#instantbird log on 04 30 2013

All times are UTC.

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00:30:15 <instant-buildbot> build #3 of win32-release-1.4 is complete: Failure [failed shell_3]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/win32-release-1.4/builds/3
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01:57:23 <clv> Dear, when is the deadline for comitting translations for IB 1.4? I'm helping the Brazilian translator and would like to set some priorities for myself.
01:58:17 <clokep> I think it's already passed (it was yesterday IIRC): http://hg.instantbird.org/instantbird/rev/b3c39940a5c1
01:58:26 <clokep> I'm unsure if flo can respin builds with just certain locales.
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03:36:44 <nhnt11|phone> ?
03:36:57 <nhnt11|phone> ^accident, ignore.
03:38:51 <EionRobb> you can't just come into a channel and ? without consequence
03:46:18 <nhnt11|phone> Okay.
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08:29:47 <flo-retina> there were 2 messages in the spam queue for team @ib.org :(
08:30:41 <flo-retina> http://log.bezut.info/instantbird/130430#m15 unless there's a major issue, we won't respin
08:30:53 <flo-retina> (except we haven't successfully built the Windows build yet... :()
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09:53:17 <aleth> nhnt11: Just a thought, have you considered if/how you'd like to also allow searching for channels that have not been visited (based on the IRC /list command)?
09:56:48 <flo-retina> who said yesterday that we were close to sending emails? :)
09:56:56 <flo-retina> someone on the mailing list thinks we aren't close enough yet ;)
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10:25:32 * ChanServ sets mode +qo flo-retina flo-retina 
10:25:53 * flo-retina is on the 1.4 rc
10:25:53 <flo-retina> "Not Today!" and the "Input Placeholder" add-ons aren't compatible
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10:29:10 <aleth> What's the RC url? Can't find it on http://ftp.instantbird.com/instantbird/
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10:45:01 <clokep> aleth: http://ftp.instantbird.com/instantbird/releases/1.4-candidates/
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10:47:31 <aleth> clokep: Thanks! (if you go to the parent dir, you don't see it for some reason)
10:47:41 <clokep> aleth: It's like that on purpose. ;)
10:48:00 <aleth> clokep: Makes sense ;)
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10:50:52 <aleth> No Hide Auto-Joins :-/
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10:51:10 * clokep probably needs to bump his add-ons...
10:51:22 <aleth> Mic too. I have quite a few of his ;)
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10:57:24 <atuljangra> Good <insert Morning/evening/afternoon acc to your time zone> :-)
10:57:34 <aleth> Hi atuljangra :)
10:58:15 <atuljangra> aleth: hey, how are you?
10:58:27 <aleth> Fine, testing the RC ;)
10:58:28 <clokep> OK, all my add-ons that are still being developed are updated.
10:58:58 <atuljangra> aleth: Good luck. :)
10:59:22 <atuljangra> clokep: add-ons for IB?
10:59:24 <aleth> atuljangra: No nasty surprises :)
10:59:35 <clokep> atuljangra: Yes.
10:59:53 <atuljangra> aleth: heh, mostly we have those. ;)
10:59:55 <atuljangra> clokep:  :)
11:00:13 <aleth> atuljangra: Add-on authors have to bump their maxversion to 1.5a1pre now...
11:00:14 * atuljangra opens his book and starts studying.
11:00:23 <aleth> atuljangra: Right, sorry about the one you had last week :-S
11:00:34 <atuljangra> aleth: oh okay.
11:00:41 * aleth wonders if atuljangra will apply for another Gsoc project
11:00:51 <atuljangra> aleth: :( it happens.
11:01:13 <aleth> File transfer would be nice ;)
11:01:54 <aleth> Though then we might never hear from EionRobb again ;)
11:02:15 <atuljangra> aleth: I want to apply, but I've exams :( thus I'm afraid that I won't be able to make good proposal. :(
11:02:35 <atuljangra> aleth: I liked file transfer, is their any bug/wiki for that?
11:02:37 <qlum> I don't even know what the projects are but two things I would find nice are steam chat support (I know its a bitch) and embedding youtube links as video's
11:02:58 <aleth> atuljangra: If you are interested in one of the projects, you should probably go ahead and apply anyway. Nothing to lose...
11:03:47 <atuljangra> *embedding youtube links as video's* seems good. :-) I guess TB had one of those last time.
11:04:02 <atuljangra> aleth: I'll try my best. :)
11:04:04 <aleth> qlum: "embedding links as videos" would be something for an add-on I think.
11:04:20 <qlum> true
11:04:24 <aleth> Mic was experimenting with something like that afaik
11:04:52 <qlum> it would be one of those things where the fact that its based on the same engine as firefox would be useful
11:05:40 <aleth> atuljangra: There's no wiki, and I'm not sure there's a bug
11:05:56 <Even> hi everyone :)
11:06:03 <aleth> Filelink exists in TB of course.
