#instantbird log on 10 12 2010

All times are UTC.

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06:42:26 <flo> Good morning :)
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07:07:14 <auscompgeek> evening
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07:24:55 <flo> Mic: hello
07:25:03 <Mic> good morning
07:25:10 <flo> anim.xml was used for the animation of the protocol icons in Instantbird 0.1.*
07:25:39 <flo> I haven't removed it when redesigning the accounts manager because it may have been useful for add-ons.
07:26:07 <flo> as I suspect no add-on has used it and the same result could be achieved with CSS3 transitions, I guess it's time to remove it :)
07:26:42 <Mic> Yesterday I was playing around with css transitions
07:27:15 <Mic> I tried replacing the sign-on animation with a css version but it failed
07:27:34 <Mic> The animation was done, but the buddy icon and displayname were only shown after the animation finished
07:27:43 <Mic> I don't know yet what the problem is
07:28:26 <flo> Isn't it was we already do (display the name and icon when the animation is finished)?
07:29:27 <Mic> ah..?
07:30:03 <Mic> Maybe I have too little online buddies in my list to have ever noticed what the effect is really supposed to be
07:30:21 <Mic> It is not 'rolling in the buddy' then, but 'extending the group'?
07:31:04 <flo> I creates some free space by expanding a blank box, and when the box has the good size, the buddy appears in it
07:31:06 <Mic> Maybe it works and some other bit was just interfering. Thanks for the pointer
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07:31:34 <flo> the sign-off animation is in 2 steps: first the buddy fades out, then the blank box collapses
07:32:15 <Mic> plus the node gets removed after the animation
07:32:22 <flo> yes
07:33:39 <Mic> Which is no problem since you can do things 'onTransitionEnd'
07:34:36 <Mic> well, a small problem maybe, but ok
07:35:42 <Mic> I was especially interested if it can be done completely in css, so this could be included in the theme and theme authors could change it if they want to
07:36:16 <flo> This removes a lot of ugly JS code, doesn't it? :)
07:36:22 <Mic> lots of
07:36:30 * flo looks forward to it
07:36:31 <Mic> Problem is that you don't know if there are several transition running, so when should you stop and remove the node?
07:36:37 <flo> do we have an open bug for this?
07:36:44 <Mic> nope, not yet
07:37:02 <Mic> oh, yes
07:37:15 <Mic> We have "use css transitions" somewhere, I filed that once
07:37:24 <flo> :)
07:37:30 <Mic> It's not specific to anything if I recall correctly ;)
07:38:16 <Mic> Shall we file several bugs for different 'construction sites' (which is most likely a bad literal translation of a german expression;)
07:39:02 <Mic> I'd say it's not really necessary though
07:40:24 <flo> bug 504
07:40:27 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Use CSS3
07:40:58 <flo> well, we can start in that bug, and if it gets confusing we will handle the message themes and the -moz-box-shadow and -moz-border-radius somewhere else :)
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07:46:45 <Mic> Commuting now
07:46:59 <Mic> I wish I could take chats and things seamlessly with me..
07:47:29 <flo> you  want Instantbird for Android? ;)
07:47:50 <Mic> but even syncing isn't as seemless as I'd want it
07:48:17 <Mic> It's rather something like : keep the application core running somwhere on the web and connect with different UIs to it
07:49:12 <Mic> Not forwarding the UI like x-forwarding does, but running a separate UI on each computer (including smartphones and stuff)
07:50:07 <Mic> I could imagine that this could be the next-big-thing ;)
07:50:10 <Mic> bbl
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07:51:51 <flo> Mic: that requires a trusted server somewhere though
07:54:48 <rikki> also i see another issue with that idea
07:55:15 <rikki> no tech company would embrace it, because they can't charge another 10$ to add in a 50c extra cpu required to run the software
07:55:42 <rikki> well they would have less excuse to
07:56:00 <flo> I don't understand
07:56:46 <flo> the back end is not (or at list should not be) the part that consumes CPU resources.
