#instantbird log on 06 25 2010

All times are UTC.

00:09:35 <-- skeledrew has quit (Ping timeout)
00:11:58 --> skeledrew has joined #instantbird
00:36:33 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
00:37:27 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2b2)
00:37:41 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
00:40:08 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2b2)
01:10:15 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
01:14:54 * skeledrew_dev has installed DOM Inspector
01:16:46 <skeledrew_dev> testing...
01:18:28 <skeledrew> incoming test...
01:18:48 <skeledrew_dev> outgoing test...
01:31:26 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Connection reset by peer)
01:32:02 <skeledrew> not to self: don't use the Inspector's search function...
01:32:08 <skeledrew> *note
01:32:53 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
01:35:39 <skeledrew> incoming test...
01:36:04 <skeledrew_dev> outgoing test...
02:02:12 * Gizmokid2005 is now known as Gizmokid2005|AFK
02:59:13 <-- skeledrew has quit (Ping timeout)
02:59:13 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Ping timeout)
03:01:33 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
03:02:45 --> skeledrew has joined #instantbird
03:33:48 <-- skeledrew has quit (Ping timeout)
03:34:10 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Ping timeout)
03:36:26 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
03:37:23 --> skeledrew has joined #instantbird
04:44:23 <-- flo has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2pre)
06:07:59 <-- skeledrew has quit (Ping timeout)
06:11:17 --> skeledrew has joined #instantbird
06:44:19 <-- skeledrew has quit (Ping timeout)
06:46:54 --> skeledrew has joined #instantbird
06:53:53 --> flo has joined #instantbird
06:53:53 * ChanServ sets mode +qo flo flo 
07:15:27 <-- skeledrew has quit (Ping timeout)
07:15:49 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Ping timeout)
07:21:35 --> Mic has joined #instantbird
07:46:50 --> GeekShadow has joined #instantbird
07:55:15 --> ibbot has joined #instantbird
07:55:58 <-- Mic has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2pre)
07:56:01 <-- ibbot has quit (Client exited)
08:01:46 --> ibbot has joined #instantbird
08:01:55 <-- ibbot has quit (Client exited)
08:03:26 --> ibbot has joined #instantbird
08:03:42 <-- ibbot has quit (Client exited)
08:05:29 --> ibbot has joined #instantbird
08:05:39 <Morian> ibbot: test :)
08:05:41 <ibbot> Morian: Sorry, I've no idea what 'test :)' might be.
08:06:15 <-- ibbot has quit (Quit: I was told to shutdown by Morian. :-( )
08:18:46 --> instantbot has joined #instantbird
08:18:47 topic changed by sand.mozilla.org to "Ask questions about Instantbird here. Official website: http://www.instantbird.com. Latest release: 0.2b2. Read http://blog.instantbird.org/. Nightlies: http://nightly.instantbird.im/ (testing purpose only), IRC logs: http://log.bezut.info/."
08:18:47 * ChanServ sets mode +v instantbot 
08:18:57 <Morian> instantbot: hi
08:18:58 <instantbot> salut Morian
08:20:03 <Morian> instantbot: bug 302
08:20:07 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=302 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Dynamic theme switching
08:20:11 <Morian> :)
08:57:15 --> Mic has joined #instantbird
08:57:29 <Mic> hi
08:57:33 <flo> hi :)
10:21:41 * Mic : Just appeard on Planet Mozilla: "Alex Faaborg - Upcoming workshop: how to create UIs that don't respect OS default designs" :P
10:21:43 <Mic> scnr
10:23:06 <-- GeekShadow has quit (Ping timeout)
10:29:45 <-- Mic has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2pre)
11:32:45 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
11:37:42 <-- Morian has quit (Quit: leaving)
11:37:46 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Ping timeout)
11:38:37 --> Morian has joined #instantbird
11:38:37 * ChanServ sets mode +h Morian 
11:42:13 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
11:45:26 --> clokep_work has joined #instantbird
11:45:29 --> skeledrew has joined #instantbird
11:48:56 <skeledrew> morning
11:49:23 <clokep_work> Good morning skeledrew. I hope everything worked out last night. Couldn't come back on -- no power in the apartment.