11:06:52 <aleth> The idea is to use Filelink as a fallback if there is no protocol-specific method, so file transfer "always works"
11:07:36 <atuljangra> aleth: okay, so I guess I should look at filelink implementation in TB for the project.
11:07:47 <atuljangra> flo-retina mentors the projects right?
11:07:57 <aleth> Look at the project description first I guess ;)
11:08:02 * atuljangra opens the ideas page and checks.
11:08:08 <atuljangra> aleth: heh :P
11:08:09 <aleth> Yes (though we all try to help where we can)
11:08:45 <clokep> qlum: Steam chat has a JSON API IIRC, so it shouldn't be hard. EionRobb would know more. :)
11:09:10 <qlum> I remember it being the only thing I missed from pidgin
11:09:13 <clokep> FileLink/file transfer would be a good one. :)
11:09:15 <aleth> atuljangra: Part of the project would be to design the infrastructure/backend so there can be different "file transfer providers", and a good UI
11:09:26 <qlum> as steam chat though broken for group chat was a addon for pidgin
11:09:40 <atuljangra> clokep: yes, hoping to apply to that only. :)
11:09:46 <clokep> atuljangra: You should apply, even if it isn't your best application due to time. :)
11:10:06 <clokep> qlum: Ah, cool. :)
11:10:27 <Even> I'm looking into the release candidate distribution failure on Windows...
11:10:43 <Even> And it seems to be out of my scope right now.
11:10:49 <Even> I believe I will need flo to get this right.
11:10:52 <atuljangra> clokep: I'll apply, and irrespective of the fact that I'm selected or not, I'll try to help with File transfer. 
11:11:36 <clokep> :( Hopefully flo can figure it out.
11:11:38 <aleth> atuljangra: mconley (I think) was involved in Filelink for TB, he also hangs out here from time to time
11:12:01 <atuljangra> aleth: which "file transfer providers" are we going to aim at?
11:12:18 <atuljangra> oh, Mike, I'm sure be more than happy to help :)
11:13:00 <aleth> atuljangra: It's up to you I guess, but I think FileLink as a fallback is a must to make it reliable. Other providers could be XMPP, IRC DCC, WebRTC,...
11:13:19 <Even> Looks like a build system error to me.
11:13:23 <atuljangra> aleth: ok cool :-)
11:13:53 <atuljangra> Optimizer: ping :)
11:14:21 <Optimizer> pong ?
11:14:27 <clokep> (Or getting libpurple file transfer API to work with ours)
11:14:55 <atuljangra> Optimizer: you are graduating from IIT Kgp this year?
11:15:52 <Optimizer> no
11:16:36 <atuljangra> you are girish right?
11:16:41 <Optimizer> yes
11:17:38 <atuljangra> ah leave it.
11:18:24 <Optimizer> :)
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11:22:50 <coddler> is there any wiki that lists the various notifications in instantbird ?
11:23:08 <clokep> coddler: https://wiki.instantbird.org/Instantbird:Notifications:trunk ?
11:23:17 <clokep> I can't promise it's fully up to date, etc.
11:23:22 <clokep> What are you trying to figure out?
11:24:33 <coddler> well thanx , I m trying to get notifications for whenever a person joins a new channel 
11:24:50 <coddler> I m trying to workout awesometab 
11:24:59 <clokep> Yeah,  chat-buddy-add should do that.
11:25:01 <clokep> I see.
11:25:49 <coddler> Do u know anybody currently working on awesometab?
11:26:17 <clokep> Are you interested in it for GSoC, I assume?
11:27:03 <clokep> I've heard of one other student interested, yes.
11:28:39 <coddler> Yes I learnt about instantbird thru GSOC , but evn if gsoc doesnt workout for me, I wud like to work with this project 
11:29:45 <clokep> Cool. :)
11:29:58 <coddler> :)
11:30:18 <clokep> I hope you've been enjoying using Instantbird then.
11:30:33 <coddler> ofcourse ... 
11:30:44 <coddler> Installed it a week ago 
11:30:48 <clokep> Let us know if you come across any bugs.
11:30:59 <coddler> sure ..
11:31:04 <coddler> definitely 
11:34:10 <aleth> atuljangra: There is a bug! bug 9 :P
11:34:14 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9 enh, P5, ---, nobody, NEW, Support of file transfers
11:35:02 <aleth> Comments there may be way out of date though
11:38:07 <clokep> And they say nothing about FileLink, I'm sure.
11:38:29 <aleth> Probably the oldest open bug ;)
11:38:43 <clokep> I'm pretty sure it is.
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11:39:00 <dionisos> Hi.
