#instantbird log on 05 11 2012

All times are UTC.

00:01:34 <instant-buildbot> build #252 of linux-onCommit is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/linux-onCommit/builds/252
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01:26:02 <instant-buildbot> build #220 of macosx-onCommit is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/macosx-onCommit/builds/220
01:33:44 <instant-buildbot> build #241 of win32-onCommit is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/win32-onCommit/builds/241
02:17:44 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com requested feedback from florian@instantbi rd.org for attachment 1460 on bug 1409.
02:17:46 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1409 nor, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Handle (dis)connects better in IRC
02:25:31 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com cancelled review?(clokep@gmail.com) for attachment 1449 on bug 1308.
02:25:32 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com granted review for attachment 1461 on bug 1308.
02:25:33 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1308 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, "Adding a chat buddy twice" errors (JS-IRC sending bad chat-buddy-add notifications)
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02:59:10 <instant-buildbot> build #492 of linux-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/linux-nightly-default/builds/492
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04:41:11 <instant-buildbot> build #586 of win32-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/win32-nightly-default/builds/586
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06:03:05 <instant-buildbot> build #479 of macosx-nightly-default is complete: Success [build successful]  Build details are at http://buildbot.instantbird.org/builders/macosx-nightly-default/builds/479
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08:26:54 <aleth> clokep: Why don't you want the Components constant to be the same in all files it is defined? I had assumed it was an oversight...
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09:03:58 <Mic|web> aleth: are there other references to the unread ruler code in tabbrowser than the one that bug 1380 would introduce and http://lxr.instantbird.org/instantbird/source/instantbird/content/tabbrowser.xml#2080 ?
09:04:02 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1380 min, --, ---, aletheia2, ASSI, Unread ruler confusing when coming back to conversation with no new messages
09:04:24 <Mic|web> (I couldn't find any)
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09:09:14 <aleth> Mic|web: no
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09:11:39 <Mic|web> OK, good. Do you think it's possible to restrict the unread ruler code to the convbrowser?
09:12:08 <aleth> The code is restricted to the convbrowser, just triggering it can't be, as far as I can see.
09:12:20 <aleth> It responds to window and tab events, not browser events.
09:13:09 <Mic|web> Changing to a different tab and unfocusing the window might be possible to treat similarly when using the page visibility API? (If it works for us at all?)
09:13:58 <aleth> But unfocusing the browser doesn't tell you enough.
09:14:11 <aleth> Unless I missed some API feature of course...
09:15:36 <aleth> Setting the unread ruler also responds to tab attributes, so it seemed the natural way to do it.
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09:17:35 <Mic|web> OK.
09:20:53 <aleth> I guess you could set suitable event listeners from convbrowser too, by figuring out which window/tab the browser lives in etc. But doesn't that seem less clean (more duplication too)
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09:27:32 <flo> hello :)
09:28:51 <meh> hi :>
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09:42:54 <instantbot> benediktp@ymail.com cancelled review?(benediktp@ymail.com ) for attachment 1371 on bug 1380.
09:42:55 <instantbot> benediktp@ymail.com cancelled review?(benediktp@ymail.com ) for attachment 1406 on bug 1380.
09:42:56 <instantbot> benediktp@ymail.com granted review for attachment 1462 on bug 1380.
09:42:57 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1380 min, --, ---, aletheia2, ASSI, Unread ruler confusing when coming back to conversation with no new messages
09:45:07 <FeuerFliege> flo: is there any way I can help to figure out why twitter doesn’t open the OAuth window in Thunderbird
09:45:14 <FeuerFliege> ?
09:45:26 <flo> FeuerFliege: can you consistently reproduce?
09:45:43 <FeuerFliege> I cannot _not_ reproduce
09:45:50 <flo> ah
09:46:17 <flo> which other IM accounts do you have configured in Thunderbird? I'm assuming at least IRC
09:46:55 <FeuerFliege> I have facebook and IRC in my normal profile, but i tried it with a fresh profile, too.
09:47:10 <FeuerFliege> i never saw the window, I tried new profile, daily and earlybird, in de and en-US.