11:50:01 * clokep_work reading logs...
11:51:21 <skeledrew> i've been using the DOM Inspector, and have been hitting my head on the wall
11:51:22 <skeledrew> can't see where the convo content is bound to the rest of the window...
11:53:33 <flo> skeledrew: what do you mean by "where the convo content is bound to the rest of the window" ?
11:55:21 <clokep_work> Its part of the convbrowser element I believe is what he's talking about...
11:55:30 <clokep_work> skeledrew: You mean the input box?
11:56:24 <skeledrew> the content DOM is stored in conv.html, the convo window DOM in instantbird.xul
11:56:24 <skeledrew> not seeing where the content is bound to the convo window, and i've done ALOT of tracking via LXR
11:56:49 <skeledrew> ... and the LXR
11:56:58 <skeledrew> *Inspector
11:57:17 <flo> see the convbrowser element
11:57:27 <flo> inside the conversation elements
11:57:35 --> GeekShadow has joined #instantbird
11:58:05 <clokep_work> I think you want the same thing I needed the other  day which flo provided to me: getBrowser().contentDocument
11:58:28 <skeledrew> hmm
11:58:37 <skeledrew> that def looks like it
12:00:52 <skeledrew> but why don't i see it in the DOM Inspector?
12:02:25 <flo> are anonymous elements displayed?
12:02:35 <clokep_work> Its in the DOMi AFAIK, what's under the tab element?
12:02:50 <skeledrew> flo: ?
12:03:00 <flo> are there elements in red in the tree on the left side?
12:03:10 <skeledrew> yes
12:03:21 <flo> ok
12:03:35 <flo> so what are you trying to see exactly?
12:04:28 <skeledrew> the node in instantbird.xul where conv.html is attached
12:10:25 <flo> skeledrew: http://queze.net/goinfre/DOMi.png
12:12:04 <skeledrew> ohhh
12:12:20 <skeledrew> thanks
12:12:26 <flo> you are welcome
12:13:13 <skeledrew> i can do the history thing now. so the "bugs" can be eventually fixed
12:13:16 <skeledrew> :)
12:15:48 * Gizmokid2005|AFK is now known as Gizmokid2005
12:18:27 <-- GeekShadow has quit (Ping timeout)
12:18:44 * clokep_work just realized taht without power last night I probably have lots of bugmail.
12:19:30 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2b2)
12:25:49 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
12:39:06 --> ibbot has joined #instantbird
12:41:41 <clokep_work> So what does ibbot do as opposed to instantbot?
12:42:08 <-- ibbot has quit (Ping timeout)
12:54:58 --> Amfi has joined #instantbird
13:02:59 <Morian> clokep_work: ibbot is the name of instantbot when instantbot is already taken.
13:03:26 <clokep_work> Morian: Why would instantbot already be taken? :P Just if the process gets run twice?
13:03:34 <Morian> There were both because instantbot was moving to a new server and I wanted to check it.
13:03:52 <clokep_work> Got it. Thanks.
13:12:59 <skeledrew_dev> outgoing test...
13:25:24 <clokep_work> skeledrew: You working on history still?
13:25:40 <-- flo has quit (Connection reset by peer)
13:25:56 <skeledrew> yep
13:26:08 <clokep_work> Any luck?
13:26:28 <skeledrew> got some of untested code
13:26:44 <skeledrew> should be almost complete
13:27:17 <clokep_work> :) Awesome. Let me know if you need some testing.
13:27:37 <skeledrew> hopefully it doesn't break too badly when i run it, but it looks pretty logical
13:27:40 <skeledrew> k
13:29:41 --> tymerkaev has joined #instantbird
13:31:11 <skeledrew> i'm actually working in the dark for most part, since i'm not sure of the properties and methods in the events...