11:39:04 <clokep> Hello dionisos.
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11:39:41 <clokep> Feel free to just ask a question if you have one. :)
11:40:01 <dionisos> I would know if there is a way to save chat on roster with instantbird.
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11:40:31 <aleth> dionisos: "put on hold" from the tab context menu?
11:40:33 <clokep> dionisos: I'm not sure I understand what you mean. The contact list on the server should be updated automatically for all protocols that support it.
11:40:46 <dionisos> thanks clokep
11:41:17 <aleth> Interesting, two completely different interpretations of that request ;)
11:41:29 <dionisos> aleth, something like that, but "put on hold" don’t save the chat for futur session.
11:41:41 <clokep> Ah, I think he means auto-join.
11:41:57 <aleth> dionisos: When you say "chat" you mean "chatroom"?
11:42:07 <dionisos> I will take one minute for ask a better question ^^
11:42:17 <dionisos> yes chatroom, like here.
11:43:05 <aleth> OK, like clokep says, you probably want to add the channel to the auto-join list in the account settings
11:43:41 <aleth> And maybe use the Hide Auto-Joins add-on so when they get joined on startup they are automatically put on hold.
11:45:45 <dionisos> That close of what i want to do, but the problem with auto-join, is that i don’t want to join all my chatroom when i connect, i want more something where you have the chatroom in the roster, and you can double-click on it for join the chatroom. (don’t have to rewrite all the characteristic of the chatroom)
11:46:11 <aleth> dionisos: Therefore the add-on will help.
11:46:41 <aleth> In future we plan an "awesome tab" which may come closer to what you are looking for
11:47:41 <clokep> dionisos: We don't support adding chats to the contact list.
11:48:16 <dionisos> Ok, i searched for a add-on, but i don’t find one that do that, you think of one particularly or it’s possible there isn’t a add-on like that ?
11:48:50 <aleth> The one I mentioned is this one https://addons.instantbird.org/en-US/instantbird/addon/304
11:49:05 <aleth> I don't think there's one that does exactly what you are asking for.
11:49:42 <dionisos> Ok, thanks for your help clokep and aleth.
11:50:57 <aleth> nhnt11: Just a thought, have you considered if/how you'd like to also allow searching for channels that have not been visited (based on the IRC /list command)?
11:51:25 <nhnt11> Hmm
11:51:36 <nhnt11> Is there a similar command for other chatroom-based protocols?
11:51:47 <nhnt11> i've only ever used IRC (for MUC)
11:51:59 <aleth> I don't know
11:52:14 <aleth> XMPP may have one?
11:52:19 <nhnt11> Hmm
11:52:39 <dionisos> I think there is for XMPP.
11:52:46 <nhnt11> I'm not sure if this is 100% related to awesometab though
11:53:02 <nhnt11> Awesometab is all about knowing the user's habits and catering to them, as per my understanding
11:53:08 <nhnt11> But then again it's also about speed
11:53:15 <nhnt11> Well, not speed
11:53:23 * nhnt11 was looking for "convenience"
11:53:23 <clokep> nhnt11: You're wrong in that. ;)
11:53:29 <aleth> Well, if I'm on freenode I may wish to type "python" to see all channels related to python...
11:53:35 <clokep> We meant awesometab to also query the server for information.
11:53:48 <clokep> That probably isn't clear in the description.
11:53:57 <aleth> How else would I find the right channel?
11:54:06 <nhnt11> aleth: do a /list yourself?
11:54:14 <nhnt11> clokep: This adds a bit more depth to the project
11:54:19 <nhnt11> I should update my proposal
11:54:30 * nhnt11 is going to lose quite a bit of sleep this week...
11:54:31 <aleth> nhnt11: That's not user friendly and at the moment not even supported
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11:55:10 <nhnt11> Ah
11:55:19 <nhnt11> True I guess.
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11:55:36 <aleth> nhnt11: Have you even looked for the open bugs on this?
11:55:38 <nhnt11> It should ideally auto-populate the available channels for a server
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11:56:05 <aleth> A quick search finds bug 866, bug 500, bug 1583, bug 900
11:56:08 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=866 min, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Handle /list for IRC
11:56:09 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=500 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Autocomplete / drop down for chat rooms in Join Chat menu
11:56:10 <aleth> There's probably more
11:56:11 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1583 enh, --, ---, nobody, NEW, New conversation tab
11:56:12 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=900 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, "Join chat" dialog to remember previous usage
11:58:00 <aleth> nhnt11: Anyway, you asked for feedback :P
11:58:09 <dionisos> I just begin with instantbird and all seem great, thanks for all your work.
11:58:24 <nhnt11> I didn't realize list was to be a part of the project. I should have, dunno why I overlooked it
11:58:49 <nhnt11> Well, I remember reading about it but somehow didn't think about it when I was writing the proposal
11:59:02 <nhnt11> aleth: Thanks.