07:57:29 <rikki> well if e.g. cell phone makers are required to add in an extra say 100mhz cpu they would could charge an extra 10$ for example but if the software isn't being run on the cell phone then they havn't got that excuse
07:58:05 <flo> on phone they usually charge for the data transfers, not the CPU usage ;)
07:58:18 <rikki> im using cell phones as an example
07:58:43 <rikki> smart phones would come under the same catagory
07:59:18 <flo> those company wouldn't like the "free" aspect of an open source application to begin with if all they want to do is charge people ;)
07:59:36 <rikki> yea but people will always fine ways to make it work
08:00:08 <rikki> find*
08:00:26 <rikki> like jail breaking the iphone
08:03:24 <rikki> although what might be the future, VM based application system on a server that is projected via translating GUI into html and css
08:03:46 <rikki> so in effect its a website
08:04:53 <rikki> but that technology already exists, google uses it in there gwt system
08:05:50 <rikki> excuse me while i do some programming to get this out of my system ehh
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08:58:31 <Mitch> flo: Hi. Did you know that this dir isn't as up-to-date as the 2010 dir? http://ftp.instantbird.com/instantbird/nightly/latest-trunk/
09:02:05 <flo> Mitch: yes :(. Bug 452.
09:02:08 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=452 maj, --, ---, raynaudquentin, NEW, latest-<version> links no longer working since the new buildbot configuration is used
09:03:39 <flo> thanks for reporting it, though :)
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09:28:31 <Mic|away> flo: you have your own computer, don't you? ;)
09:29:05 <flo> why?
09:29:33 <Mic|away> well, in my case you have your trusted server and other devices to connect to
09:30:03 <Mic|away> It's not that different in a way. It's just not under your desk ..
09:31:31 <flo> I have a server, do it would be the trusted computer
09:31:40 <flo> but I don't think most users have such a resource available ;)
09:34:20 <Mic|away> well, you would buy it somewhere and it should work out of the box once you entered your details on your own devices. Everything else is .. aehm, implementation details :P
09:41:46 <flo> you mean we whould sell IM connection servers?
09:42:58 <rikki> that sounds like a good idea
09:43:03 <rikki> but if we host them
09:43:06 <rikki> and manage them
09:43:59 <Mic|away> Could be an idea
09:44:13 <Mic|away> even though I was talking about nothing less than the future of the web at this point :P
09:44:41 * flo is more interested by the future of his sandwich.
09:45:12 <flo> well, if I manage to find one...
09:45:52 <Mic|away> Looks like my todo list: 1. coffee, 2. food, 3. work ;)
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09:46:21 <Mic|away> welcome tymerkaev, I see you attached an image to the preview bug :)
09:47:26 * Mic|away is now known as Mic
09:47:31 <tymerkaev> so fast
09:47:49 <tymerkaev> I just connected
09:47:58 <tymerkaev> and immediately got a new message ;)
09:48:01 <tymerkaev> Mic: what's up with it?
09:48:16 <Mic> Well, looks good :)
09:50:38 <tymerkaev> maybe review+ from you?
09:51:35 <Mic> I don't think I'm the right person to ask. Idechix is in charge of this
09:53:27 <Mic> bbl
10:00:18 <tymerkaev> what's bbl?
10:00:26 <Mic> "be back later"
10:00:40 <Mic> ahm, I'm back even so it's not that much later ;)
10:02:18 <Mic> flo: what did you mean by "sell[ing] IM connection servers"? 
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10:32:31 <flo> Mic: if instantbird has a mode to be only a UI above a server that connects to all the network, some people who can't host the server themselves may want a third party server
10:32:39 <flo> we could provide that server.
10:54:32 <Mitch> Are there any central-serverless, P2P chat protocols that don't suck?
10:55:41 <flo> do you mean without central-server or without server at all?
10:56:14 <flo> XMPP doesn't have a "central-server", you use the server of your account provider.
10:56:20 <flo> (mostly like for emails)
11:00:15 <Mitch> I did mean truly serverless.
11:00:53 <flo> some probably more or less work
11:01:13 <flo> I would probably not want to use a protocol that reveals my IP to everybody though.
11:02:27 <Mitch> Hmm.
11:02:47 <Mitch> I should see if there are any I2P XMPP servers.
11:03:14 <flo> serverless XMPP exists for local networks
11:03:17 <Mitch> The overhead isn't quite as bad as Tor, but it's still there.