13:31:54 <clokep_work> :-\ They can be tough to find sometimes. Which event are you looking at?
13:32:15 <skeledrew> keypress
13:32:39 <skeledrew> or is it key?
13:32:58 <skeledrew> i'll try both
13:34:33 <clokep_work> This page should help: https://developer.mozilla.org/en/Gecko_DOM_Reference
13:34:38 <clokep_work> Scroll down to the "events" section.
13:35:23 <skeledrew> k
13:42:40 --> flo has joined #instantbird
13:42:40 * ChanServ sets mode +qo flo flo 
13:44:21 <flo> bah, it seems that the world collapses during internet outages :-D.
13:46:04 <skeledrew> it doesn't? :)
13:46:41 <flo> the phones still worked.
13:47:03 <skeledrew> oh :)
13:47:05 <flo> It's useful to call in the other buildings of the campus to know if others have the same connectivity issue :-D.
13:47:24 <skeledrew> k
13:47:28 <clokep_work> flo: That's only cause you don't have VoIP phones. ;)
13:47:34 <flo> "Hey, I've no Internet."
13:47:41 <flo> "Well, I don't have it either."
13:47:51 <skeledrew> lol
13:48:13 <flo> clokep_work: I think we do have VoIP phones :-D.
13:48:35 <flo> but somehow, the internal network was still OK (I could still access the front page of the university's public website)
13:48:54 <skeledrew> interesting...
13:49:01 <clokep_work> flo: Ah, sounds like a DNS problem or a gateway issue. We get those at school occasionally.
13:49:18 <clokep_work> Very frustrating when you can't access anything off campus. :(
13:49:47 <flo> DNS isn't so bad, you can use external DNS servers ;)
13:50:23 <clokep_work> flo: Yup, as long as you know the IPs. :) I now keep them saved in my proxy settings hah.
13:50:43 <flo> Google DNS's IP is easy to remember:
13:51:07 <clokep_work> Hm. Good to know. :)
13:52:01 <flo> :)
13:54:51 --> GeekShadow has joined #instantbird
13:55:30 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Ping timeout)
13:56:18 <-- skeledrew has quit (Ping timeout)
13:56:39 --> skeledrew has joined #instantbird
13:57:11 <skeledrew> I HATE POWER OUTAGES!!!
13:57:28 <clokep_work> skeledrew: Me too. Good thing most of the city I live in has no power right now. :(
13:57:39 <skeledrew> k
13:57:43 <clokep_work> (But of course my office does...)
13:57:51 <skeledrew> worse i was on a roll
13:58:08 <flo> I was saying a few minutes ago that internet outages were like the power outages we had 10 years ago :-D
13:58:26 <skeledrew> now i have to rebuild the workspace AND try to get back my train of though :(
13:58:47 <flo> skeledrew: by a laptop next time ;)
13:58:50 <flo> *buy
13:58:58 <skeledrew> that's a definite
13:59:07 <clokep_work> flo: My laptop doesn't have a battery in it. :(
14:00:19 <skeledrew> Notepad++ needs an autosave session feature or something
14:00:36 <clokep_work> It has one, its just not enabled by default.
14:00:43 <clokep_work> Options > Upper right tab I believe.
14:00:54 <skeledrew> AUTOsave?
14:01:05 <clokep_work> Yeah...
14:01:13 <clokep_work> You can set it how often you want to, etc.
14:01:20 <clokep_work> I've never used it though.
14:03:37 <clokep_work> You can also set it to open your previous workspace.
14:03:44 <skeledrew> preferences right? i'm not seeing any
14:03:50 <skeledrew> that i see
14:04:22 <clokep_work> Are you on the newest version?
14:04:33 <skeledrew> but it only works if NPP is closed properly
14:04:42 <skeledrew> hmm
14:04:51 <skeledrew> i don't think so
14:05:22 <skeledrew> i have v5.6.4
14:06:16 <skeledrew> using Ketarin to autoupdate :)
14:06:30 <clokep_work> 5.6.8 is the newest, but I'm sure its just a bug fix.