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11:59:20 <aleth> nhnt11: np :)
11:59:22 <nhnt11> It's a pretty big discrepancy, considering it was supposed to be part of the project idea.
11:59:46 <nhnt11> Well, the more code, the merrier ;)
11:59:58 <aleth> Looking through the bugs related to join chat, list, etc should help (start with those above)
12:01:09 <aleth> Of course many of those are just random ideas that were filed at one point, so don't assume you have to follow everything that's in them for your proposal!
12:01:11 <coddler> guys sorry to intervene , but whats the best javascript debugger that works with instantbird ?
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12:02:40 <clokep> coddler: There really isn't one.
12:02:57 <coddler> so how do u guys debug javascript ?
12:03:06 <nhnt11> aleth: I've looked through a few
12:03:15 <clokep> nhnt11: "The current "Join Chat" dialog is ugly and difficult to use. A user should be able to open a new tab to create a new conversation which will auto-complete fields based on history and server information (e.g. LIST from IRC). "
12:03:25 <nhnt11> But since awesometab will replace "Join chat", I didn't think look at the current bugs much
12:03:37 <nhnt11> clokep: Yes, as I said I remember reading it but overlooked it in my proposal
12:04:07 <clokep> coddler: I usually put in debug statements, etc. I don't know of anything that will let you add break points, etc.
12:04:21 <aleth> nhnt11: The current bugs may help to give you a sense of the scope of the issues the new feature should address. Probably less useful on actual implementation ideas (as none of the bugs have been worked on yet)
12:04:54 <aleth> clokep, coddler: maybe one day if we support the built-in debugger from FF ;)
12:05:13 <aleth> coddler: The easiest is to add dump statements or print to the error console.
12:05:37 <aleth> You probably have to set some prefs too
12:06:17 <aleth> https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Debugging_a_XULRunner_Application
12:06:43 <coddler> aleth: thnx for that 
12:07:09 <coddler> clokep: Thnx 
12:07:24 <nhnt11> aleth: Yes well, I can't list all the current bugs and say I'll fix this, I'll fix this, etc etc. in the proposal, can I? :P
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12:08:24 <aleth> nhnt11: It's not about fixing those individual bugs, it's about coming up with a proposal that fixes the underlying problems (or is an approach that could be extended to address those problems)
12:08:36 <nhnt11> I understand.
12:08:44 <nhnt11> Never mind, I phrased that very badly
12:09:00 <aleth> So if there are lots of bugs by people frustrated by something, it is useful to know ;)
12:09:06 <aleth> Use cases :D
12:09:16 <nhnt11> Basically, I should also include a bit about why the current Join Chat *needs* to be replaced
12:09:19 <aleth> (or I think "user stories" as they say these days ;) )
12:09:24 <nhnt11> That's what you're saying right?
12:10:00 <clokep> nhnt11: Yes.
12:10:08 <clokep> Why it suck sand we can create a better UX.
12:10:28 <nhnt11> Alright. I'm on it.
12:10:43 <nhnt11> clokep: Can I just link to a screenshot of it and say "See for yourself?" :P
12:10:53 <clokep> :P
12:11:32 <aleth> nhnt11: :D
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12:13:03 <coddler> aleth, clokep: venkman isn't compatible with IB , right?
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12:16:17 <clokep> coddler: Venkman isn't compatible with anything anymore, I think. ;)
12:16:42 <clokep> (But no, we don't build it anymore.)
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12:17:01 <coddler> clokep: okk :)
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12:26:12 <flo-retina> aleth: don't get started with "user stories" :-P
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12:31:15 * aleth sets up trello board, runs :P
12:32:39 <flo-retina> aleth: come on!
12:33:51 <flo-retina> so for that Windows build, should we just try again?
12:34:15 <clokep> flo-retina: Do we know the issue?
12:34:16 <flo-retina> Even doesn't seem to be debugging anything on it; and my understand is that Windows's file system is unreliable
12:34:33 <flo-retina> clokep: a file that's on the disk doesn't exist, according to the error message
12:34:45 <clokep> Hmm...
12:34:51 <clokep> Let's try again if we have no other ideas, yeah.
12:35:03 <flo-retina> or maybe the path is wrong (if it's reproduceable all the time; but I don't see why we wouldn't have the same error for nightlies in that case...)
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12:35:38 <flo-retina> trying again from scratch is frustrating, as it's going to take ~5 hours :(
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12:55:57 <aleth> I hope it's not the first signs of a decaying HD :-/
12:57:43 <flo-retina> aleth: I don't think so, it's a large raid array ;)
12:57:45 <clokep> aleth: Thanks for "volunteering" to do handle the mailing lists. :)
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12:57:57 <aleth> flo-retina: :)
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12:58:13 <aleth> clokep: No worries, I check them from time to time anyway
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12:58:31 <clokep> :)
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13:32:30 <clokep> Anything #instantbird needs me to do before my flight tonight? Now is the time to ask.