11:03:57 <flo> and you can also use the server to initiate the conversation/get the presence information, and then start a P2P connection if both the participants want it
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11:46:03 <clokep> bug 531 was a bit about what you're talking about. I never split the second half (which you're discussing) into a second bug though.
11:46:05 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=531 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Cross program syncing (e.g. Instantbird / Thunderbird sharing account information)
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11:58:18 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 540 filed by benediktp@ymail.com.
11:58:20 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=540 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Provide ways to undo actions
12:14:58 <Mic> clokep: the things mentioned in bug 531 sounds like Instantbird forwarding things to another instance while the things discussed where more like a server/client approach
12:15:02 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=531 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Cross program syncing (e.g. Instantbird / Thunderbird sharing account information)
12:16:04 <Mic> *were
12:18:51 <clokep> Mic: Yes, but the same idea overall. :)
12:19:07 <clokep> Maybe if Pidgin finishes their UIless libpurple we could connect to that somehow?
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12:26:03 <Mic|web> I've read about that but not much more than the idea
12:31:35 <Mic|web> On a more simple task: Pidgin can't sync their buddy list, accounts and history yet, can they?
12:31:48 <Mic|web> Maybe we can best them if they don't..
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12:33:57 <clokep> Mic|web you mean with another Pidgin instance? I'm sure the response they'd give is copy your profile. ;)
12:36:45 <Mic|web> "Pidgin can sync your profiles now!", just download this script, make sure you compiled your kernel with ABC/Whatsoever-3.14-15, set up a vpn or remote acc...
12:36:52 <Mic|web> .. ok, no more trolling on this ;)
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13:04:49 <clokep> flo: Have you had any problems running my smiley patch at all? :-\
13:18:21 <clokep> Mic|web you just go through and CC all my bugs? ;)
13:19:12 <Mic|web> sort of .. I was really looking at 'your' bugs
13:19:38 <Mic|web> They tend to be interesting
13:20:06 <clokep> I try to mix it up. :)
13:20:41 <clokep> The UI for about:support/crashes should be super easy, I just haven't gotten around to doing it...
13:22:25 * clokep thinks he should probably shut off emails for CC.
13:25:08 <Mic|web> maybe we should create a trouble shooting page in general
13:26:02 <Mic|web> Like: have you tried to running in safemode (is there a way to add a button that restarts in safemode?), does it happen on a new profile, .. eventually a way to access the about:-pages in question?
13:26:25 <clokep> A way to restart in safemode might be good, Fx just added that to the Firefox menu.
13:26:40 <clokep> Troubleshooting wizard you maen?
13:26:49 <clokep> Could attempt without proxies, etc.
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13:44:54 <flo> Bringing the undo topic is interesting :)
13:48:47 <Mic|web> Any thoughts on it?
13:49:31 <flo> I'm commenting in the bug
13:54:07 <clokep> flo What does bug 361 refer to?
13:54:10 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=361 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, "use system settings" in color selection (Content tab) should be polished
13:54:26 <flo> the preferences dialog
13:55:27 <clokep> Hmm...OK.
13:56:01 <Mic|web> Unfortunately there's a problem with this on systems that don't apply changes immediately (Windows for example) iirc
13:57:12 <Mic|web> The preferences are not updated until you close the options dialog, so you can't just read out changed value(s) with the usual means
13:58:21 <clokep> I'm confused at what "Use system colors" means though, Use system colors for what?
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14:02:34 * flo mid-aired with clokep on bug 540
14:02:37 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=540 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Provide ways to undo actions
14:02:51 <clokep> Sorry flo, I was just CCing myself. :)
14:03:14 <flo> I know
14:03:23 <flo> don't worry, it's ok :)
14:05:37 <flo> clokep: "Use system colors" means: use the colors from the OS theme instead of the user-defined colors.
14:06:18 <clokep> Are these for sending my messages or messages I receive?
14:06:39 <flo> that depends on what you do with the "Send these fonts and colors as part of my messages when possible" checkbox
14:07:02 <clokep> Ok. :) The dialog is confusing I find.
14:07:18 <flo> changing font and color in IMs is a bad idea ;)
14:07:28 * clokep is filing a bug about it.
14:07:47 <Mic|web> On bug 540: I was thinking about getting rid of these dialogs completely
14:07:50 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=540 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Provide ways to undo actions
14:07:52 <clokep> I think it'd be better to break the "Content" menu into an "Incoming Formatting" and "Outgoing Formatting" section.