09:47:16 <flo> so it doesn't work even if you have only a twitter account and nothing else?
09:47:22 <FeuerFliege> yes
09:47:35 <flo> nothing else meaning not even an imap or pop3 account?
09:48:28 <FeuerFliege> in the fresh profile there was nothing but the twitter test account. In my normal profile i have a news-account, several IMAP mail accounts and some RSS feeds
09:49:01 <flo> ok
09:49:17 <flo> you still have the fresh profile around?
09:49:50 <FeuerFliege> yes
09:50:10 <flo> can you set purple.debug.loglevel to 1 in about:config? Then switch to offline (with the icon in the status bar) and back online, and try to connect the twitter account immediately after that.
09:50:15 <flo> is there anything in the error console?
09:50:47 <FeuerFliege> one moment
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09:56:25 <FeuerFliege> flo: no errors :(
09:56:44 <flo> I'm not interested only in errors
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09:56:58 <flo> is there an HTTP request made by the twitter account? Does it receive a reply?
09:59:06 <FeuerFliege> flo: should that be mentioned in the error console? I there are no new entries at all.
09:59:35 <flo> you are sure you have set the pref purple.debug.loglevel to 1 in about:config?
09:59:49 <flo> and you are on the tab "All" in the error console?
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10:04:37 <FeuerFliege> fresh start: I started with new profile, looked in error console, set purple.debug.loglevel to 1, created twitter account, went offline then online, tried to connect twitter, no new entries
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10:06:09 <FeuerFliege> i used the latest en-US Daily
10:06:26 <flo> what's displayed in the account manager?
10:07:20 <FeuerFliege> it is like the top image attached to the bug https://bug735688.bugzilla.mozilla.org/attachment.cgi?id=607504
10:08:01 <flo> that seems impossible
10:08:45 <FeuerFliege> why?
10:08:48 <flo> ah, we use the http.jsm from mail/ :(
10:09:24 <flo> which doesn't log anything
10:09:26 <flo> pff :(
10:14:13 <FeuerFliege> flo: procmon tells me that thunderbird connects to foobar.twttr.com
10:15:09 <flo> that's probably an alternative hostname for api.twitter.com
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10:20:46 <clokep> Mic: If just the line #s are wrong it should search for an offset.
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10:23:40 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org denied review for attachment 1460 on bug 1409.
10:23:41 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org cancelled feedback?(florian@instantbi rd.org) for attachment 1460 on bug 1409.
10:23:49 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1409 nor, --, ---, clokep, ASSI, Handle (dis)connects better in IRC
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10:26:23 <clokep> Confused about what to do w/ the feedback flag? :P
10:26:57 <flo> confused about why you requested it in the first place :-P
10:29:01 <clokep> I wasn't sure I had covered all the bases, so I was looking less for a code review and more for a functional review.
10:33:06 <flo> ok :)
10:33:13 <flo> is the feedback I wrote what you expected? :)
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10:35:15 <clokep> Yes.
10:37:11 <clokep> Thanks
10:39:55 <clokep> aleth: I don't think I marked your other patch as checkin-needed either...
10:42:42 <aleth> Which other patch?
10:43:22 <aleth> Ah, bug 1308
10:43:25 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1308 nor, --, ---, aletheia2, ASSI, "Adding a chat buddy twice" errors (JS-IRC sending bad chat-buddy-add notifications)
10:44:01 <clokep> Yeah.
10:47:36 <aleth> So, 19 1.2-wanted bugs left, of which 7 or so have patches waiting.
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10:51:11 <Mic|web> 19 is the total number for both wanted and blocking, btw
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11:37:33 <aleth> http://hotot.org another new client
11:38:14 <aleth> (Twitter only I think)
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11:49:05 <clokep_work> Nothing on that page makes it jump out at me, what makes it unique, etc.
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11:49:25 <flo> the name maybe? :-P
11:52:27 <clokep_work> Well it is good to have a unique name. :)
12:06:22 <flo> I'm very close to r+'ing wnayes' patch. I have a few comments to write for the current patch, but they are all trivial, so the next iteration is likely to have no more comment from me.