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13:33:48 <atuljangra> clokep: Where are you flying? :)
13:33:48 <aleth> clokep: Maybe write one of your excellent release blog posts? ;)
13:33:54 <flo-retina> We are not releasing today.
13:34:01 * atuljangra ^^ yay.
13:34:12 * atuljangra oops, that went wrong :-/
13:34:21 <flo-retina> The issue causing the build to fail on Windows also exists on Linux/Mac. The complete.mar files for Linux/Mac are full of junk.
13:34:23 <aleth> flo-retina: Wordpress allows to save drafts ;)
13:34:39 <flo-retina> I need to debug l10n repackaging
13:34:41 <clokep> :(
13:34:47 <flo-retina> and I clearly don't have time for that this afternoon
13:34:49 <clokep> atuljangra: Europe.
13:34:51 <aleth> ouch :(
13:35:07 <atuljangra> clokep: Awesome, have fun :-)
13:35:18 <clokep> Thanks.
13:35:19 <flo-retina> clokep: it could be useful if we finished preparing the release notes / web site changes, to give an opportunity to translators to translate them before we release
13:35:26 <flo-retina> I'm not saying you have to do it though :)
13:35:46 <clokep> I'll see what I can do.
13:35:50 * clokep is half working too.
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13:39:26 <qheaden> clokep: ping
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13:44:54 <clokep> qheaden: pong
13:45:51 <qheaden> clokep: Hey there. I'm working on my new proposal, and I have a question about protocol plug-ins writing messages.
13:46:38 <qheaden> clokep: When the writeMessage function is called, does it accept string stuff only, or can it take raw data?
13:46:48 <clokep> qheaden: One second. On the phone.
13:46:52 <qheaden> Sure.
13:46:57 <clokep> (I shouldn't have ponged yet. ;))
13:47:04 <qheaden> :)
13:49:01 <aleth> qheaden: What do you mean by "raw data"?
13:49:51 <clokep> qheaden: http://lxr.instantbird.org/instantbird/source/chat/modules/jsProtoHelper.jsm#429
13:50:01 <clokep> aWho, aText are strings, aProperties is a JS object.
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13:50:36 <aleth> You may want to take a look at the Message object
13:51:02 <aleth> e.g. http://lxr.instantbird.org/instantbird/source/chat/modules/jsProtoHelper.jsm#310
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13:52:16 <aleth> Or better, the idl http://lxr.instantbird.org/instantbird/source/chat/components/public/prplIMessage.idl#22
13:52:52 <qheaden> Basically, I was wondering how I would send stuff like a hex value over the wire to a messaging service.
13:53:56 <aleth> A protocol plugin, internally, can send whatever it wants. The prplIMessages however are what the UI eventually receives (for example)
13:54:02 <clokep> qheaden: "writeMessage" is how the UI interacts with the prpl (so the UI also has strings), the socket can send whatever it wants and is totally handled by code you would write.
13:54:35 <qheaden> Ah okay.
13:54:53 <aleth> The interface you might be looking for is imSockets.jsm
13:55:42 <aleth> Well, interface is the wrong word, but that's the code the JS prpls use
13:55:55 <qheaden> Thanks.
13:56:16 <aleth> sorry, socket.jsm
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13:57:22 <qheaden> I see an example of this with xmpp-session.jsm.
13:57:58 <aleth> Right.
14:03:59 <qheaden> clokep: Does the current implementation of Yahoo! messenger support multi-user chats? 
14:04:11 <qheaden> I forget if Yahoo! Messenger even supports that natively.
14:04:16 <clokep> qheaden: Yes.
14:04:22 <qheaden> Okay.
14:05:44 <qheaden> Also, do these protocol plug-ins have any unit tests? I don't seem to see any.
14:06:27 <aleth> We have less than we'd like and should have
14:06:59 <aleth> But see e.g. chat/protocols/irc/test
14:07:09 <qheaden> Okay. Thanks.
14:07:56 * clokep hates creating localized files.
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14:09:03 <clokep> Anyone have the etherpad with the 1.4 release notes? (aleth?)
14:09:26 <aleth> clokep: https://etherpad.mozilla.org/ib-1-4-release-notes
14:09:33 <clokep> aleth: Thanks. :)
14:09:50 <clokep> Anything else we should add? Last chance.
14:10:10 <clokep> aleth: "Windows 8! Missing from the OS list apparently" What does tha tmean? Where is this list?
14:11:19 <aleth> Someone reported that here I think.
