Mic's idea. I'll file a bug.
13:19:10 <flo> :-P
13:19:10 <clokep> Yup!
13:19:33 <flo> I thought about using a colorless version of our logo, to make it more obvious it was just a placeholder
13:19:57 <flo> and I couldn't find the CSS magic incantation to make it appear in gray scale
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13:22:27 <clokep> Haha. SVG filter is what you need.
13:22:49 <flo> does it work for background images too?
13:23:16 <flo> but yeah, I remembered it had "filter" in the name, but didn't find the solution quickly enough
13:23:43 <flo> and I was sure the content of the placeholder was going to lead to some exciting bikeshedding discussion anyway. ;)
13:24:35 <clokep> :)
13:24:38 * clokep is lookking.
13:25:01 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 783 filed by benediktp@ymail.com.
13:25:02 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=783 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Buddy icon doesn't display on tooltip of ICQ account
13:26:10 <clokep> flo: I think something like this: http://dbaron.org/log/20110430-invert-colors but not hue inversion. :-D
13:26:20 <clokep> I'll file a bug about it as a "think about the icon we're using"
13:28:03 <clokep> I don't find it very obvious it can be set either...:-/
13:30:18 <Mic> Have a nice day
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13:30:54 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 784 filed by clokep@gmail.com.
13:30:56 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=784 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Use placeholder icon that can obviously be changed for the buddy icon
13:31:04 <clokep> Oops...
13:38:23 <clokep> Set it to the release icon...worked for my AIM and my Gtalk account.
13:41:22 <clokep> flo: My friend just sent me...."did you just make the Instantbird logo your Buddy Icon or did Instantbird do that itself? ;)"
13:41:35 <clokep> But he uses Digsby.
13:41:36 <flo> ahah
13:41:41 <clokep> So he must expect things like that.
13:42:18 <flo> yeah, we should provide an instantbird logo with a heart above it so that people can show it without people wondering if the application made it for them
13:43:34 <clokep> :)
13:43:47 <clokep> Make the envelopes fly around a heart instead of a planet?
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13:46:38 <flo> replace some envelopes with the heart?
13:47:43 <clokep> Ooo I like that. :)
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13:50:43 <flo> that could be the icon for the "I heart Instantbird" Firefox add-on putting our tag in amazon requests ;)
13:51:04 <clokep> Haha. :)
13:55:39 <flo> we need to open the bank account before that
13:56:03 <clokep> Ah.
13:56:04 <flo> I've no idea of what we can expect with that add-on
13:56:12 <clokep> I'll use it. :)
13:56:51 <clokep> How do you start in safe mode again? What's the command line parameter?
13:57:11 <flo> I ./instantbird --help each time I need it ^^'
14:03:01 <clokep> Thanks. :) Was thunderbird.exe -safe-mode ;)
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14:48:41 <Mic> Awesome :)
14:49:16 <flo> Mic: you hired an intern? :)
14:50:01 <Mic> No, .. give me a moment and I'll show you
14:50:42 <Mic> It doesn't do anything yet, but it's already cool : http://imageshack.us/m/694/2543/ibaerostatuschanger.png
14:52:27 <clokep> Mic: That looks awesome. :)
14:53:01 <flo> what will it do when clicked? (for the status message)
14:53:24 <clokep> Not use one I assume.
14:53:39 <Mic> Yes, I wanted to reset the message
14:53:53 <Mic> Having to set a message each time you change status is a bit painful..
14:55:06 * clokep doesn't set status messages...
14:55:36 <Mic> I use it on Skype, but never to set an actual status-message
14:55:56 <Mic> More like: what I'm doing or a link to something cool that I found on the web
14:56:26 <clokep> So you use it like Twitter. ;)
14:56:31 <clokep> Well how I use Twitter.
14:56:39 <clokep> And flo uses Twitter how I use like email. :P
14:57:17 <flo> clokep: you send less than 5 emails a month? :-P
14:57:26 <Mic> Ah ... so THAT's what Twitter is for? :D
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14:58:15 <clokep> flo: Well maybe more how I use IM?
14:58:22 <clokep> And I don't send a ton of emails.
14:58:31 <clokep> I receive like 80000000000
14:58:35 <clokep> But not send a lot. :)
14:59:11 <Mic> And I never reply to any of these 80000000000 that I receive ;)
14:59:15 <flo> I feel like I would probably use twitter much more if we had an acceptable UI for it
14:59:24 <clokep> I reply by going onto bugzilla. :p
15:00:05 <flo> oh, so you are confusing bugmail and email ? :-P
15:00:25 <clokep> Also mailing lists.
15:00:45 * flo adds "newsgroups" to the list of confused things
15:00:58 <clokep> I use a couple newsgroups.
15:01:02 <clokep> Much prefer them to mailing lists.
15:01:05 <clokep> And RSS feeds.
15:01:12 * clokep should screenshot his Thunderbird list.
15:01:24 <-- Mic has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.3a3pre)
15:01:36 * clokep needs to go BBQ.
15:01:38 <clokep> Ciao! Be back later.
15:01:53 <flo> have fun :)
15:02:14 <clokep> I will making this: http://www.bbqaddicts.com/blog/recipes/bacon-explosion/
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16:56:38 <igorko> when we go beta?