12:08:16 <clokep_work> :) Awesome.
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12:11:37 <instantbot> bugi@media.fjmail.de set the Resolution field on bug 824 to FIXED.
12:11:43 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=824 enh, --, ---, nobody, RESO FIXED, Finetune Aero theme
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12:22:19 <flo> clokep_work: do you like the strings?
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12:32:51 <flo> clokep_work: "Here are some of the popular protocols for your region." were you happy with mentioning the region, or did you want to rephrase that?
12:34:02 <flo> "Show all available protocols" Would it be better to talk about "supported protocols" rather than "available protocols"?
12:36:07 <aleth> Simplify to "Show all protocols" and then be explicit in the description?
12:36:45 <flo> "List all of the currently installed account protocols" Would "Choose from the full list of supported protocols" be better? (almost all the other descriptions start with a verb of an action performed by the user (talk, chat, stay up to date, ...)
12:38:36 <aleth> He probably thought "full list of supported protocols" was incorrect, as there is a "Get more" link, and what does it do if not allow you to add more supported protocols?
12:39:12 <flo> they aren't supported yet if you need to install a plugin for them
12:39:31 <flo> but yes, that may be the reason why he used the word "installed"
12:39:33 <aleth> I think that's open to misunderstandings
12:39:42 <flo> but it's strange to talk about installed protocols if you haven't installed an prpl as an add-on yet
12:39:52 <aleth> Yes, installed isn't the best word
12:40:26 <flo> "Choose from a longer list including less popular options" ? :-D
12:40:27 <aleth> "Choose from the complete list of available protocols"?
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12:40:50 <flo> aleth: if there's an add-on for it, it's available ;)
12:41:09 <aleth> Yes, just trying to keep it simple.
12:41:23 <aleth> "Choose from the complete list of protocols"?
12:42:18 <aleth> And then the user will still see "get more" on the next page, which will make clear there are add-ons... But at this first step why complicate matters
12:43:00 <Mic|web> + "Get more..." -> "Get even more..."?
12:44:08 <aleth> "Choose from the full list of currently available protocols"?
12:44:27 <Mic|web> That sounds good.
12:44:32 <flo> Mic|web: it's currently phrased "Show all [blahblah]" so "Get even more" may be confusing. I would agree if we used "Get more" on the previous step though :)
12:45:53 <flo> aleth: ok, let's break it down to simple parts. Do you prefer "full list" or "complete list"? :)
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12:46:23 <flo> the suggestion I currently have in the comment box is: "Show all protocols" and "Choose from the full list of supported protocols"
12:46:36 <aleth> flo: It makes no difference, whatever flows better in the whole sentence
12:47:08 <aleth> I think those suggestions are good
12:47:48 <aleth> supported vs available is probably bikeshedding
12:48:13 <flo> vs installed
12:48:14 <flo> yes
12:48:56 <aleth> I think you're right about "installed" being less ideal, despite being more precise.
12:48:57 <flo> or maybe just "Choose from the full list of protocols"
12:49:18 <aleth> That would do as well.
12:49:38 <aleth> It's not like the user expects unsupported protocols ;)
12:53:46 <flo> should we drop "for your region" in "Here are some of the popular protocols for your region."?
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12:54:19 <flo> I think clokep_work wanted to do that, with the rationale that users don't care that the list has been customized for their region
12:54:29 <Mic|web> I was about to say that.
13:05:55 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org denied review for attachment 1455 on bug 1391.
13:05:58 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1391 enh, --, ---, wnayes, ASSI, Suggest popular protocols during account creation
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13:18:15 <instantbot> bugi@media.fjmail.de set the Resolution field on bug 1078 to INVALID.
13:18:17 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1078 nor, --, ---, nobody, RESO INVALID, "Search add-ons" tab looks bad with the German locale
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13:19:36 <clokep_work> flo: Yes, we don't care about the "for your region" part.
13:20:13 <flo> FeuerFliege: has any Mozilla/Firefox de localizer been contacted about this issue?