14:06:44 <skeledrew> k
14:07:10 <clokep_work> Is there a "Backup / Auto-complete" tab in Options?
14:07:12 <skeledrew> hmm
14:07:32 <skeledrew> i wonder if it'd make sense to "addonize" Keratin...
14:07:52 <clokep_work> There also seems to be a N++ addon that does it: http://lifehacker.com/5303634/autosave-adds-reassurance-to-notepad%252B%252B-editing
14:08:33 <clokep_work> But I'm pretty sure its built in "Settings > Preferences > Backup-Auto-completion tab > Click Verbose Backup and Tick Enable Auto-completion on each input  This will time stamp a copy of your file every time you save."
14:10:08 <skeledrew> k
14:16:41 <skeledrew> i can't even remember the last bit of code i typed. and it wasn't saved...
14:29:25 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
14:29:53 <skeledrew_dev> outgoing test...
14:31:46 <skeledrew> incoming test...
15:06:53 <-- tymerkaev has quit (Client exited)
15:39:05 <-- flo has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2pre)
15:50:56 <-- GeekShadow has quit (Quit: The cake is a lie !)
16:16:00 <-- skeledrew has quit (Ping timeout)
16:16:49 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Ping timeout)
16:17:56 --> skeledrew has joined #instantbird
16:19:04 --> GeekShadow has joined #instantbird
16:30:56 --> idechix has joined #instantbird
17:21:28 <-- skeledrew has quit (Connection reset by peer)
17:22:41 --> skeledrew has joined #instantbird
17:24:38 <skeledrew> @##%^ power cuts...
17:29:03 <skeledrew> addon finally seems ready for it's initial test :)
17:29:44 <clokep_work> Awesome! Congrats.
17:29:54 <skeledrew> :)
17:34:02 --> GeekShad0w has joined #instantbird
17:34:35 <-- GeekShadow has quit (Ping timeout)
17:35:02 * skeledrew is trying to setup a package-less install
17:35:43 <clokep_work> That shuold just be making the xpi file?
17:36:00 <skeledrew> no. uncompressed
17:36:17 <skeledrew> using the pointer file
17:36:18 <clokep_work> I'm not sure what you mean, but OK. :)
17:36:24 <clokep_work> Ohhhh.
17:36:24 <skeledrew> lol
17:36:36 <clokep_work> I never use the pointer file, I always just put my code directly in there, I found it easier.
17:36:39 <clokep_work> And less cluttered.
17:36:51 <skeledrew> k
17:37:31 <skeledrew> well, my project folders aren't exactly close to the app itself...
17:38:00 <skeledrew> and my files are organized a certain way
17:38:09 <skeledrew> (at least, i try)
17:38:26 <clokep_work> Fair enough. :) I just don't try haha.
17:38:55 <clokep_work> I never really found a good way to organize code since different environments want it in different places.
17:39:10 <clokep_work> And putting it under my own directly takes a long time to get to on a command line so..
17:40:23 <skeledrew> k
17:40:43 <skeledrew> i don't use much cmd line though
17:41:32 <skeledrew> but my motto is "if it's tiresomely repetitive, script it"...
17:41:37 <clokep_work> I don't much anymore. Used to do a lot through Cygwin...
17:41:44 <skeledrew> oh
17:42:08 --> DetroitLibertyPenguin has joined #instantbird
17:42:22 <clokep_work> or MSYS, but now I mostly use GUI stuff, or have batch files written so its not a big deal. :)
17:42:44 <skeledrew> k
17:42:49 <skeledrew> hmm
17:43:12 <skeledrew> i want to revolutionize it all
17:43:27 <skeledrew> make it all drag-drop
17:43:34 <clokep_work> Instantbird?
17:43:44 <skeledrew> no
17:43:47 <-- DetroitLibertyPenguin has left #instantbird ()
17:43:47 <clokep_work> I don't like D'n'D, too slow. :)
17:44:02 <skeledrew> from GUI design to hardcore coding...