14:08:02 <clokep> And remove the Advanced menu.
14:08:35 <Mic|web> And I don't like the essay you suggested instead ;)
14:09:14 <flo> Mic|web: so you would remove contacts and archives without a warning or a way to undo it?
14:09:43 <Mic|web> No, exactly not
14:10:13 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 541 filed by clokep@gmail.com.
14:10:15 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=541 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Incoming formatting can be hard to read
14:10:38 <Mic|web> It should be possible to undo it, that's more important than a dialog that people will click away
14:11:57 <Mic|web> Deleting an account could collapse it to a single line (without asking to confirm) that says "Account ABC will be removed on next restart. [Undo]"
14:12:44 <Mic|web> or maybe better something like this: "Account ABC has been removed. This can be undone until next restart."
14:13:26 <clokep> I actually clicked "Remove" by mistake the other day and the dialog saved me. :)
14:13:52 <Mic|web> I suggest you read Aza's article. It's really good in my opinion
14:14:20 <clokep> I find his articles kind of preachy. :-\
14:16:22 <flo> Mic|web: account removal goes in the undoable category with regard to what I wrote ;).
14:16:44 <flo> Mic|web: I've read it a long time ago.
14:17:42 <flo> the issues that designers try to address by removing warnings are: 1. It's annoying(interrupts the train of thoughts). 2. It's not effective (people click through without reading).
14:18:06 <flo> the solution I proposed reduces that warning fatigue to a minimum: only a single dialog will ever be shown. It's more likely to be read.
14:18:22 <Mic|web> if you say so
14:19:12 <flo> and we basically agree ;)
14:19:32 <flo> you said "will be removed at the next restart", I said "an hour later, or at the next restart".
14:20:03 <Mic|web> "Undoable" bases on the idea that the action needs to be performed immediately
14:20:50 <Mic|web> *Not undoable
14:21:11 <clokep> flo: Should I mark that WONTFIX?
14:21:17 <flo> if you need to erase the traces left behind you, you need it immediately
14:21:32 <flo> clokep: I don't think so.
14:21:35 <flo> the issue is real
14:21:44 <clokep> OK. I'm gonna reply anyway.
14:21:55 <flo> and if you haven't found the solution yourself, there's a serious design issue somewhere ;)
14:22:48 <Mic|web> I admit that there's cases where you'd like to remove something instantly
14:23:25 <clokep> You midaired me this time! :P Payback I 'pose.
14:23:28 <Mic|web> On Windows Explorer you e.g. have the possibility to use either DEL, which sends to the trashbin or SHIFT+DEL to remove instantly
14:23:40 <Mic|web> The latter is not really discoverable though
14:23:56 <flo> and it's a perfect example of ineffective warning
14:24:11 <flo> when I used to use windows, I always used shift+del because teh warning was so annoying...
14:24:50 <flo> ah, no, the trash was annoying.
14:25:05 <Mic|web> They both show a slightly different message
14:25:09 <flo> yeah
14:25:47 <flo> if they removed the warning when sending to the trash, and made the trash remove automatically files that had been there for more than 30 days (like Gmail's trash), I would have happily used the trash :)
14:26:07 <clokep> flo: Default settings remove trash after a week I think?
14:26:14 <clokep> I just hate the icon change that shows its full.
14:26:34 <clokep> Oops, ignore the first part of my comment. I forgot to delete it on bug 541
14:26:37 <flo> is that new?
14:26:38 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=541 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Incoming formatting can be hard to read
14:27:06 <Mitch> flo: You right-click on the Recycle Bin and change the setting to always delete instantly.
14:28:54 <Mic|web> The account manager could be a good place to experiment with this since it offers enough space to show a decent message
14:29:35 <Mic|web> I'm afraid it could become one more thing on my ever-growing todo list. I should really do things in order and get things done :S 
14:30:05 <flo> We can get rid of the warning in the account manager
14:30:36 <flo> but do you think it's the most annoying warning? How often do you delete an account an have to click through it?