14:11:26 <qheaden> clokep: So Yahoo! Messenger has text chat, multi-user text chat, and is there anything else that needs to be implemented in the new plug-in?
14:11:40 <clokep> qheaden: Contact handling.
14:11:53 <qheaden> forgot to mention it, but I've got that down as well.
14:11:57 <flo-retina> "    You can now override invalid/out-of-date certificates for IRC, GTalk and Facebook accounts."
14:12:05 <flo-retina> does it make any sense for gtalk/facebook?
14:12:13 <clokep> No. :)
14:12:30 <flo-retina> and it was already possible before, the new thing about this is that it's now easy :)
14:12:31 <clokep> qheaden: That's pretty much all I can think of then...
14:12:51 <aleth> qheaden: maybe have a look at any open yahoo bugs?
14:12:53 <qheaden> Does the midterm evaluation for GSoC depend on the number of features implemented at the time?
14:12:59 <flo-retina> I changed the line to "    You can now easily override self-signed/invalid/out-of-date certificates for IRC servers."
14:13:22 <aleth> clokep: I can't find that list either :-S
14:13:22 <clokep> qheaden: It depends on what you put on your schedule and if we feel you've accomplished them. Of course if you run into unforeseen roadblocks, that can be taken into account.
14:13:25 <clokep> flo-retina: Looks good.
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14:13:40 <qheaden> clokep: Okay, so I'll space out my schedule a little more.
14:14:43 <clokep> OK.
14:14:58 <clokep> Ideally you'd want to develop it in such a way that some things work initially, it's not an "all or nothing" approach.
14:15:20 <aleth> clokep: We must have a list of system requirements somewhere though...?
14:15:38 <clokep> aleth: Yes, but I can't find it. :-/
14:15:48 <flo-retina> qheaden: midterm evaluation depends mostly on the mentor's impression that the student is working correctly / as announced.
14:15:58 <aleth> I've been clicking around the website in vain too :-S
14:16:07 <qheaden> clokep: Okay. My plan is to first implement authentication and log-in support (of course), and then implement contact handling. Next, I will work on the actual text chatting.
14:16:20 <qheaden> flo-retina: Ah okay. That makes sense.
14:16:22 <flo-retina> aleth: http://www.instantbird.com/system-requirements.html
14:17:01 <aleth> flo-retina: Thanks. Do you recall where it is linked from?
14:17:14 <clokep> flo-retina: Do we still use the "update-1.x.php" pages?
14:17:53 <aleth> (I was expecting it to be linked from here http://www.instantbird.com/download-all.html)
14:17:58 <flo-retina> aleth: http://www.instantbird.com/en/faq.html#systreq
14:18:08 <flo-retina> clokep: unfortunately, yes
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14:18:39 <dionisos> Is there any language pack for french ?
14:18:51 <flo-retina> why would you want one?
14:19:04 <flo-retina> (there's a French version)
14:19:12 <dionisos> For translation.
14:19:15 <aleth> dionisos: http://www.instantbird.com/download-all.html
14:20:16 * clokep has everything done except the release notes for the website now.
14:21:33 <flo-retina> clokep: you mean writing the PHP code for it?
14:21:36 <dionisos> I would have french and english in the list for spell-checking. (not sure if language pack can help for this)
14:21:51 <clokep> flo-retina: Yes.
14:21:56 <flo-retina> dionisos: so you want a dictionary
14:21:58 <clokep> dionisos: I think you need the dictionary.
14:21:59 <flo-retina> dionisos: not a lang pack
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14:22:21 <dionisos> Ok, thanks flo-retina, i will look for that.
14:23:03 <flo-retina> clokep: don't bother with the PHP if you have more important stuff to do today :)
14:23:17 <flo-retina> all you've already done is already very helpful :)
14:23:30 <flo-retina> (is there a blog post draft somewhere already?)
14:23:49 <clokep> No.
14:26:09 <dionisos> I don’t find french dictionary.
14:26:31 <qlum> I assumed the dictionaries would be introduced with the language packs as I am personally kind of looking forward to having the ability not to see red underlines in the chat's that are in Dutch.
14:26:39 <instantbot> New Websites - www.instantbird.com bug 1952 filed by clokep@gmail.com.
14:26:41 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1952 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Update website for 1.4
14:26:48 * clokep wanted somewhere to put that patch.
14:27:03 <aleth> qlum, dionisos: Dictionaries are basically add-ons. https://addons.instantbird.org/en-US/instantbird/browse/type:3
14:27:09 <clokep> qlum: You should be able to get ones from Firefox to install?