17:44:59 <skeledrew> i want to take (most of) the typing out of programming
17:47:13 <clokep_work> Interesting.
17:47:18 <clokep_work> Sounds like EasyC to me. :)
17:47:21 <clokep_work> Or LabView.
17:48:29 <skeledrew> ?
17:48:31 <skeledrew> hmm
17:48:56 * skeledrew is googling...
17:49:08 --> DetroitLibertyPenguin has joined #instantbird
17:50:50 <clokep_work> skeledrew: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphical_programming
17:53:10 <skeledrew> interesting
17:53:19 <skeledrew> that's the basic idea
17:53:42 <clokep_work> Most of the ones I've ever used are for real-time embedded programming.
17:53:55 <clokep_work> I tend to dislike them. Find them slow to write.
17:54:09 <skeledrew> and it'd be pretty extensible; you'd be able to add nearly any language
17:54:20 <skeledrew> nah
17:54:41 <skeledrew> i've found myself thinking more visually nowadays
17:55:04 <skeledrew> and i was really inspired by XUL
17:55:43 <skeledrew> i think it'd be simpler than those already out there though
17:55:43 <clokep_work> OK.
17:56:13 <skeledrew> i'm thinking of sticking more to tree-style
17:56:22 <skeledrew> still working on the specs :)
17:57:59 <clokep_work> Hmm....OK.
18:02:02 <clokep_work> Hmm...I just found a typo on instantbird.org.
18:02:14 <skeledrew> it'd be a combined code generator, viewer AND converter; i'd be able to program faster and more accurately, i'd be able to view existing code and i'd be able to convert among supported languages...
18:02:40 <clokep_work> That's an awful lot of stuff to put in there. Take a long time to write.
18:04:10 <skeledrew> the engine'd be pretty easy. i'm already halfway or so done
18:04:10 <skeledrew> it's the language implementation that'd be the main challenge. esp for conversion
18:04:26 <clokep_work> Yeah, conversion would be interesting.
18:04:39 <clokep_work> Just bring them all down to ASM and then decompile them out. ;)
18:04:55 <skeledrew> lol
18:04:58 <skeledrew> hmm
18:05:06 <skeledrew> come to think of it
18:05:20 <skeledrew> i do have a decompiler in the making
18:05:37 <clokep_work> I wasn't totally joking when I said that...
18:05:51 <skeledrew> haven't worked on it a while though. but you should see what it does to PE files ;)
18:06:59 <skeledrew> i'm always interested in pulling things apart. esp software...
18:07:30 <clokep_work> Right. My problem is I never seem to finish things.
18:07:39 <skeledrew> mine too
18:08:15 <skeledrew> i've got loads of projects, many of which i've just begun, just sitting around
18:08:36 <skeledrew> most have been there for years
18:08:58 <clokep_work> I know what you mean. :(
18:11:06 <skeledrew> maybe i'll do a refresher on many of them, get a spot on Google Code, SourceForge, etc and open them up. that should keep me motivated and speed things up...
18:11:54 <clokep_work> Yeah. I just keep things on Google Code so I don't lose them. :) But I'm not crazy about Google Code...
18:12:06 <skeledrew> k
18:12:32 <skeledrew> right now, i just want some real web presence
18:12:49 <skeledrew> FB and Twitter don't really count
18:12:58 <clokep_work> Right.
18:13:16 <clokep_work> Go for it. :) Google Code is easy to use. And svn/hg isn't too hard to pick up.
18:13:25 <skeledrew> setup a personal site, maybe a blog, or something
18:13:38 <skeledrew> k
18:16:13 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
18:16:43 * skeledrew wonders if IB will crash horribly on accessing the addon's function
18:17:15 <clokep_work> Its not bad if it crashes, its bad if it takes the computer down too. :)
18:17:15 <skeledrew_dev> testing...
18:17:42 <skeledrew_dev> history
18:17:48 <clokep_work> Well skeledrew_dev is still here...