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13:26:04 <FeuerFliege> flo: Hm, they were, but it isn’t a current problem for fx any longer since the addon manager isn’t a separate window anymore.
13:26:08 <clokep_work> Yes, I didn't like the terminology of "supported".
13:26:46 <FeuerFliege> on which gecko version will 1.2 be based?
13:28:43 <flo> likely 12 or 13
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13:40:48 <flo> is it possible to have a Gtalk account without a gmail account these days?
13:41:26 <clokep_work> It's all a "Google account" now, I believe.
13:41:31 <clokep_work> At least that's what all the pages say in the US.
13:41:58 <clokep_work> (Even when logging into Gmail it says "Google" everywhere, then redirects you back to Gmail I think.)
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13:42:45 <clokep_work> Yeah, the page mentions Gmail in places but where you actually log in it asks for your Google account information.
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13:46:00 <flo> clokep_work: http://adium.im/sparkle/?forceShow%255B%255D=model
13:46:00 <clokep_work> But if you want to keep it as Gmail I'll stop complaining. ;)
13:46:03 <clokep_work> I don't care that much.
13:46:19 <flo> err, http://adium.im/sparkle/?forceShow%255B%255D=model#IMServices
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13:47:01 <clokep_work> And it's probably accurate for en-US since the vast majority of the data is English?
13:47:12 <flo> I don't know :)
13:47:32 * clokep_work is surprised at how high ICQ is.
13:47:45 <flo> I'm surprised by the facebook position
13:47:48 <clokep_work> I was wondering if we should remove prpl-twitter from there in fact. :-S
13:48:09 <clokep_work> flo: Well...actually, you also need to consider the amount of people who have accounts on these services.
13:48:10 <flo> clokep_work: ICQ is very popular in Germany, Russia, and all the countries geographically between these two I think
13:48:31 <clokep_work> (I.e. if someone is using Instantbird for the first time and goes "Oh I have a Facebook account! Let me add it!")
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13:48:48 <clokep_work> Because those numbers only show how many people use that protocol *through Adium*.
13:49:01 <clokep_work> So if they're doing it tthrough the website, etc. we'd still want to consider it "popular".
13:49:29 <flo> clokep_work: my goal for that bug isn't to show only the protocols that people are almost sure to use, but to cleanup from that list the things that make no sense at all (not showing Gadu Gadu, QQ, etc... to Americans)
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13:49:49 <clokep_work> Then yes, add Yahoo!
13:49:50 <clokep_work> :)
13:50:01 <flo> clokep_work: I think most people know what "Twitter" is; enough to decide if they want to use it or not.
13:50:09 <clokep_work> True.
13:50:51 <flo> so what does http://adium.im/sparkle/?year=2012&week=*&graph=bar#lang mean?
13:51:09 <clokep_work> I find that website pretty awful btw...I'd really like to see "rawer" data...
13:51:25 <flo> that Macs are used mostly by Americans? That the adium localizations are so poor that people prefer to use the original version?
13:51:28 <clokep_work> Wait, it's "Default system language"...not necessary the language of Adium?
13:51:43 <flo> ah, right, thanks :)
13:52:29 <clokep_work> So probably that most Macs are used by Americans. ;)
13:52:44 <clokep_work> (Is that a true statement?)
13:52:50 <flo> there are too expensive for developing countries
13:52:54 <flo> *they
13:53:26 <clokep_work> True.
13:56:46 <flo> would be nice to get webcam support and be listed in that page http://www.google.com/talk/otherclients.html as the only alternative client that has a checkmark in all columns ;)
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14:00:16 <FeuerFliege> I can chat with GTalk users via Google+ and igoogle.de but I cannot use my Google account to login to GTalk via Instantbird
14:00:40 <flo> why?
14:00:40 <clokep_work> flo: Ah, we should get added on that anyway. I'll follow that link down the rabbit hole.
14:01:43 <flo> clokep_work: I've tried several times, but the form is broken for me. It asks me in French to select a language and a product for my request, and the language drop down is empty, and there's no product drop down
14:01:48 <clokep_work> Uhhh...that just brings you to a list of things that isn't helpful. :-S
14:02:15 <flo> heh at least you can get one step further than I do :)
14:03:04 <clokep_work> It's a bunch of things features and says "Suggest that!" and then a link to the forum...