14:27:19 <flo-retina> https://addons.instantbird.org/en-US/instantbird/browse/type:3 seems very incomplete :(
14:27:20 <aleth> Sadly it seems noone has provided a French or Dutch one yet
14:27:21 <qlum> hmm how exactly
14:27:30 <aleth> Maybe you can make one from the FF one and upload it? :)
14:27:50 <flo-retina> aleth: ideally they would just work, if they are compatible with toolkit rather than firefox :)
14:28:11 <clokep> I think Mic filed a bug abou tthat, in fact. ;)
14:28:19 <aleth> flo-retina: Probably just a matter of putting in the IB app id then :)
14:29:23 <aleth> qlum: This may help, though I haven't ever looked at how dictionaries are packaged https://wiki.instantbird.org/Instantbird:Porting_Firefox_Extensions
14:29:30 <clokep> aleth: Would you have time to take a screenshot of the new log viewer?
14:29:45 <clokep> And maybe attach it to that bug I just filed.
14:29:58 <aleth> What bug did you just file? ;)
14:30:04 <clokep> And then...I'm going to say I'm "done" with the release notes...go iron a few things and then write the blog post?
14:30:07 <aleth> scratch that
14:30:15 <clokep> :P bug 1952!
14:30:19 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1952 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, Update website for 1.4
14:30:43 * flo-retina wonders what http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/browser/base/content/browser.js#1366 does, and if we need it because we have http://lxr.instantbird.org/instantbird/source/instantbird/content/instantbird.js#25
14:31:20 <clokep> You think we're leaking?
14:31:23 <flo-retina> clokep: do we usually have screenshots in release notes?
14:31:33 <clokep> flo-retina: I'd like one for the blog post. :P
14:31:44 <flo-retina> clokep: not sure. Maybe just causing things to not be garbage/cycle collected quickly enough.
14:31:53 <aleth> clokep: You don't want one from Windows? ;)
14:32:03 <clokep> aleth: I don't have time to make one pretty. :)
14:32:09 <clokep> (And you know the features better than me.)
14:32:33 <qlum> wow its really easy to get it to work
14:32:42 <qlum> actually you don't even have to port it
14:32:58 <qlum> just download and install like its an instantbird addon
14:33:27 <aleth> Looks like flo was right then :)
14:34:03 <aleth> qlum: Still, we should upload the missing ones to AIO.
14:34:06 <qlum> only problem with downloading is that firefox auto detects it as something it needs to install
14:35:14 <clokep> Didn't we release right before last time I traveled too? :-S
14:35:28 <aleth> flo-retina: I am surprised they call destroy() on the XULbrowser manually, wouldn't the destructor trigger that anyway?
14:36:08 <flo-retina> aleth: a destructor for a JS object?
14:36:17 <flo-retina> clokep: I don't remember :-|
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14:36:46 <aleth> flo-retina: isn't A XULBrowser an XBL? T\hey have destructors...
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14:36:57 <flo-retina> aleth: no
14:37:37 <aleth> Oh, I see, https://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/browser/base/content/browser.js#3587
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14:42:06 <clokep> flo-retina: We should try to sit down in the next couple weeks and go over the SIPE stuff. :-\[(
14:42:27 <flo-retina> yes!
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14:46:52 <coddler> flo-retina, clokep: could you tell me why IB stores the chat history in json and for how long in the profiles folder?
14:48:51 <flo-retina> why not json? It does not expire (will be kept forever unless you delete files yourself)
14:53:25 <coddler> flo-retina: let me reframe , why IB stores chat history (doesn't matter if its in json or not), I mean is there any feature which uses the chat history ? 
14:53:46 <clokep> coddler: The log viewer, which lets you view old chats.
14:54:37 <coddler> clokep: where is the log viewer , I cannot locate it 
14:55:56 <clokep> coddler: Right click on a conversation "Show logs"
14:56:31 <coddler> clokep: found it thnx ...
14:56:32 <clokep> aleth: I have a vague draft, anything else we should add?
14:57:38 <coddler> clokep: can u tell me , does IB use the sqlite db to store something 
14:57:40 <coddler> ?
14:57:44 <flo-retina> clokep: some vacation pictures? :)
14:58:00 <flo-retina> coddler: the contact list is stored using sqlite
15:00:11 <coddler> flo-retina: where are the configured account info stored , db or files 
15:01:43 <clokep> flo-retina: Maybe. I don't usually make that stuff public. ;)
15:02:02 <flo-retina> clokep: you can label it "work week in Paris" :-D
15:02:14 <flo-retina> if we do get 3 Instantbird people in the same place :)
15:02:21 <clokep> Haha.
15:04:08 <aleth> clokep: Screenshots added
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15:05:45 <aleth> Feel free to improve the cropping etc ;)
15:06:20 <qheaden> clokep: I've gotta sign off now. Thanks for the help. I sent you an email about my new proposal.