18:18:20 <skeledrew> yeah
18:18:32 <skeledrew> it installed ok
18:18:42 <skeledrew> but nothing's happening
18:18:49 <skeledrew> hmm
18:19:12 <skeledrew> ohhh
18:19:15 <clokep_work> Error Console
18:19:44 --> flo has joined #instantbird
18:19:45 * ChanServ sets mode +qo flo flo 
18:19:53 <skeledrew> Error Console says there's a single error in my code
18:20:01 <skeledrew> interesting
18:20:09 <skeledrew> almost perfect
18:20:20 <skeledrew> syntax-wise anyway
18:20:49 <clokep_work> Well if its a runtime error there could be errors below it which didn't pop up.
18:21:04 <skeledrew> k
18:21:42 <skeledrew> i put a - instead of = in making the main object. lol
18:22:23 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2b2)
18:23:58 <clokep_work> That would do it.
18:24:11 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
18:24:57 <skeledrew_dev> testing...
18:25:21 <skeledrew_dev> ...
18:25:31 <clokep_work> I need to go. Hopefully I have power at home. :)
18:25:35 <clokep_work> Good luck!
18:25:42 <-- clokep_work has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
18:26:36 <skeledrew_dev> nothing in Error Console. must be a logic error...
18:31:38 <skeledrew_dev> *sighs*
18:31:38 <skeledrew_dev> now how do i debug logic errors in this thing?
18:32:02 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2b2)
18:33:05 <skeledrew> hmm
18:34:59 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
18:35:09 <skeledrew_dev> ...
18:35:16 <skeledrew_dev> testing...
18:36:02 <skeledrew_dev> failure...
18:36:08 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2b2)
18:38:00 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
18:38:33 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2b2)
18:41:57 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
18:47:05 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Connection reset by peer)
18:47:13 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
18:48:29 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Connection reset by peer)
18:49:13 <skeledrew> arrg!
18:49:13 <skeledrew> doesn't DOM Inspector's search function work at all???
18:49:37 --> skeledrew_dev has joined #instantbird
19:02:46 * skeledrew_dev needs a break
19:02:54 <-- skeledrew_dev has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2b2)
19:59:36 * GeekShad0w is now known as GeekShadow
20:04:10 <-- idechix has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2pre)
20:17:21 <-- GeekShadow has quit (Connection reset by peer)
20:18:33 <-- skeledrew has quit (Ping timeout)
20:24:30 --> skeledrew has joined #instantbird
21:15:23 <-- DetroitLibertyPenguin has left #instantbird ()
21:21:32 --> DetroitLibertyPenguin has joined #instantbird
21:36:01 <-- Amfi has quit (Ping timeout)
23:07:18 <-- DetroitLibertyPenguin has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2pre)
23:36:49 --> clokep_ has joined #instantbird
23:37:26 <clokep_> Get it working skeledrew:
23:38:39 <clokep_> flo: This might be a really silly question...but I'm trying to apply styles to elements that are defined in tabbrowser.xml . . . it doesn't seem to work from style sheets, is there something I'm doing wrong?
23:40:19 <clokep_> I'm not very familiar with XBL.
23:43:37 <-- clokep_ has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
23:46:26 --> clokep_ has joined #instantbird
23:52:21 <skeledrew> i took a break. need to go back to the docs
23:55:14 <clokep_> Ah, I see.
23:57:55 <skeledrew> since i don't have a live debugger/tracer, and it doesn't give anything in Error Console or DOMi, i need to know the language better to manually trace it
23:58:33 <clokep_> Venkman
23:59:06 <skeledrew> ?
23:59:16 <clokep_> JavaScript Debugger extension.
23:59:21 * skeledrew is googling
23:59:28 <skeledrew> oh
23:59:35 <clokep_> I'm not sure its built for Instantbird or not though. :-\
23:59:48 <skeledrew> k
23:59:57 <skeledrew> well i'm sure that can be fixed...