14:31:42 <Mic|web> No, but I think it's a good place to start
14:32:05 <flo> Undo will probably be desperately needed in the buddy list if we enable actions by drag and drop
14:32:07 <Mic|web> The accounts have a context menu already, so it wouldn't be too surprising to add one on the deleted items as well
14:32:13 <flo> "oops, where have I dropped that contact?"
14:32:57 <Mic|web> It could also contain both "Undo" and "Don't wait until restart"
14:36:00 <clokep> I have a fear about wait to restart.
14:36:07 <clokep> Since many people NEVER close their IM client unless it crashes.
14:36:52 * clokep is going to save flo's essay for later and reply in the bug.
14:38:53 <flo> clokep: that's the exact reason why I suggested both a period of time and "after restart"
14:39:07 <clokep> flo: I agree. :)
14:39:46 <flo> actually, it's more "quit" than "restart" ;)
14:43:16 <Mic|web> I'm more or less fine with a 'timeout' for the messages, even though it could happen 'out of nowhere' that the item vanishes then
14:43:30 <Mic|web> I don't agree on still showing a dialog
14:43:49 <flo> no dialog when sending a message, of course :)
14:43:54 <flo> that would be terrible
14:45:44 <Mic|web> I'm not really familiar with Twitter but can't it be that five seconds make a different between "you're the one who p0sted f1rst" and "lame, we already know that"?
14:46:20 <flo> there would be a way to turn it off
14:47:18 <flo> I don't know how we can do a good UI for that
14:48:13 <flo> if we had only the bubbles theme, I would add a line at the bottom of the bubble saying "Sending in <decreasing count of seconds> [Cancel] [Send now!]". That line would disappear once the message is sent
14:48:59 <Mic|web> Making it part of chrome would get around the theming issue
14:49:16 <Mic|web> I'm not sure how good that would look, though
14:49:26 <flo> we want to maintain the ability to use very small windows
14:49:35 <flo> so it's not easy to find somewhere in the chrome to put it
14:49:43 <flo> especially if we remove (or make optional) the status bar
14:50:08 <Mic|web> I was more thinking of a notification bar that reaches into the browser or something like that
14:50:36 <flo> ah, we could do that :)
14:50:53 <flo> it would need to be at the bottom to be near the textbox
14:51:03 <Mic|web> yes, sure
14:51:06 <flo> the problem is mostly the same if we want to pastebin long messages.
14:51:37 <flo> we need a confirmation from the user, a way to "send anyway", "pastebin", "cancel"
14:56:22 <flo> my previous idea was to use an arrow panel (see https://bug554937.bugzilla.mozilla.org/attachment.cgi?id=474799 for an example screenshot)
14:57:28 <Mic|web> ok
14:57:45 <flo> I don't like the "popup" aspect of the arrow panel
14:58:14 <Mic|web> by the way I'm trying to cut down my "screen time" in the next weeks, so don't expect me to respond quickly/frequently
14:58:23 <Mic|web> I'll still try to get some things done
14:58:24 <flo> I guess the solution we will use depends on the minimum size of window we think it should be compatible with
14:58:37 <clokep> Mic|web I am too. :(
14:58:45 <flo> screen or procrastination?
14:58:56 <Mic|web> Hopefully both
14:58:56 <clokep> flo: I don't like the popup either. :( Can we have it take over the textbox somehow to save space?
14:59:17 <flo> my first idea was to replace the textbox with the message
14:59:36 <Mic|web> A bad idea if the user wants to type another
14:59:38 <flo> and do whatever the default action was if the user continues typing without caring about the message
15:00:47 <Mic|web> oh, and I'm starting NOW to cut down screentime, so..:  have a nice day! :)
15:00:59 <flo> Good evening
15:01:08 <clokep> Good luck.
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15:12:38 <flo> wow, my full buddy list loads :)
15:12:57 <flo> I've been doing some C++ today. Making the libpurple protocols work with the new buddy list code.
15:12:58 <sumobot> c++ is evil
15:12:58 * instantbot mumbles something about c++ being evil
15:13:08 <flo> there are still bugs though :-S
15:16:22 * Mic is now known as Mic|away
15:16:38 * Mic|away is now known as Mic|web
15:17:22 * Mic|web is now known as Mic|away
15:17:41 <Mic|away> ah, just GROUPed my usual nicks :)
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15:18:25 <clokep> I have mine grouped, doesn't seem to do too much though. ;)
15:18:41 <Mic|away> Helps against others impersonating you
15:18:50 <flo> chanserv uses it
15:19:12 <flo> when I join with whatever is grouped with "florian", it ops me.