16:56:48 <igorko> go beta go ;)
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17:33:27 <igorko> translations bot sleeps? Don't receiving mail from him
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18:43:19 <flo> igorko: yes, it's currently offline. I don't know why. I asked Even about it, but he hasn't replied yet
18:43:46 <igorko> instantbot: wtf?
18:43:49 <instantbot> igorko: Sorry, I've no idea what 'wtf' might be.
18:43:50 <instantbot> igorko: firebot knew: wtf is an acronym for "What The F..." (insert word's favorite four-letter word)
18:44:08 <igorko> hehe- he also doesn't know :)
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19:24:33 --> igorko has joined #instantbird
19:26:19 <-- igorko has left #instantbird (Once you know what it is you want to be true, instinct is a very useful device for enabling you to know that it is)
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19:57:01 <igorko> å íà ïàøåò
19:57:11 <igorko> õóõ
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20:51:33 <Mic> It works :)
20:51:49 <Mic> I just changed my status clicking buttons on the Aero Preview :)
20:51:59 <Mic> *by clicking
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21:28:26 <flo> Mic: is it for an add-on or a patch? :)
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21:35:02 <igorko> flo: ping
21:35:25 <flo> igorko: pong
21:35:38 <igorko> want to request some feature for IRC
21:35:54 <igorko> adding status window of IRC server
21:36:51 <igorko> and in result to be able admin channels
21:37:03 <igorko> i mean irccop etc
21:37:30 <igorko> flo: it's planned?
21:38:09 <flo> what can't you currently admin in channels?
21:39:53 <igorko> in Unreal
21:40:06 <igorko> "/oper" doesn't work
21:40:24 <igorko> because it must be executed in server status dialog
21:40:32 <igorko> not in channel
21:41:09 <igorko> and as i understand he rest of unreal commands
21:41:14 <igorko> the rest*
21:41:27 <igorko> http://www.technerd.net/irc-commands.html
21:41:49 <flo> "server status dialog" makes no sense to me
21:42:12 <flo> the protocol doesn't have any "dialog" in it as far as I know
21:42:13 <igorko> you used e.g. Kvirc ?
21:42:17 <flo> no
21:42:53 <igorko> you can connect to server but not join any cg=hannel
21:43:01 <igorko> channel
21:43:02 * flo sets mode +o instantbot 
21:43:15 <igorko> so you have only server dialog
21:43:32 <igorko> you can type */join #channel* there
21:43:41 <igorko> and than jin to channel
21:43:45 <igorko> join*
21:43:58 <flo> and why can't you join a channel and then type your commands there?
21:44:18 <igorko> operator commands don't work from channel
21:44:32 <igorko> they must be executed from server dialog
21:45:04 <igorko> /oper igorko yityy
21:45:23 <igorko> hm here nothing(yeah- because i'm not irccop here)
21:45:27 <flo> and what's that command supposed to do?
21:45:50 <igorko> identify you as irccop
21:45:55 <igorko> http://www.technerd.net/irc-commands.html
21:46:04 <igorko> *** OPER Command ***
21:46:04 <igorko>       Attempts to give a user IRC Operator status.
21:46:04 <igorko>  
21:46:04 <igorko>       Syntax:  OPER <uid> <password>
21:46:04 <igorko>       Example: OPER hAtbLaDe foobar234
21:46:39 <flo> so that's a raw command you want to send to the server?
21:46:46 <igorko> trying to type this in pidgin(in channel) gives something like "can't execute command in this dialog"
21:46:52 <igorko> yep
21:47:12 <flo> try "/quote /oper igorko password" then
21:49:18 <flo> or maybe "/quote OPER igorko password"
21:49:39 <flo> well, "/quote <whatever you want the server to receive>"
21:50:48 <igorko> yep- last one works
21:50:52 <igorko> thanks :)
21:51:12 <igorko> but anyway- can you add server status dialog?
21:51:19 <flo> no problem
21:51:23 <igorko> or i's useless on your opinion?
21:51:24 <flo> why would I want to do that?
21:51:42 <igorko> or it's useless on your opinion?<----- seems this one ;)
21:52:33 <flo> I wish an add-on could do it, as lots of people coming from strange IRC clients seem to expect it. But it doesn't make much sense in itself (it's extremely user unfriendly. We are creating a graphical UI to simplify things, if people want to talk to the server directly, maybe they wanted telnet :-D)
21:53:02 <flo> anyway, the IRC guy is clokep (he is currently rewriting the IRC code in JavaScript in order to make it extensible)
21:54:43 <flo> (however, I must admit I'm kind of a geek too, and sometimes I could see some uses for it... But I consider those case as areas we should improve/fix ;))
21:55:00 <igorko> what about whois?
21:55:20 <flo> it's exactly what I had in mind! :-D
21:55:23 <flo> and /whowas
21:56:31 <flo> In most cases we should find user friendly ways to integrate the whois results in the UI
21:56:58 <flo> but yeah, clokep is the guy you need to convince to implement it ;)
21:57:44 <flo> I guess I would accept an advanced account options "open a server tab on connect" or something like that
22:03:12 <igorko> ok- need to go in bed
22:03:17 <igorko> see ya
22:03:22 <flo> Good night :)
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