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15:07:40 <clokep> qheaden: Good luck. :)
15:08:00 <qheaden> :)
15:11:03 <coddler> clokep: can u tell me where are the accounts info stored , sqlite db or file ?
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15:11:21 <clokep> coddler: It's in the pref system.
15:12:10 <coddler> clokep: thnx , so only contacts are stored in sqlite?
15:12:21 <clokep> coddler: I think so.
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15:13:08 <coddler> clokep: one last q, previously visited channels are stored anywhere?
15:15:21 <aleth> clokep: Not at the moment (unless you scrape the log directories for the info)
15:15:42 <aleth> coddler^^
15:16:01 * nhnt11|phone has to study electronics instead of fixing up his proposal :(
15:16:03 <coddler> aleth: Thnx for that :) 
15:16:43 <coddler> clokep: appreciate ur help, Thnx :)
15:18:40 <clokep> coddler: No problem.
15:19:15 <Ain3> aleth: hi. the last time i were here we were talking about not displayed twitter messages on thunderbird, remember?
15:19:26 <aleth> Ain3: Yes, I remember
15:20:56 * clokep forgets whether http://blog.instantbird.org/?p=545&preview=true is viewable to the public or not.
15:21:15 <Ain3> the problem is still there and while testing IB i noticed the same problem but not as often as on tb
15:21:28 <aleth> Doesn't look like it
15:21:34 <aleth> ^^clokep 
15:23:03 <aleth> Ain3: Do you have a debug log of a session during which you noticed a tweet was missing?
15:23:24 <clokep> Thanks aleth.
15:23:29 <aleth> Is the order obvious (i.e. can you spot two messages between which there should be a tweet, but isn't)?
15:23:32 <clokep> Well I'm mostly done with that, you can publish it once it's time?
15:24:12 <aleth> clokep: I don't seem to have the rights to view it even from wordpress
15:24:19 <clokep> :(
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15:24:28 <aleth> But no doubt flo can push it on release.
15:24:46 <clokep> Florian can do it.
15:24:51 <clokep> Yeah, we're both admins.
15:25:28 <aleth> Ain3: Basically what would be great would be a debug log of the twitter account, just after you notice a missing tweet, and especially if you can spot between which tweets it should have appeared
15:26:19 <Ain3> i ve got screenshots of some missing tweets but not the matching debug log 
15:26:31 <aleth> Ain3: Do you have a large number of followed people?
15:26:50 <aleth> Ain3: Please do file a bug on https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/ and attach what you have :)
15:27:23 <aleth> Ain3: Do the same tweets go missing in both TB and IB?
15:28:29 <Ain3> if 75 is a large number than yes 
15:29:25 <Ain3> if a tweet is missing on IB than its also missing on TB but somethimes its only missing ob TB and not on IB
15:29:33 <aleth> Ain3: That shouldn't be a large number
15:29:48 * clokep follows 109. ;)
15:31:08 <aleth> Ain3: Are these all tweets @-directed at you?
15:31:39 <aleth> Or @-directed at other people you follow? or don't follow? Or just plain tweets?
15:33:50 <Ain3> the first time i noticed was @directed towards me, but that was only one time i noticed, other times i noticed they were plain tweets without @
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15:43:19 <clokep> Anyone know if there are issues about studying GPL code and "reimplementing" under a different license?
15:45:01 <aleth> Ain3: Btw those screenshots might be useful too, you can also attach them to the bug
15:47:05 <aleth> gtg
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16:10:05 * flo-retina wondered if the missing tweets bug could be the "messages no longer displayed after detaching a tab" bug
16:18:39 <flo-retina> the fading on the screenshot should be to transparent, not to white (ignore this if it's just Firefox's built-in image viewer that sucks :))
16:18:46 <flo-retina> and no, I have no idea how one does that :-/
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16:26:24 * clokep is trying to answer the "What's next?" part of the blog post.
16:26:27 <clokep> Any ideas?
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16:27:33 <flo-retina> vacations ?
16:27:35 <flo-retina> :-P
16:27:53 <clokep> :P
16:28:03 * clokep mentioned GSoC 2013 already
16:28:28 <flo-retina> you mean GSoC is vacations? :-o
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16:31:56 <clokep> Something like that, sure.
16:32:45 <flo-retina> I suspect some students may disagree :)
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16:40:20 <instantbot> New Core - Twitter bug 1953 filed by Bunny-_-@web.de.
16:40:22 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1953 nor, --, ---, nobody, UNCO, Missing Twitter Messages
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18:55:51 <clokep> Well goodbye #instantbird! I'll check in on my phone when I can. :)
18:55:54 <clokep> Good luck with the release.
18:56:01 <clokep> I left a draft blog post which should be "mostly" done.
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22:38:56 * ChanServ sets mode +qo flo-retina flo-retina 
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