15:19:30 <Mic|away> I think I have a stricter setting, so if someone uses my nicks from hosts that are not authorized, they'll get renamed within half a minute iirc
15:19:43 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 542 filed by clokep@gmail.com.
15:19:45 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=542 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Reformat "Content" Tab of Options
15:19:48 <flo> ah, you can define a list of hosts?
15:20:02 <clokep> Mic|web: I just have it so you have to auth within 60 seconds or it renames you. :)
15:20:03 <Mic|away> I think you can add a host to a list
15:20:12 <clokep> I never set up the hosts list.
15:20:15 <Mic|away> It doesn't rename you then if you don't identify
15:20:30 * clokep doesn't really know how to do that.
15:20:58 <flo> and now my JS console is full of errors :)
15:21:03 <Mic|away> ./msg nickserv help ACCESS
15:21:38 <flo> but I can start a conversation, yay! :)
15:21:52 <flo> it's been a long time since the last time my debug build had been able to do that ;)
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15:21:57 <Mic|away> Congratulations and have a nice day
15:21:59 <Mic|away> Again.
15:22:08 <RezzoRix> hello
15:22:27 <flo> RezzoRix: hi :)
15:22:59 <clokep> Hello RezzoRix.
15:23:12 <RezzoRix> someone  here, thats good :) 
15:23:52 <RezzoRix> hey nice project, really nice work
15:25:03 <Mic|away> :)
15:26:07 <clokep> Mic|away: You're doing a terrible job of the "away" part of your name. :)
15:26:33 <instantbot> New Instantbird (UI) bug 543 filed by clokep@gmail.com.
15:26:35 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=543 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Text Modifier for plaintext formatting
15:27:41 <flo> RezzoRix: I'm in France ;).
15:28:33 <RezzoRix> having trouble with this chatzilla... actually no trouble... not used to it ^^
15:28:43 <RezzoRix> irc is soo oldschool :D
15:28:45 <flo> you can try Instantbird instead ;)
15:29:36 <RezzoRix> oh yes... see... just using icq  and this things wth instantbird... moment...
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15:30:40 <clokep> IRC and ChatZilla are both old school. :(
15:30:41 <RezzoRix1> ah...
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15:30:59 <RezzoRix1> so
15:31:03 <flo> clokep: are you going to teach us IRC's new school? :)
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15:31:23 <clokep> flo: I'll try. We'll see how it goes. . .
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15:31:42 <RezzoRix1> so it is fine
15:31:53 <flo> I've got to go
15:31:58 <flo> good evening/night! :)
15:32:01 <clokep> Bye.
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15:32:06 <RezzoRix1> ;) cya
15:32:17 <RezzoRix1> is this nightly build more or less stable?
15:32:52 <clokep> Yes, the nightlies are pretty stable (occasionally they'll be an issue but generally day-to-day they're fine), make sure you get the newest one though, it can be hard to find. :-\
15:33:04 <RezzoRix1> ok
15:33:13 <clokep> http://ftp.instantbird.com/instantbird/nightly/2010/10/2010-10-10-04-instantbird/ Would be the newest.
15:33:29 <RezzoRix1> i am using mac and pc
15:33:31 <clokep> Its not much different from 0.2 though. :)
15:33:47 <RezzoRix1> if i want to sync the chatlogs... can do without problems, right?
15:33:52 <RezzoRix1> fileformat is the same
15:34:12 <clokep> Yup, no problem syncing your profile as a whole.
15:34:26 <clokep> As long as you don't have extensions w/ binary components. :)
15:34:35 <clokep> There's a bug about syncing that stuff too. ;)
15:34:59 <RezzoRix1> i would sync it with dropbox or sth like this...
15:35:21 <clokep> bug 492 :)
15:35:25 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=492 enh, --, ---, benediktp, NEW, Adapt Firefox Sync for Instantbird
15:37:12 <RezzoRix1> i see
15:37:16 <RezzoRix1> interesting
15:38:13 <clokep> Unfortunately logs won't be synced, not until at least the log format is changed from plaintext. :-\
15:40:40 <RezzoRix1> but plaintext is nice... isnt it? 