14:04:55 <flo> the best way is probably to find a googler using Instantbird, and to have him/her contact someone internally :(
14:10:29 <FeuerFliege> Ah, i found the answer in the depth of Google help documents: A Gmail account is required to use GTalk with a third party client.
14:13:23 <clokep_work> Eh well I asked in: http://groups.google.com/a/googleproductforums.com/forum/#!category-topic/chat/im-a-developer/text-chat/downloadable-clients/Q1pxyHnsqNk
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14:15:17 <flo> :)
14:17:27 <clokep_work> FeuerFliege: Glad you figured it out. :)
14:17:37 <clokep_work> What page was that on? (Just to at least have it in logs for reference...)
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15:05:56 <clokep_work> Ah mconley just posted https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/workspace-for-thunderbird/ in #maildev, I wonder if we can port that to Instantbird.
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15:34:05 <flo> clokep_work: did you mean to add another comment in bug 1391 after the discussion we had a few minutes ago about including yahoo and the gtalk wording?
15:34:08 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1391 enh, --, ---, wnayes, ASSI, Suggest popular protocols during account creation
15:34:25 <flo> I would like wnayes to find the bug in an actionable state the next time he looks at it ;)
15:35:47 <clokep_work> flo: I thought you were going to. :) What was our final word use "Google" and include yahoo?
15:36:22 <flo> Include Yahoo. And I think "Gmail" per FeuerFliege's document that we haven't seen.
15:36:31 <clokep_work> Ah, right.
15:37:54 <clokep_work> Done. :)
15:38:44 <flo> I would still like to see that document though :)
15:41:35 <clokep_work> Yes, me too. :)
15:43:27 <Mic|web> http://support.google.com/chat/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=159495
15:44:16 <flo> Mic|web: thanks! :)
15:44:17 <FeuerFliege> yes Mic found it
15:44:48 <Mic|web> Well, I copy/pasted this sentence into Googles search field ;)
15:44:57 <flo> :)
15:46:54 <Mic|web> gtg, have a nice day
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17:08:45 <wnayes> Thanks for the feedback on the bug! I think I'll first have a chance to work on it late Saturday or Sunday, currently studying for one more final and packing at the same time...
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17:34:14 <clokep_work> wnayes: Sounds good, good luck!
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18:24:30 <FeuerFliege> link test: instantbird.com http://instantbird.com <http://instantbird.com>
18:24:55 <FeuerFliege> that is funny … and a bug
18:25:04 <clokep_work> FeuerFliege: I did confirm it already. :P
18:25:11 <clokep_work> Want to fix it please? :) I'll do the review.
18:25:17 <FeuerFliege> clokep_work: bug nummer?
18:25:37 <clokep_work> Did you not find it via the tracker?
18:26:08 <FeuerFliege> no, I noticed it in #firefox.de
18:26:53 <clokep_work> bug 1413 and bug 1414
18:26:54 <FeuerFliege> ah got it 1413
18:26:56 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1413 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, angle bracket-delimited URL linkified with closing bracket included in link and semi-colon appended 
18:26:57 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1414 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, linkification ends at opening square bracket in link
18:27:01 <clokep_work> I'd imagine those are from the same bug btw.
18:27:16 <clokep_work> I don't know if it's the way we're using the API or what we're putting into it or what though.
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21:15:05 <instantbot> clokep@gmail.com set the Resolution field on bug 1414 to INVALID.
21:15:09 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1414 nor, --, ---, nobody, RESO INVALID, linkification ends at opening square bracket in link
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23:04:29 <instantbot> florian@instantbird.org requested review from clokep@gmail.com for attachment 1463 on bug 1413.
23:04:31 <instantbot> Bug https://bugzilla.instantbird.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1413 nor, --, ---, nobody, NEW, angle bracket-delimited URL linkified with closing bracket included in link and semi-colon appended 
23:04:53 * flo feels like a fool re that bug :-/
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