15:41:08 <RezzoRix1> i like especially that the logs are saved in seperate files
15:41:59 <clokep> Can I ask why? :) I'm not a big fan of it, they take a long time to transfer and use a lot of space.
15:43:07 <RezzoRix1> there might be better options... but: text format everybody and everything can read.
15:43:15 <RezzoRix1> no migration problems
15:43:17 <RezzoRix1> nothing
15:44:02 <RezzoRix1> and seperate files makes it easy to sync without any special software...
15:44:52 <clokep> Fair enough. :)
15:44:58 <RezzoRix1> now... i am not a programer, might be that there are better options ;)
15:45:07 <clokep> As long as you don't have multiple conversations that overlap and end up in the same log file.
15:45:44 <RezzoRix1> isnt it that per conversation per person is 1 txt file?
15:46:04 <RezzoRix1> so it would just be more files, right?
15:46:44 <clokep> Weird things can happen, like Mic was signed into two places before?
15:46:58 <clokep> So if you have a conversation open w/ both of them its possible the logs aren't as easily synced.
15:47:05 <clokep> (Conversation with the same person.)
15:47:20 <RezzoRix1> hmm i see
15:48:01 <RezzoRix1> protocol problem. protocol should not allow to login at 2 locations at the same time :D
15:49:18 <clokep> I disagree. ;)
15:49:27 <clokep> Anyway I have to change buildings. I'll be back in a few minutes.
15:49:57 <RezzoRix1> cya
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16:35:47 * ChanServ sets mode +o idechix 
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18:39:22 <tymerkaev> idechix: hi
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18:48:31 <instantbot> benediktp@ymail.com added attachment 369 to bug 540.
18:48:35 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=540 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Provide ways to undo actions
18:53:38 <Mic> idechix: what's your idea on this attachment? Maybe have a look at it first and get an impression what I might want have to say with it before reading the accompanying comment (i.e. https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=540#c2 )
18:53:41 <instantbot> Bug 540 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Provide ways to undo actions
18:54:03 <Mic> *might wanted to say
19:05:07 <idechix> Mic: Nice ! It would definitely be a great feature ! 
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19:09:44 <Mic> idechix: have you read the other comments on the bug? The x-icon was an attempt to take care of the don't-wait-but-apply-changes-immediately problem, I wonder if it was clear that it would take the possibility to undo the action
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19:32:27 <Mic> good evening
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19:41:25 <clokep> Mic: The x-icon is kind of ambiguous to me. :-\
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19:43:46 <clokep> Since I sent this 21 seconds before you signed on...: Mic: The x-icon is kind of ambiguous to me. :-\
19:45:14 <Mic> How comes?
19:45:31 <Mic> Or: in which way ambiguous?
19:49:42 <clokep> Does it mean "undo" or "ignore this"?
19:53:52 <Mic> Check the tooltip if in doubt :P
19:54:37 <clokep> A lot of people don' tknow about tooltips. ;)
19:59:03 <Mic> We could popup a (modal) dialog and ask which of the two choices they'd prefer
19:59:14 <Mic> Ofcourse they have to confirm the choice again
19:59:49 <clokep> :)
20:00:04 <clokep> I think just putting an "Undo" or "Delete" links there instead of the "Undo" and 'x' would owrk fine.
20:03:09 <Mic> I was trying to avoid two text links but if it's clearer this way
20:03:12 <Mic> so bet it
20:03:15 <Mic> *be
20:04:24 <Mic> Apropos asterisk symbols ..
20:05:42 <Mic> Do you want to switch on the transformation of these in mozTXTyouknowwhat ?
20:06:17 <clokep> Of _underline_ /italics/ *bold*? Yes.
20:06:27 <clokep> Was I not clear in that bug? Its possible I didn't finish my thought. :)
20:07:03 <Mic> Maybe it was what I expected from the summary..
20:08:06 <Mic> What I had in mind when reading "Text modifiers"
20:08:32 <clokep> Yes. :)
20:08:56 <clokep> Although my phrasing in the report is to do it while we do linking, not as a text modifier, but that's OK. :)
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21:11:53 <Mic> nn
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